Brokered Convention Strategy 2 - Based on WV outcome

[Eleutheros]

I have been reading these forums daily and thinking about how realistic the possiblility of Ron Paul getting the nomination. In reading, I have come to 2 conclusions:

1. It is just as important to vote against the greater of two evils (as opposed to the lesser of two evils--there is a difference) as it is to vote for Ron Paul

2. The strategy of Huckabee giving Paul 3 delegates in exchange for Paul delegates securing Huckabee the win in WV was spot on. I commend him for doing that.

Based on the above 2 conclusions, the thread started by No1butRonPaul was very much on point, and should be implemented, but using the WV strategy on a larger scale wherever possible. Otherwise at this point, McCain will have secured the nomination, period pointblank. Don't look at a vote for Romney or Huckabee as voting for the lesser of two evils, but rather, voting against the greater of two evils (read: McCain). At this juncture, we cannot afford to do that.

If we had implemented a similar strategy between Romney and Huckabee voters/delegates in previous states, not only would Paul have actually won several states, but the likelihood of a brokered convention would've been all the more greater.

I am not saying that by doing this, Ron Paul will get the nomination, but it will lend more credibility to his campaign by securing wins, AND it will level the playing field until the 2nd round of voting at the Convention, which is what we have been seeking since Day One, meaning the nomination will truly be determined by delegates---UNBOUND delegates.

We can still do this in the remaining states, but such a strategy as this needs to go viral VERY QUICKLY.

Bottom line, we need to swallow our pride and work with Huckabee and Romney supporters, or not only will Paul lose, so will the GOP, and ultimately the country (Do you really want McCain to get the nomination?)

Let's swallow our pride for now and compromise for the sake of a bigger ROI.

 

[Sarge]

Huck paid us back by saying he didn't give us any delegates.

I don't trust any of them to keep their word now.

 

[Eleutheros]

Huck paid us back by saying he didn't give us any delegates.

I don't trust any of them to keep their word now.

That was a stupid move on his part; he is just more ensuring that McCain gets the nomination, and him not having any chance at all.

OTOH, if he was promised a VP slot if McCain won the nomination, then the above is probably a moot point.

 

[Redcard]

The REAL funny thing is, the "Brokered Convetion" thing works only if we infiltrate other delegate bases.

And yet, we think Huck is being "bad" by promising us delegates and then taking them back after he gets what he wants.. aren't we doing the same thing? Promising to vote for one guy, but when we're unbound, voting for OUR guy?

 

[No1ButPaul08]

It's not about keeping word or anything like that. It's about stopping John McCain so we have a brokered convention

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=114659

 

[akalucas]

i think this is a good idea because we MUST have a brokered convention, which means stopping McCain from getting more delegates. He needs about 500 more and if he moves toward that too fast im afraid Huckabee and Romney will quit and thus breaking our dream of a brokered convention.

 

[Redcard]

Something else to note, and this is important.. if Huckabee or Romney wants a VP spot, and has enough to put McCain over.. then he'll do it.

Our strategy should be to stop McCain, yes.. but we have to also make sure that we can hold back Huck and Mitt so they can't put McCain over.

 

[Eleutheros]

The REAL funny thing is, the "Brokered Convetion" thing works only if we infiltrate other delegate bases.

And yet, we think Huck is being "bad" by promising us delegates and then taking them back after he gets what he wants.. aren't we doing the same thing? Promising to vote for one guy, but when we're unbound, voting for OUR guy?

The message I have learned from this primary election is "ANYTHING GOES". And until we get a brokered convention, that is exactly what is going to happen. Let's make it work to our advantage.

ETA: If you have an idea which can prove to be more effective, state your case. Because nothing we have tried has worked to secure us a win in ONE STATE.

 

[LarryWhite]

Huck paid us back by saying he didn't give us any delegates.

I don't trust any of them to keep their word now.

I'll say it again, this was an agreement between STATE supporters, not NATIONAL campaigns. Huckabee national didn't know anything about it, they are much like us, the grassroots is essentially running the show. Huck STATE people are very respected people in this area and we have no reason to not believe they'll keep their word.


If you want to do this at the national convention, work it out amoungst the DELEGATES themselves, not the campaigns. National campaigns only have power if the state supporters give it to them.

 

[No1ButPaul08]

Something else to note, and this is important.. if Huckabee or Romney wants a VP spot, and has enough to put McCain over.. then he'll do it.

Our strategy should be to stop McCain, yes.. but we have to also make sure that we can hold back Huck and Mitt so they can't put McCain over.

If that's the case, we must force this option. Do not underrate a convension speech

 

[Redcard]

I'll say it again, this was an agreement between STATE supporters, not NATIONAL campaigns. Huckabee national didn't know anything about it, they are much like us, the grassroots is essentially running the show. Huck STATE people are very respected people in this area and we have no reason to not believe they'll keep their word.


