CFL State Organization Info

Being one of the people who's name is getting trashed in this thread and others on RPF, I guess I should set the record straight.

1) Please go to my blog at http://nickegorofforlandopoliticalactivist.blogspot.com/ and read up on the background of this story.

2) 90% of the CFL people I've talked with, are upset about Mark Cross's actions and want him removed. I have asked repeatedly for CFL National HQ to allow an election on who they want to lead the CFL org in Florida. Debbie Hopper (VP Membership), Jesse Benton (Sr. VP), and John Tate (President) have all said absolutely no elections. They say that until more of the 6000 Florida members of CFL give National HQ $35 a piece, there will be no elections. Sounds like a hostage ransom payment to me!

3) Recently Florida CFL County and Congressional District Coordinators set up a pole amongst themselves to vote on Mr. Cross's continued leadership. Sixty-six percent voted for his removal. The rest voted to reprimand him, but to give him a second chance.

4) The CFL organizer that set up this pole was also removed by CFL HQ. I have been banned for life from CFL activities. No rules or bylaws were cited that we broke.

5) The idea that I and others in the Florida CFL should just go find some other organization to join is not logical. Remember that it was money that we contributed to the RP for president campaign that paid for this org. It's as if we had donated money, had it used for a purpose that we did not intend, and finally being told to get lost when we protest.

6) Tate, Benton, and Hopper talk about building a bottom-up grassroots organization, the opposite appears to be the case. They will be the sole deciders of who is fit to lead the various organizations. Again, this is being done with OUR money, and against our wishes.

7) National HQ has also taken exception to my strong criticism that they are squandering money on high salaried staff that have so far shown little results. Wow, I can only hope that they can take criticism at least as well as the US government. Imagine our surprise if after chastising Congress for wasteful spending we had our voting rights revoked.

8) It is widely held amongst Florida CFL members that Mr. Cross had done a terrible job in his leadership in RP 2008 campaign (as State Coordinator). He is repeating the same lack of action in the new CFL org (again as State Coordinator). In neither position was his selection put up for a vote or even input from folks on the ground considered.

What is happening in Florida is of importance to other states considering the CFL model. What started as a good idea has ended as a nightmare in Florida. We are held hostage by bureaucrats in Virginia that want to protect their own appointed State Coordinator who is disliked by the people he rules over.

Campaign for Liberty, if it wants to hold true to its principles, needs to amend its behavior.

"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" Barry Goldwater in his 1964 Presidential Acceptance Speech
 
2) 90% of the CFL people I've talked with, are upset about Mark Cross's actions and want him removed. I have asked repeatedly for CFL National HQ to allow an election on who they want to lead the CFL org in Florida. Debbie Hopper (VP Membership), Jesse Benton (Sr. VP), and John Tate (President) have all said absolutely no elections. They say that until more of the 6000 Florida members of CFL give National HQ $35 a piece, there will be no elections. Sounds like a hostage ransom payment to me!

Actually, Nick, that doesn't appear to be the truth. Mark is an interim state coordinator and from what I'm reading on the C4L website, the election to replace the interim state coordinator appears to be based on the precinct leaders in each state, rather than the sheer number of members, as you say above.

The Role of the Interim State Coordinator

Interim State Coordinators for the Campaign for Liberty are appointed by the Campaign for Liberty. The Interim State Coordinator has the authority to name Interim District and County Coordinators. The focus of the interim coordinators will be to recruit and train Precinct Leaders. Interim Coordinators are chosen based upon previous leadership experience and the ability to encourage and train others, while being good stewards of the liberty movement, being respectful of others and acting in a professional manner.

Once a sufficient number of Precinct Leaders are in place to constitute a statewide organization, a Campaign for Liberty partnership may be formed and leadership will be elected by partner members.
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/kb.php

Ms. Hopper, right here on this website, told you the following:
"Interim Coordinators are chosen based upon previous leadership experience and the ability to encourage and train others, while being good stewards of the liberty movement, being respectful of others and acting in a professional manner.

Once a sufficient number of Precinct Leaders are in place to constitute a statewide organization, a Campaign for Liberty partnership may be formed and leadership will be elected by partner members."

In all of Florida, there are 83 Precinct Leaders. In the County where you were the Interim Coordinator, there are 6 - 4 that joined before you did and 2 after. Hardly enough to constitute a real statewide organization.

You were removed, not because you questioned anybody's authority but because you showed a decided lack of judgment in how you handled your disagreement with Mark, failing to show"respect of others" or "acting in a professional manner."

On top of that, you twisted the truth to suit your own purposes.

