Convince me that a brokered convention is the best scenario...

[fedup100]

When he drops out, his delegates become unbound; they cannot vote for him if he is not running.

If he goes 3rd party, he has to leave the Republican Party which means he will lose his House seat.

This is not true and that scenario was discussed on AJ with Lew Moore I believe it was Lew, or Jesse. Anyway, he said his wife will run in his place should he go 3rd party. I say third party. Even with a brokered convention, he will not have enough votes or delegates. I say third party, screw the republican party all the way to the wall and possible win the white house in the process.

 

[Churchill2004]

Paul doesn't have to officially drop out and lose his delegates to run Libertarian (As an aside, please refer to the party correctly, not "independent" or generic "third party"), nor does he have to give up his Republican house seat. He can be the Libertarian nominee and a registered Republican.

 

[Goldwater Conservative]

In my experience, the best way to convert people to supporting Paul is to talk to them on a personal level, dispel misconceptions, and explain to them how Paul is and always has been a true conservative. It's next to impossible to do that nationally, but if Paul has 100 delegates at the convention and it's brokered, each of them could sway 11 non-Paul delegates, probably in small groups, thereby getting him 1200 total and putting him over the top.

 

[Vet_from_cali]

so which 5 states are we going to win to participate in the convention?

 

[Drknows]

Don't forget this. We have to win 5 states to be eligible in the convention.

(b) Each candidate for nomination for President of the United States and Vice President of the United States shall demonstrate the support of a majority of the delegates from each of five (5) or more states, severally, prior to the presentation of the name of that candidate for nomination.

What he said.

a brokered convention is less likely than a 3rd party run.

 

[Pauls' Revere]

We go for a brokered convention as RP said he estimated it would come to that in his posts.

 

[noztnac]

In this election there is no advantage to having Republican next to your name. I say run Libertarian and try to get backing from Unity, Constitution, and Reform Parties. He can point to evidence of voter fraud as his reason for leaving. That will call today's results into question. The added bonus of running third party is that in guarantees we will keep war monger McCain out of the whitehouse. And it will prove to Republicans that if they screw the conservative base they only screw themselves.

 

[Goldwater Conservative]

so which 5 states are we going to win to participate in the convention?

Our best bet now is for all but one of the other candidates to drop out so we can snatch some late-season states when many people aren't paying attention anymore, given that there'd then be a presumptive nominee. There are still 15-20 states left, which means the clock is running out on that possibility.

 

[Pauls' Revere]

In a battle with British forces and his ship sinking beneath him, out-gunned, and out-numbered, the British Commander requested a full surrender from Captian Jones. His reply?

I HAVE NOT YET BEGUN TO FIGHT!
Captian John Paul Jones won the battle sinking the enemy man-o-war!

Never give up the ship!

 

[colecrowe]

SPREAD IT FAR AND WIDE (iNDY run bomb) - www.ronpaulwhitehouse.com: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=113132

Keep dreaming! Unfortunately we do not have enough money for a 3rd party candidacy

Perot only spent 65 million--look on wikipedia. What cost $65,000,000 in 1990 would cost $107,402,877.98 in 2007. source: http://www.westegg.com/inflation/infl.cgi

We would need probably 100,000,000

That is doable, especially considering this very limited anecdotal evidence...

my dad said he'd donate another 500 to Paul (IF he announces 3rd party) (he donated 200 on Dec. 16th--but that was when it seemed like he REALLY could maybe, possibly win the Nom. I would donate 500 the day he declares (even though it will hurt financially), whereas I can't afford to give anymore (I gave just over a 1,100 in Q4 to the cause--so shut up) for his Republican run; and gramps would probably wager another 1776.00

The 2nd and 3rd tier, broader-base of supporters aren't (many or most of them) going to donate MORE--if they already have once--because TO THEM it is obvious or at least nearly certain that he's not going to get the Nom from the Republican party (I'm not saying I believe that--but they DO). However, they would be very willing and enthusiastic about supporting him in an iNDEPENDENT run.

 

[blakjak]

Independent and Third Party are being used interchangeably in this thread. What's the advantages/disadvantages of each?

 

[colecrowe]

Independent and Third Party are being used interchangeably in this thread. What's the advantages/disadvantages of each?

iNDY not third party. Why is everyone stuck on Third Party? Libertarian = guaranteed no more that 8 or so %. Constitution = maybe 15%. The reasons for both of those results is very obvious if you just look at their wikipedia pages and consider not only their platform, but what people think of them, what comes first to their mind. Granted nobody knows what the Constituiton Party is, but look at the platform. Try getting a Dem with that. And Libertarian means repeal all drug laws, open borders, and abolish social security.

iNDY is perfect for Ron Paul, and perfect for a country that is fed up with parties, special interests, not getting what their promised, etc.

 

[colecrowe]

Paul has said repeatedly that he will not run 3rd party. Why would he lie to us like that?

No he hasn't!

He is absolutely right--and honest--to say that he "has no intention of going iNDEPENDENT or Third Party" because, right now (at least before today's results), his only intention is to win the Republican nomination. He 100% fully intends (or intended) to wholeheartedly run and try his best to win as a Republican while he is running as such, and he says so. He has NEVER, EVER said "I will not run iNDY". He has never, ever said "I will never run iNDY". But IF it becomes clear he cannot win the nomination, then he can go independent.

