Ben Carson on Torture, Common Core, Illegal Immigration, Ferguson, and the IRS

[Xenliad]

http://dailycaller.com/2014/12/11/b...mmature-and-stupid-to-release-torture-report/

Likely Republican presidential candidate Ben Carson said Thursday evening that it was “immature and stupid” for the Democratic-led Senate Intelligence Committee to make public a report this week detailing CIA interrogation methods during George W. Bush’s presidency.

“Putting out this report at a time when we’re in a war with ISIS is the height of absurdity,” Carson said during a tele-forum with supporters on Thursday night. “Because all it does is provide the enemy with a wonderful recruiting tool.”

The report, which Republicans have strongly contested, specifically details how the CIA used interrogation techniques, like water-boarding, on detainees.

“The tools that we use to fight war really should be not up for public discussion,” Carson, a former neurosurgeon, said. “And many of those tools should be covert things. And we don’t need to be broadcasting everything we’re doing. That is just so immature and stupid.”

As he prepares for a likely run for the White House in 2016, Carson answered questions about a myriad of issues from dozens of callers. Several participants told the political novice they would support him if he runs for president in 2016, something Carson acknowledges he is preparing for.

Asked his thoughts on education, Carson told one questioner: “I don’t think that things like Common Core are the way to go.”

Asked about illegal immigration, he said: “As far those that are here already, you have to recognize that they got here on their own, and they can certainly leave here on their own. If you make it illegal to hire someone who is illegal and make it a criminal act, I think you won’t see a lot of that going on.”

Asked about recent events in Ferguson, Mo., he said: “We can never have an honest conversation as long as people back themselves into their respective corners and throw hand grenades at each other. So I think that people, particularly in the minority communities, are going to have to admit that thuggish behavior is thuggish behavior. Don’t canonize these people and try to make them into saints. Because they’re not. And I think the police… Are there some bad apples? Of course. There are bad apples in everything…But the vast, vast majority are not and they need our support.”

Asked about areas of government he’d like to do away with, he said: “I’d like to see the IRS eliminated. That means we have to reform and vastly simplify and make fair the tax code.”

Asked about the inevitable criticism that he doesn’t have enough political experience to run for president, he said: “I would simply say to them: ‘How much experience did Joe Biden have?’ A lot. Think he would make a great president?”

Asked about studying up on issues ahead of a presidential run, he said: “Yes, we indeed have a number of people we’ve been consulting to get up to speed in a variety of different areas. And I actually find it kind of fun. I don’t have to learn nearly as much as I had to learn for neurosurgery.”

Bolded for your convenience.

 

[jmdrake]

Okay. That's disappointing from Carson regarding torture. And I'm tired of people pretending that this information is somehow new. The only new thing in the torture report is that we paid two men 80 million to come up with this crap. I think Carson's going out of his way to court right wingers and is tripping over himself doing it. He flubbed the 2nd amendment question twice and now he doesn't want conservative critics to have any ammo. And on Ferguson? That was a semi balanced approach. He's right that both sides are wrong for going off in their corners and "throwing grenades." And he's right that there are "bad apples" in the police department. Where he drops the ball is in neglecting to say the same standards of justice should be applied to all. And there are cases of police brutality where the victim isn't a thug like the Eric Garner case or the Miriam Carey case. Bringing up Miriam Carey would be a way to appeal to conservatives and blacks as the same time.

Anyway, glad Rand supports transparency when it comes to torture. http://www.politico.com/story/2014/12/cia-torture-report-republicans-react-113432.html

 

[NIU Students for Liberty]

And now can people here finally stop throwing their panties at this guy?

 

[Christian Liberty]

Okay. That's disappointing from Carson regarding torture. And I'm tired of people pretending that this information is somehow new. The only new thing in the torture report is that we paid two men 80 million to come up with this crap. I think Carson's going out of his way to court right wingers and is tripping over himself doing it. He flubbed the 2nd amendment question twice and now he doesn't want conservative critics to have any ammo. And on Ferguson? That was a semi balanced approach. He's right that both sides are wrong for going off in their corners and "throwing grenades." And he's right that there are "bad apples" in the police department. Where he drops the ball is in neglecting to say the same standards of justice should be applied to all. And there are cases of police brutality where the victim isn't a thug like the Eric Garner case or the Miriam Carey case. Bringing up Miriam Carey would be a way to appeal to conservatives and blacks as the same time.