It's time to move on.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showpost.php?p=1929038&postcount=51

Why are you misconstruing the facts now? :(

And to be fair, here is the memo by John Tate (President of the C4L) regarding this issue that was sent out to all dues-paying members of Florida and that Ms. Hopper posted here, after as I recall, four separate threads were started on this issue.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=1922717#post1922717

And here is the blog post that Heath Whiteaker from Florida, wrote about this issue. It is titled, "Mark Cross may be a genius".
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/blog.php?view=9025
Apparently, he used to share your beliefs about Mr. Cross, but changed his mind as he got more information. One of the things he said was, "I was possibly one of the strongest critics about Mr. Cross' actions at the Chairman selection. I passed judgement without knowing all the facts. I passed judgement.... and I shouldn't have."

Campaign for Liberty, if it wants to hold true to its principles, needs to amend its behavior.
Nick, no offense, but does this apply to you too? Because as time goes on, it's starting to look more and more like a case of -- If I can't run it, I'll ruin it.
 
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Libertyeagle there is only one way to settle this. Have a free and open election now. Most people in Florida want it. But National opposes it because they know Cross would lose. Let the people speak through the ballot box.
 
Libertyeagle there is only one way to settle this. Have a free and open election now. Most people in Florida want it. But National opposes it because they know Cross would lose. Let the people speak through the ballot box.

They have told you why not, Nick. They want to have elections AFTER there is a decent base of precinct leaders.

Apparently you and the person whom Ron chose to be President of the C4L, do not see eye to eye on this. And it's unfortunate that because of how you chose to deal with this issue, you're no longer a member of C4L So, go do your own thing, Nick.. It's all about the grassroots anyway, right, and there is plenty of stuff to do in each of our states. The fact that you're no longer with C4L shouldn't stop you.

Again, it appears that Ron's appointee, John Tate, has decided this issue. It's done. Maybe it's time to move on.
 
Again, it appears that Ron's appointee, John Tate, has decided this issue. It's done.
On what authority? What rule did Nick violate? What by-laws set the standard for giving someone the boot? And how can national kick someone out of an independent state organization? :confused:
 
On what authority?
On Ron Paul's, I suppose. Ron is the one who chose John Tate to lead the C4L and it is John who made the decision.

What rule did Nick violate? What by-laws set the standard for giving someone the boot.
Read what John said. He told you why Nick was booted. Debbie reiterated.

And how can national kick someone out of an independent state organization? :confused:
Nick was kicked out of the C4L; not any independent thing you have going. These are two different things altogether.

You're not confused, Matt. You just want to complain. That's your choice of course, but don't act like it's due to some confusion on your part. Are you thinking that if you start enough threads on this, that they will change their decision? Be careful what you wish for, because your tactics just might backfire on you.
 
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On Ron Paul's, I suppose. Ron is the one who chose John Tate to lead the C4L and it is John who made the decision.
Yes but there has to be some rules for membership.





Read what John said. He told you why Nick was booted. Debbie reiterated.
They did not say which rule he broke or how it was decided to expel him. They did not say what it takes for someone to get expelled, nor did they cite what the process of this is.




Nick was kicked out of the C4L; not any independent thing you have going. These are two different things altogether.
So the FL-CFL is independent of the national CFL? If that's the case then how can the national CFL expell someone from a seperate and independent organization? :confused:

If the FL-CFL is not independent of the national CFL then what rules and by-laws is the organization based off of which would allow people to be expelled? :confused:


You're not confused, Matt. You just want to complain.
Incorrect. I'm very confused which is why I keep asking for by-laws and binding documents so that I can get straight. I don't want to be expelled from the CFL and I would like to know what qualifies as an offence that warrants expulsion.


Can they expel me because they don't like me?
Can they expel me because they don't like what I've said in the past?
Can they expel me because they disagree with me?
Can they expel me because I have long hair and a beard?

And can they expel me from the TN-CFL or just the national CFL?



Are you thinking that if you complain enough, that they will change their decision?
I don't think giving Nick and the other gentlemen the boot was justified nor an intelligent course of action that will benefit the greater movement. I'm sure you've figured out my opinion by now. But at this point I don't know how the leadership is even ALLOWED to expel anyone. What documents give them that authorization? What actions constitute an expulsion? :confused:
 
Matt, I suggest you go over to the C4L site and ask them there, directly.

They did not say which rule he broke or how it was decided to expel him.
Yes they did. Go back and read what John and Debbie said, again.

Incorrect. I'm very confused which is why I keep asking for by-laws and binding documents so that I can get straight. I don't want to be expelled from the CFL and I would like to know what qualifies as an offence that warrants expulsion.

Can they expel me because they don't like me?
Can they expel me because they don't like what I've said in the past?
Can they expel me because they disagree with me?
Can they expel me because I have long hair and a beard?

Matt, each of us is responsible for our own behavior and our actions. It's just a fact of life. If I were you, I'd be more concerned about some of the things you have said on this very forum of a sexual nature and also comments regarding Ron's granddaughter. Do you talk like that other places? Even though you deleted a good portion of them, internet archives abound.

Can they boot you? Well, C4L is a private organization, so I would imagine that YES, they could boot you out of the C4L anytime they chose. Your state organization does not need to partner with C4L, Matt. It is a CHOICE you will need to make.
 