I would be very, very, very sad if he didn't go iNDY. He could win it, especially against Hillary (and she seems like the chosen one (it's all about the superdelegates).

Actually, I will say this... If it appears that the GOP will be utterly, hopelessly lost, as in completely abandoning constitutional and conservative ideals like protection of civil liberties, small, limited government, national sovereignty, and a non-interventionist foreign policy, then maybe Ron Paul and his 10% base that exists now should all sign up under the banner of a new coalition, maybe it could be a party, maybe call it the Conservative Party. That way we go into the contest for the General election with some orginization--and if it catches on maybe it could beat down the Republican Party that so many conservatives are fed up with. Also, any Ron Paul Republicans could join the Conservative Party (or whatever it is) and could run for Congress and state seats under its banner in the upcoming election, especially if they don't make it in their primaries.

We could create "the Conservative party" with our email, fundraising, and canvassing lists--and, of course, with our delegate lists. Although I still don't know if that would be better than iNDY. The reason I say that is because we might alienate the Libertarians and Constitution party folks, whereas we wouldn't if we went iNDY--but they are only like 4% of the voting public if that. "Conservative Party" (or another name possibly) would get us the Buchananites and many others I'm sure.

We WILL win iNDY.

 

[Goldwater Conservative]

iNDY not third party. Why is everyone stuck on Third Party? Libertarian = guaranteed no more that 8 or so %. Constitution = maybe 15%. The reasons for both of those results is very obvious if you just look at their wikipedia pages and consider not only their platform, but what people think of them, what comes first to their mind. Granted nobody knows what the Constituiton Party is, but look at the platform. Try getting a Dem with that. And Libertarian means repeal all drug laws, open borders, and abolish social security.

iNDY is perfect for Ron Paul, and perfect for a country that is fed up with parties, special interests, not getting what their promised, etc.

I agree that even if he decided to this he should do it as an independent, because people can't point to a party label and jump to conclusions. They have to actually read and know his platform to criticize it, and it'd be him as an individual human being leading a movement of similarly-minded but also individual human beings.

 

[colecrowe]

200,000 precinct captains, infomercials, and a 25 million dollar Independence Day money bomb!

Nobody is going to stop canvassing--no matter what. But almost everyone is hoping that if it becomes clear that he obviously can't get the Nom., he will go iNDY.

All I hear is yelling, and all I see is willful blindness, from the anti-iNDY folks.

Keep yelling. We however are hopeful for a Ron Paul whitehouse. We don't care if it is w/ out the GOP.

IF he doesn't do well enough in the next month or two, and then makes the calculated decision to run iNDY, and then declares say in March, and starts campaigning and runs a couple infomercials to pique some interest (emphasised because it's the most essential part), we could pick one perfect day, and make sure to have two months to plan it--and do everything in our power to make it better and bigger than the Tea Party. Independence Day would make so much sense--the country could declare it's independence from the parties, the special interests and lobbyists, the IRS, the Bankers, the Bush war and the Bush and McCain shamnesty, and the tax and spend Democrats--and we'd have 3 or however many months to prepare for it and drum up support. We could set a goal of 25 million in one day, and hope to shatter it. And then Ron Paul would have July, August, September, and October to spend it and raise more all along--while all along, for those 4 plus months, we could fill every precinct captain position and canvass and call every house--while Iraq continues exploding and the economy collapses.

 

[akalucas]

If Ron runs as a VP to McRombee, many people will ensure that the presidential line of succession is put to good use. I do not advocate this scary thought.

sorry, i meant vp to a 3rd party

 

[colecrowe]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starks
If Ron runs as a VP to McRombee, many people will ensure that the presidential line of succession is put to good use. I do not advocate this scary thought.

sorry, i meant vp to a 3rd party


Nobody would do that. Nobody would even think about doing that. STFU

 

[mkeller]

I think that iNDEPENDENT (just out of curiosity - why are we capitalizing it like that?) would be the way to go, if he loses the GOP nomination.

Libertarian would absolutely not be a good idea. If it's us, iNDEPENDENT, against McCain and Hillary, nearly all of Huckabee's supporters would vote for us (even if they think we're the lesser of three evils). However, conservative Christian folks are very biased against Libertarians. They don't understand them, and think that all they stand for is free drugs and sex. As a friend of my mom's said "I don't think I've ever heard anything good about a Libertarian." So we'd have to fight that mentality, too.

So I say - iNDEPENDENT - but only if we can't make the GOP nomination!

 

[Paul4Prez]

A brokered convention is pointless now. It's time to drop out, and consider a third party run.

 

[colecrowe]

The ratio of new donors to repeat donors (about 40% and INCREASING) means that his support is growing and growing. But, more importantly, I think it means that people are less and less willing to give more if they've already given once, twice, or five times (like myself, my father, grandfather, and army buddies)--unless he is going to go iNDY. I just can't afford it. But I could make myself afford another 500 or even way more if he went iNDY because I know he could win! (don't give me crap--I gave over $1,000 in Q4, as well as about 20-30 hours of canvassing and calling--I know not enough time, but I would do 3 times that when he declared iNDY because I have a much less demanding schedule now)