Cassis plays 'truther' card in new ad attacking Bentivolio

[LibertyEagle]

No, notice I said "a lot of them" which |= "all of them". Please pay more attention.

You do not own this movement, Collins. How dare you proclaim who belongs and who does not!!

 

[angelatc]

"Because a lot of them don't have tact." - Matt "Handshake" Collins

Yeah, I've seen the GOP scrambling away from the Christian right because the Westboro Baptist nuts make all of them look bad.

You ever see the GOP leaders go into the churches and tell the pastors that they need to boot the fundamentalists out of the party? Uh, no. And that's exactly what the Collins just did. He walked into the house that the truthers pretty much built, and announced they're no longer welcome.

PS: LE, you're a genius. I'd give you +20 rep.

 

[green73]

Those aren't theories, those are facts; historical facts.

*facepalm*

 

[FSP-Rebel]

Sad thing is this whole truther thing not only belittles a liberty candidate in republican eyes it also sticks a wedge w/i the liberty community. We need to bury this hatchet and all move forward together while not digging in our heels on either side of the term. I have no prob discussing certain issues hovering in the so-called truther arena but it doesn't seem very productive straying from the real issues of constitutionalism when networking in GOP circles. Of course, I always try to talk to the level of those I'm trying to convert and/or get on board w/ whatever candidate I'm pushing so it would also make sense to speak slightly differently to progressives. That said, I've been hopped up on pain meds via surgery the last few days and may not be thinking as clearly as I should. Tho, I'm just interested in us all working together and not being embarrassed by not putting forth the efforts to push our candidates forward.

 

[jmdrake]

I know that's awesome!

But why hand them ammo? The video in the OP is an example of making it easy for the opposition to find something against you.

I would no more advise a candidate running in a conservative republican primary to do "metal rock" than I would advise him to be in the video in the OP. That said, both of these things were done when neither was a candidate and I don't see either as having an effect on the race. If Steve Dickerson loses and Kerry Bentivolio wins what are you going to say?

But the difference is that is provable which means it's not a theory.

That's what all conspiracy theorists say.

Those aren't theories, those are facts; historical facts.

See above. One man's conspiracy theory, another man's "provable historical fact". It's a provable historical fact that people within out government purposefully thwarted pre 9/11 investigations that could have prevented the 9/11 attacks. And the sad fact is, you know this.

 

[jmdrake]

It is necessary. I can't even count how many times they have called me a "sheep", or controlled opposition, or a troll, or an undercover agent, all because I suggested maybe their conspiracies weren't true.

These people are like a plague on the liberty movement. They may have been an asset 5 years ago, but they're not anymore.

Okay. Let's get rid of everyone that's ever said anything derogatory about anyone else. Are you willing to lead the charge exit?

 

[jmdrake]

Sad thing is this whole truther thing not only belittles a liberty candidate in republican eyes it also sticks a wedge w/i the liberty community. We need to bury this hatchet and all move forward together while not digging in our heels on either side of the term. I have no prob discussing certain issues hovering in the so-called truther arena but it doesn't seem very productive straying from the real issues of constitutionalism when networking in GOP circles. Of course, I always try to talk to the level of those I'm trying to convert and/or get on board w/ whatever candidate I'm pushing so it would also make sense to speak slightly differently to progressives. That said, I've been hopped up on pain meds via surgery the last few days and may not be thinking as clearly as I should. Tho, I'm just interested in us all working together and not being embarrassed by not putting forth the efforts to push our candidates forward.

+rep! This is all much ado about nothing. We give the enemy power when we make a big deal out of their attacks. We are our own worst enemies.

 

[Matt Collins]

You do not own this movement, Collins. How dare you proclaim who belongs and who does not!!

Uhhh again, go back and reread what I wrote. I never said certain people don't belong in this movement. Please quit putting words in my mouth.

 

[Matt Collins]

And that's exactly what the Collins just did. He walked into the house that the truthers pretty much built, and announced they're no longer welcome.

