Gary Johnson Be Libertarian With Me

[trey4sports]

Does he genuinely care about Americans?

I don't know. I don't research him. But I do assume I can trust him more than the Republicans and Democrats.

What's his record?

2 term gov. of NM and was really known nationally for his opposition to the drug war. He is not as much of a philisophical candidate as Ron Paul but i think he's still a pretty damn good choice.

 

[DerailingDaTrain]

I think some might disagree:
"Children who willingly participate in sexual acts have the right to make that decision as well, even if it's distasteful to us personally. Some children will make poor choices just as some adults do in smoking and drinking to excess. When we outlaw child pornography, the prices paid for child performers rise, increasing the incentives for parents to use children against their will." -- Mary Ruwart

Underlined- I can understand her saying that.
Bold- I don't know where the hell she went with this sentence. Can someone attempt to explain her logic?

 

[rockandrollsouls]

Unless you have a mathematical proof at hand, don't bother arguing with Travlyr. He makes false statements, is thrown off guard when you present information to the contrary, and contends his opinion is fact until you write a book on the subject.

I'm still waiting for him to show me evidence that GJ raised taxes, isn't against the fed, expanded government, etc etc. He can't.

it is true AT THE VERY LEAST on a small scale.

think about drawing out a chart of this data.

The amount of revenue the gov't will recieve with a 90% tax rate, the amount of revenue from a 10% tax rate and the revenue from a 1% tax rate. Obviously the highest point of the chart would be a 10% rate. That is the basis of the laffer curve, however, it is generallly applied with much smaller variation. I.E. comparing revenue at 25, 30, and 35 percent as opposed to the more common sense example i talked about.

Just because this is TRUE doesn't mean that there aren't a whole lot of other issues involved with taxation. The left would push to tax the hell out of the rich regardless of what it does to revenue, and folks like myself believe it is completely immoral to tax wealth so the revenue issue is moot.

 

[Oddone]

Revolution 2? Seriously? uh...

 

[Feeding the Abscess]

I think some might disagree:
"Children who willingly participate in sexual acts have the right to make that decision as well, even if it's distasteful to us personally. Some children will make poor choices just as some adults do in smoking and drinking to excess. When we outlaw child pornography, the prices paid for child performers rise, increasing the incentives for parents to use children against their will." -- Mary Ruwart

The logic in that statement is irrefutable. Disagreeing with that is disagreeing with the libertarian idea of ending the drug war.

 

[ZakB]

"When we outlaw child pornography, the prices paid for child performers rise, increasing the incentives for parents to use children against their will." -- Mary Ruwart
I think the reasoning here is while making it illegal would effect the overall number of children involved, it would skew the type of children in porn from voluntary participants to parents forcing them against their will as the price increases from restricted supply.

I've been trying to reason why this might occur and here's what I've come up with:
Assumption: There are children who would voluntarily participate only if child pornography were legal and there are parents willing to force there children into child pornography (regardless of whether or not child pornography is legal) if the price for their service goes high enough.

Therefore, if the supply is restricted to only those willing to do it when its illegal the price will rise as supply experiences a leftward shift making it more likely the child is participating because their parents are forcing them than their own free will.

Counter arguments: This analysis also assumes that parents willing to force their children are more sensitive to compensation they will receive than children who would participate of their own free will regardless of illegality.
Parents that would force their kids to participate only if child pornography were legal are neglected (That's probably reasonable since forcing your kid would be illegal and therefore the difference in perceived risk and consequences is small)
This whole thing also ignores the idea that children ages 15-17 would probably compete with 18-21 year olds who I think its safe to assume would keep the price lower than the parents would demand for forcing their teenagers. For younger children, I can't see there would be many if any at all that would volunteer only if it were legal. But I suppose that's just my opinion.

 

[Travlyr]

Unless you have a mathematical proof at hand, don't bother arguing with Travlyr. He makes false statements, is thrown off guard when you present information to the contrary, and contends his opinion is fact until you write a book on the subject.

I'm still waiting for him to show me evidence that GJ raised taxes, isn't against the fed, expanded government, etc etc. He can't.

Exactly. My opinion is that Gary Johnson, as Governor of New Mexico, built two new prisons.
http://www.santafenewmexican.com/SantaFeNorthernNM/prisonclayton--ready-

It is my opinion that the Libertarian Candidate for President, Gary Johnson of New Mexico, privatized 1/2 of the prisons in New Mexico.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8D204yiWzs

And it is my opinion that Gary Johnson reduced taxes 14 times and magically grew New Mexico's government efficiently. It is great. ... otherwise known as "Good Government"
http://www.tax.newmexico.gov/All-Taxes/Pages/Home.aspx
Taxes... lots of taxes.

 

[cheapseats]

...child pornography...

...is a problem in America. America has SURPLUS SEXUAL DEVIANTS. Ron Paul Forums also has LIBERTINES jumbled up with LIBERTARIANS.