Anyway, glad Rand supports transparency when it comes to torture. http://www.politico.com/story/2014/12/cia-torture-report-republicans-react-113432.html

I didn't know Carson felt this way about torture, but I ruled him out as a potential option (however unlikely he may have been otherwise) because of that.

Rand fortunately took the right position on this, and received flack for it. If he had taken the wrong position, I would not have supported him either. Torture isn't something I'm willing to compromise even a little bit on.

 

[specsaregood]

Okay. That's disappointing from Carson regarding torture. And I'm tired of people pretending that this information is somehow new. The only new thing in the torture report is that we paid two men 80 million to come up with this crap.

the thing about torture is; if its ok to use in the "war on terror" then it should be ok to use in every single interrogation room in the US for every single crime.

 

[Christian Liberty]

And now can people here finally stop throwing their panties at this guy?

I never did. I did think he was better than most. But now I know he's just another thug Republican that worships country over God.

 

[Tywysog Cymru]

I'm disappointed, he was right about the war on terror 10 years ago when every Republican was worshiping Bush.

 

[jmdrake]

I didn't know Carson felt this way about torture, but I ruled him out as a potential option (however unlikely he may have been otherwise) because of that.

Rand fortunately took the right position on this, and received flack for it. If he had taken the wrong position, I would not have supported him either. Torture isn't something I'm willing to compromise even a little bit on.

Do you know that Rand back in 2010 made the following statement regarding military tribunals?

"But what I'm fearful of is...that Khalid Sheik Mohammed we didn't do all the right things maybe...in the way he was apprehended...or the way we do things in civilian court...I'm afraid if we take things things into civilian court...and a judge says you did these things...tortured him or whatever you did to him...and his confession is thrown out...and I think that's a problem".

Here is the video.



I sat on this information during his senate race because a moderator here asked me to. I came to the conclusion that statements like this were part of Rand's "Court the teocons" strategy and I gave him a pass. I did begin to openly question the strategy and I caught hell here for it. Since then I think I've been vindicated. A lot of people are uncomfortable about how Rand Paul Inc is run but grudgingly go along, as I go along, in the hopes that our belief that he's stringing the teocons along and not us is justified. I'm glad now that he's willing to take categorical statements against torture, but he didn't do that in 2010. I'm not trying to sour you on Rand. I am saying that as a movement we have to be consistent. Maybe Ben Carson is trying a similar strategy? In fact he probably is. I read the comments from this article and they were almost 100% positive except for a couple of people who I could tell are Rand Paul supporters. (One posts here). And there arguments were all "He hasn't been 100% on the second amendment." Okay. Rand wasn't 100% on torture back in 2010 either.

Of course the big difference is Rand ran for senate first so we got to see what his actual voting record would be first. If Carson was serious about politics he'd run for something smaller first too. I believe he's running an educational campaign, but at this point I'm not sure what he wants to teach. My suspicion his that he really wants a platform so that people can know his religious beliefs. If Ben Carson is still in the running when the Iowa straw poll and caucuses come around, I suspect the term "Seventh Day Adventist" will be high on Google's list. It's like people became very interested in learning about Mormons when Romney became the top contender.. I can see why that alone would be incentive to someone like Ben Carson to run for president.

 

[specsaregood]

"But what I'm fearful of is...that Khalid Sheik Mohammed we didn't do all the right things maybe...in the way he was apprehended...or the way we do things in civilian court...I'm afraid if we take things things into civilian court...and a judge says you did these things...tortured him or whatever you did to him...and his confession is thrown out...and I think that's a problem".

Okay. Rand wasn't 100% on torture back in 2010 either.

I see nothing in that quote that endorses or excuses torture. Torture wasn't even the main topic of the conversation, but rather a list item in how using civilian courts as an after thought could be a bad thing. To use that to imply that Randal has changed his position on torture in some way is disingenuous.