Actually no, see the previous post.

 

[Matt Collins]

It's a provable historical fact that people within out government purposefully thwarted pre 9/11 investigations that could have prevented the 9/11 attacks. And the sad fact is, you know this.

Yes, but that does not equate to "the government orchestrated 9/11". Again, provable fact vs theory.

 

[kathy88]

Uhhh again, go back and reread what I wrote. I never said certain people don't belong in this movement. Please quit putting words in my mouth.

Geez LE give him a break. He doesn't want to kick them out. He just wants to control what they say. Freedom.

 

[Perry]

And this my friends is why we MUST shed the conspiracy element of the movement. Why give ammo to the other side to be used against us?

I agree. After we shed the conspiracy wing of the movement we need to dump the pot smokers, anarchists, raw milk people and finally the religious.
Then...THEN we would have the perfect movement....and there would be nobody left. Good thing you aren't making any decisions.

 

[AuH20]

I think Collins has a point. The hardcore 911 truthers certainly shouldn't be kicked out, but given their zeal for unadultured rhetorical flourishes, I think they should either tone it down or stay in the back of the crowd. Modern day politics is such a zero sum game with such a tiny margin for error, that you can't have promising candidates blowing up their campaigns over catastrophic slip-ups like that. That isn't logical nor productive.

 

[Sam I am]

I could be wrong, but that is what I recall. I listened to Jones back then and I remember him talking about the need to come up with a term that he viewed as positive, rather than letting others assign a name. From what I remember, the term, Truthers, was decided upon.

If you have evidence to the contrary, ok. That's just what I remember.

What I do know is that the term "Truther" is just a riff on the fact that the movement called itself "911 Truth". You don't need someone to "coin" the word "truther" because it's a fairly obvious name for a member of the "911 Truth" movement.

 

[jmdrake]

Yes, but that does not equate to "the government orchestrated 9/11". Again, provable fact vs theory.

It doesn't matter. To the minds of those who would smear you it still equates to "truther".

 

[kathy88]

I think Collins has a point. The hardcore 911 truthers certainly shouldn't be kicked out, but given their zeal for unadultured rhetorical flourishes, I think they should either tone it down or stay in the back of the crowd. Modern day politics is such a zero sum game with such a tiny margin for error, that you can't have promising candidates blowing up their campaigns over catastrophic slip-ups like that. That isn't logical nor productive.

And how do you propose the movement stifles their freedom of speech, with is directly opposite of what we stand for?

 

[Matt Collins]

And how do you propose the movement stifles their freedom of speech, with is directly opposite of what we stand for?

No one is saying that anyone should stifle anyone else's freedom of speech. However shunning that type of discussion, making those topics taboo, and ostracizing those who refuse to have tact about conspiracy theories is the way it should be done.

 

[AuH20]

And how do you propose the movement stifles their freedom of speech, with is directly opposite of what we stand for?

I'm not advocating the stifling of free speech. I just wouldn't have a very outspoken 911 truther running my campaign.

 

[angelatc]

I think Collins has a point. The hardcore 911 truthers certainly shouldn't be kicked out, but given their zeal for unadultured rhetorical flourishes, I think they should either tone it down or stay in the back of the crowd. Modern day politics is such a zero sum game with such a tiny margin for error, that you can't have promising candidates blowing up their campaigns over catastrophic slip-ups like that. That isn't logical nor productive.

But look at the context of the conversation.

OP: "The opposition is lying again, and calling Bentivolio a truther!"

MHC: "This is why we have to move away from the truthers!!!"


This is regard to one of our best chances at a win, mind you. The little man who brags bout bein' schooled in all things politics didn't suggest anything constructive. He's already blaming the truthers for costing us the seat.

 

[Matt Collins]

This is regard to one of our best chances at a win, mind you. The little man who brags bout bein' schooled in all things politics didn't suggest anything constructive. He's already blaming the truthers for costing us the seat.

Hey look, you are lying again.

I never said it's going to cost the seat. I said that it is damaging.