Child pornography is a very real issue, but it is a STRAW MAN with regard to Libertarianism...as surely as LEGALIZED HEROIN was a straw-man argument against Ron Paul.

 

[cnaw]

Paul isn't ever going to endorse somebody that doesn't recognize life as beginning at conception, not gonna happen.
and
Yeah, just as we have started taking over entire state GOP organizations, thats the time to bail out.
and
why would one waste their time and efforts on a failed GJ campaign when we have LOTS of liberty candidates on the ballots that need support? you go right ahead, but I won't be joining you.

I'm not a Libertarian; I have no desire to legalize child porn.

I have an odd feeling that you're trolling, but on the off chance your're not... well trolls need to eat too.

Using child porn as an excuse to whittle away our freedoms (that we have left) is frankly, imo, reprehensible. It's "Think of children" taken to an extreme, and feeds on the emotions of parents everywhere. There are people out there who would (and may have) use just the mention of child porn to ram through legitionlation to monitor online activies of anyone. Lets look at some examples of child porn stupidity:

FBI posts fake hyperlinks to snare child porn suspects
In this example, the FBI posted links to "child porn" that if clicked, the clickers would get a nice armed knock on their door. There was no child porn in the files. I wonder if the system could detect the diffrence between a true peodofile and an automated spidering service. And what would happen if a true pedofile was using an unsecured residential wifi connection to access? Yup, some innocent resident would get a knock on the door that they will never forget. From the article "Vosburgh was charged with violating federal law, which criminalizes "attempts" to download child pornography with up to 10 years in prison." Whats the diffrence between an attempt and a mistake?

What happens if someone sends you to a link that is described as a photo of an awesome new car..... and instead the link goes to a child porn photo? How can your prove that you didn't mean to click on that link? And of course, now you are in possession of child porn. If a hacker changes your friend's facebook photo to some child porn, now all his friends will be in possession of child porn as well. Be prepared for a knock on your door.

Child porn legistlation is just a way to give more powers to a police state. No one normal is for child porn ( i find the thought of it disgusting) but equating Libertarians to peodophiles is equally disgusting.

Though i guess it's not as bad as saying that Libertarians want to legalize heroin... but thats a rant for another day.

 

[specsaregood]

Though i guess it's not as bad as saying that Libertarians want to legalize heroin... but thats a rant for another day.

exactly my point. this is the image people have of the LP.

 

[jemuf]

That was a very good ad. I can't believe I came across it 10 minutes after Rand endorsed Romney. Hmm....

 

[Indy Vidual]

It's a good message.

That's actually a great ad. Impressive.

"1776 kicks 1984's ass"

Liked the part about after four years if we don't like peace and prosperity we can vote tyranny in once again.

Great ad. I think it's about time we threw our support behind this guy, who is actually going to be on the ballot this November.

That was a nice surprise.

 

[Indy Vidual]

...
I don't want more prisons. That is not liberty...

Agreed.

...
...and I sure as hell don't want them privatized...

Today's private prison system can be compared to slave labor, especially if the inmates were convicted of victimless crimes.

• How does the An-Cap argument for private prisons sound, what do they say?

If you can be certain the inmates are 'real criminals', then perhaps a private company can compete to be the best at education, reform, and getting them to work for a living?

 

[muh_roads]

I'm on board with you Gary. Fuck Rand.

 

[falconplayer11]

As far as I can tell, Ron and Rand have given up on their principles in favor of "uniting" with the GOP. Gary, however, does not care about party lines and would never endorse Mitt Romney.

I seriously think it's high time we considered Gary Johnson in 2012.

 

[Feeding the Abscess]

As far as I can tell, Ron and Rand have given up on their principles in favor of "uniting" with the GOP. Gary, however, does not care about party lines and would never endorse Mitt Romney.

I seriously think it's high time we considered Gary Johnson in 2012.

No thanks, I don't want to fund Israel's defense.

 

[Paul Fan]

That was a weird ad. The soundtrack was good and the visuals were great in the beginning and end. But the middle part, alternating Gary and war images, was very odd. At first I actually thought the guy sitting on the couch was one of the warmongers because that is what would make sense from the context. It would be good if that could be fixed somehow. Maybe make the alternation stronger ie a fuzzy static in between each change so it is more like a guerilla TV station taking over.

 

[Liberty_Mike]

No thanks, I don't want to fund Israel's defense.

Do you honestly think Gary would continue foreign aid to Israel? I really don't think so.

 

[BSU kid]

I'm for Gary, you know the "liberty movement" has more branches then just Ron...Gary is not my favorite branch, but he is better then voting for a complete and utter statist like Mitt. I love Ron, so this hurts...but it must be done, the RNC has shown its true colors time and time again. Even Rand, has been corrupted by their neo con ideas...and I just can't stand for that.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Gary Johnson supports invading Uganda. stop pretending hes libertarian.