 

[jmdrake]

I see nothing in that quote that endorses or excuses torture. Torture wasn't even the main topic of the conversation, but rather a list item in how using civilian courts as an after thought could be a bad thing. To use that to imply that Randal has changed his position on torture in some way is disingenuous.

Nothing in Ben Carson's quote endorsed torture. He just criticized releasing the report. Rand said he had a "problem" with testimony taken from torture being barred from use in trial. The main recourse you have against police misconduct is barring the evidence obtained by that misconduct at trial. So it's disingenuous to try to pretend there's this huge moral difference between what Rand Paul said and what Ben Carson said. I sincerely doubt that if Carson had said "We should allow military tribunals because civilian courts won't allow testimony from torture", which is what Rand Paul in effect said, that you'd be giving Ben Carson a pass o that. And I doubt if Rand Paul had said "We don't need to be broadcasting everything we do to the world" in response to the torture report you'd be attacking Rand over that. Both statements are ambiguous. Neither support nor attack torture.

Edit. And Rand was incorrect in his implication that military tribunals allow testimony from torture. The are actually stricter o that than civilian courts. But the average teocon is too ignorant to know that. I believe Rand was playing a game, a potentially dangerous game, when he made that statement. But I could be wrong. He might have been ignorant about military tribunals as well.

 

[Occam's Banana]

“Putting out this report at a time when we’re in a war with ISIS is the height of absurdity,” Carson said during a tele-forum with supporters on Thursday night. “Because all it does is provide the enemy with a wonderful recruiting tool.”

Torturing people is what "provide the enemy with a wonderful recruiting tool" - NOT issuing reports about it after the fact!

If you don't want to "provide the enemy with a wonderful recruiting tool" THEN STOP TORTURING PEOPLE, DAMMIT!

Oh, but wait ... I forgot ... we're not supposed to talk about this kind of thing ...

“The tools that we use to fight war really should be not up for public discussion,” Carson, a former neurosurgeon, said. “And many of those tools should be covert things. And we don’t need to be broadcasting everything we’re doing. That is just so immature and stupid.”

"Warning, Citizens! It is not permitted to question the methods of Our Wise Overlords!"

 

[specsaregood]

Nothing in Ben Carson's quote endorsed torture. He just criticized releasing the report.

Ok, good thing I didn't say he did and implied no such thing. I didnt' even mention carson.

Like I said, torture wasn't even the focus of the discussion and was not even the main bullet point. In no way did Randal endorse torture in that statement.

I don't think it necessary to disparage or imply anything negative to Randal in order for you to defend Carson here. He was vague enough for you to do that. I haven't attacked Carson, he really isn't my cup of tea but he doesn't really matter enough to me to bother attacking him. I just hope he endorses Randal when the time comes.

 

[jmdrake]

Ok, good thing I didn't say he did and implied no such thing. I didnt' even mention carson.

Like I said, torture wasn't even the focus of the discussion and was not even the main bullet point. In no way did Randal endorse torture in that statement.

I don't think it necessary to disparage or imply anything negative to Randal in order for you to defend Carson here. He was vague enough for you to do that. I haven't attacked Carson, he really isn't my cup of tea but he doesn't really matter enough to me to bother attacking him. I just hope he endorses Randal when the time comes.

What I'm saying is that both Carson and Paul have done the same thing. And if this was any other politician I wouldn't give them a pass and I doubt you would either. And for the record, I never said Rand changed his position as you did imply. I said that he gave a categorical refutation of torture recently, and I think him for it, but that's not the tune he was singing in 2010. I do not at all think I was wrong for being concerned about that statement when I first heard it. In fact I'm sure I wasn't wrong. I support Rand at this point because his track record since then has been 180 degrees away from the idea that blocking testimony from torture is somehow a "problem." Carson doesn't have a track record yet. If he ran for senate first...who knows? And lastly, I was responding to FreedomFanatic who had specifically contrasted Rand's position on the torture report with Carson's position. In that context looking at everything Rand said on torture is 100% valid.