If you want to do this at the national convention, work it out amoungst the DELEGATES themselves, not the campaigns. National campaigns only have power if the state supporters give it to them.

Got news for ya.

At the national convention, they are bound the first vote to vote for Mike Huckabee. They're his delegates. The only way they unbind is if he drops out, and then they're still likely to do what he wants.

You guys got gamed.

 

[No1ButPaul08]

The message I have learned from this primary election is "ANYTHING GOES". And until we get a brokered convention, that is exactly what is going to happen. Let's make it work to our advantage.

ETA: If you have an idea which can prove to be more effective, state your case. Because nothing we have tried has worked to secure us a win in ONE STATE.

I'm waiting for a better idea. If not, this needs to go viral, NOW

 

[Eleutheros]

Something else to note, and this is important.. if Huckabee or Romney wants a VP spot, and has enough to put McCain over.. then he'll do it.

Our strategy should be to stop McCain, yes.. but we have to also make sure that we can hold back Huck and Mitt so they can't put McCain over.

That is why WE NEED TO WIN STATES!! We need Romney and Huckabee to "kingmake" us at the state level. Those states we win (especially winner take all states) are taking away delegates from Romney and Huckabee so that they cannot kingmake McCain.

In other words, they cannot kingmake McCain with delegates that WE have.

 

[parocks]

Huck paid us back by saying he didn't give us any delegates.

I don't trust any of them to keep their word now.

I heard that he didn't know about the deal, that it was done on the ground in WV.
Apparently we have 3 of our names on the Huckabee delegate list - it was done that day.

We've been the ones who have been caring the most about getting our people as delegates.

 

[parocks]

The REAL funny thing is, the "Brokered Convetion" thing works only if we infiltrate other delegate bases.

And yet, we think Huck is being "bad" by promising us delegates and then taking them back after he gets what he wants.. aren't we doing the same thing? Promising to vote for one guy, but when we're unbound, voting for OUR guy?

He didn't take em back.

 

[parocks]

i think this is a good idea because we MUST have a brokered convention, which means stopping McCain from getting more delegates. He needs about 500 more and if he moves toward that too fast im afraid Huckabee and Romney will quit and thus breaking our dream of a brokered convention.

YUP


***************************
Goal #1 - Stop McCain

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=114659

Excellent detailed analysis of Brokered Convention / Situational Voting / STOP MCCAIN

 

[Redcard]

That is why WE NEED TO WIN STATES!! We need Romney and Huckabee to "kingmake" us at the state level. Those states we win (especially winner take all states) are taking away delegates from Romney and Huckabee so that they cannot kingmake McCain.

In other words, they cannot kingmake McCain with delegates that WE have.

Yes, but we can.

So if they kingmake us, (which they won't), won't that be giving US the in to the Whitehouse?

Look, what you're saying is contradictory.

In one sentence, you say that Romney and Huckabee need to kingmake us. Make us win delegates.

The next sentence, you say that if they do that, we take delegates away, so they can't kingmake.

Why do you think they are going to give us delegates? It does NOTHING for their interests to give Ron Paul delegates. Nothing. Do you think they're better served if this convention goes brokered? News flash.. if this convention goes brokered, then one of them will kingmake on the spot.

Huck has probably figured out that he's not going to make it. His goal now is to spoil Romney, and try to possibly get in the VP position.

Romney can still catch McCain, so his goal is to focus on McCain and at the same time not let Huck poison the well.

None of these candidates gain anything by giving delegates to Dr. Paul. For Huck, it costs him a shot at VP. For Romney, it costs him the shot at President.

 

[Redcard]

He didn't take em back.

Yeah, well, his campaign says that the deal doesn't happen.

So I'll believe him, since he's holding the delegates.

 

[parocks]

Got news for ya.

At the national convention, they are bound the first vote to vote for Mike Huckabee. They're his delegates. The only way they unbind is if he drops out, and then they're still likely to do what he wants.

You guys got gamed.

We know that already.

First vote, yes, they're bound to Huck. It's either a brokered convention or it isn't.

When they become unbound, after the first vote, then they can vote for Ron Paul.

 

[LarryWhite]

Got news for ya.

At the national convention, they are bound the first vote to vote for Mike Huckabee. They're his delegates. The only way they unbind is if he drops out, and then they're still likely to do what he wants.

You guys got gamed.

If that's true, then no one was gamed, because the same rules would have applied to the Romney deal. We didn't make an agreement to have 3 of their delegates vote for Paul, the agreement is 3 Huck delegates RESIGN and they are replaced with 3 Paul delegates.

This crap about the first round of voting and bound/unbound isn't an issue unless Ron Paul wins 5 state's majority of delegates, if he doesn't do that he's not on the ballot in the first round anyway. If he does make it on the ballot in the first round, we will vote for him regardless of the consequences.

This gets Ron Paul people to the national convention, not to mention all the free press about the agreement, and we hurt Romney.

Romney was the one who was gamed in WV.