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Matt, I suggest you go over to the C4L site and ask them there, directly.
I have posed this question to Debbie Hopper in a post she was replying to and she has ignored it.

Yes they did. Go back and read what John and Debbie said, again.
Give me the link.


If I were you, I'd be more concerned about some of the things you have said on this very forum of a sexual nature and also comments regarding Ron's granddaughter.
You just don't like my sense of humor which is fine, but quit lying about me talking about Mrs. Valori. I have not said anything about her.



Can they boot you? Well, C4L is a private organization, so I would imagine that YES, they could boot you out of the C4L anytime they chose
Under what by-laws, and what are the rules regarding this?
 
So the FL-CFL is independent of the national CFL? If that's the case then how can the national CFL expell someone from a seperate and independent organization? :confused:

If the FL-CFL is not independent of the national CFL then what rules and by-laws is the organization based off of which would allow people to be expelled? :confused:

Yes Matt this is where your confusion is. It seems that there is no such things as "state" cfl's. There is the Campaign for Liberty which is a nationwide nonprofit that has interim state coordinators to coordinate the CFL in each state for the CFL. The social networking site is further broken down.

If you want a state organization or if Florida wants a state organization, then you need to form it how you please then apply for affiliation with the CFL, as per the memo. It could be quiet conceivable that the head of your Tennessee organization might not be you ISC, in that case your head and the CFL state coordinator will have to work together to get things done.

--Dustan

BTW This is getting really tiring. I am not sure what you want, or that what you want is possible. I don't understand your obsession with the CFL. It is just a granfalloon. Find your karass and get to work.

If you wish to study a granfalloon, just remove the skin of a toy balloon.—Bokonon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granfalloon

karass - a group of people who, often unknowingly, are working together to do God's will. The people can be thought of as like the fingers that support a Cat's Cradle


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karass

-- Kurt Vonnegut
 
snipity-

If you want a state organization or if Florida wants a state organization, then you need to form it how you please then apply for affiliation with the CFL, as per the memo.

-snip

and herein lies the problem.

1.) the memo came out 1/9/2009 and was not circulated to all dues paying members of the national C4L, and many local orgs have been forming without the benefit of this memo.
2.) the actions by the FL non-existent C4L "interim state coordinator" is not supported by the memo.
3.) the dues paying members who were excommunicated are in the process of forming a state org but have been undermined by national C4L.

C4L National is competing with the grassroots for political influence rather than allowing the grassroots to conduct business as it sees fit. If national is going to run the show like this, there needs to be rules in place that govern its conduct in the political arena. Rules each dues paying member and/or ally of the org must adhere to.

I am done with this issue. The damage is done, there will be no remedy for the people hurt, and it doesn't look like there is any support or activity in my area. Typical politics as usual. Wake me up again when the liberty movement is ready to move.
 
You just don't like my sense of humor which is fine, but quit lying about me talking about Mrs. Valori. I have not said anything about her.

I am saving this out. lest you try to delete it later.

Matt, you have just made a bold-faced lie.
 
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Matt, you have just made a bold-faced lie.
Then please tell me what I said about Mrs. Valori. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that you have alleged. I don't even know the girl, I've never met her. But having met other members of the Paul family she is probably a great person.
 
there needs to be rules in place that govern its conduct in the political arena. Rules each dues paying member and/or ally of the org must adhere to.
EXACTLY!

There needs to be a clear understanding by way of binding documents which outlay the rules for both the national CFL, the States, and the members.

Why hasn't this happened? :confused:
 
Then please tell me what I said about Mrs. Valori. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that you have alleged. I don't even know the girl, I've never met her. But having met other members of the Paul family she is probably a great person.

It's apparent Matt lives in his own reality. Even though thousands of members read his lewd posts, he denies ever saying anything. Priceless.
 
If you want a state organization or if Florida wants a state organization, then you need to form it how you please then apply for affiliation with the CFL, as per the memo.
That makes no sense. Why would one set up an organization then try to get national recognition then to only find out that the way you set it up was incorrect or the people at HQ don't like it?!?! Why not just set it up how like the national organization wants it to begin with?




I am not sure what you want
Clear rules and binding documents as to guide direction in my state. Oh, and also to have our two fellow patriots in Florida reinstated.
 
Then please tell me what I said about Mrs. Valori. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that you have alleged. I don't even know the girl, I've never met her. But having met other members of the Paul family she is probably a great person.
Matt, a few months ago you went back and deleted many of your more distasteful posts. Did you actually believe that you also deleted them from our memory?

This is where it was.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=151653

This pretty much sums it up.

nattcollins.jpg
 
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But the joke wasn't about Ron's granddaughter was it?

Scroll up. Do you see the word "granddaughter" in the screenshot included?

Do you have a problem understanding how to read, in addition to your difficulty in distinguishing between humor and lewd comments?
 
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