[Article] Overpopulation and the Right to Childbearing

[ProIndividual]

I suspect it is not, and he is right.

No, on both points. He said this to me in a plus rep comment: "Yeah, it was ... practicing my closed borders argument so I can fit in".

So, it was sarcasm, and no we do not increase tyranny to cure other tyrannies...we also don't give someone with AIDS more AIDS to cure their AIDS.

 

[euphemia]

My point about Japan, a place that has a very high population density is that when governments stop taking all the assets and allow their population the freedom to be creative and produce food, goods, and services, then you have a sustainable way of living. Governments in Africa are obscenely wealthy, but they do it by never allowing people access to the resources of their land. People die for lack of clean drinking water. Africa has water, but governments don't allow for any kind of infrastructure so that water can be transported any distance for people or crops. Africa has the resources to support a wonderful agrarian economy in most parts of the continent. Small farms would need big families to help work the land.

 

[Voluntarist]

xxxxx

 

[nobody's_hero]

It is not the poor, sparsely populated areas that are of concern. It is a place like Japan. They have over 120 million people crammed into a place the size of California, and most of the land is uninhabitable and inarable. As creative as they are, they have forced on themselves a lifestyle that is unstustainable. They are not able to produce enough food for their own people, so they overfish waters of other nations and import food that is very expensive. They are not reproducing at a replacement level, so when the check comes due for all the people who will eventually retire, they will be in big trouble. They have insanely long lifespans there.

Our planet can sustain a much larger population than we currently have. You could fit every person on the planet in the state of Texas. Unfortunately, big government has imposed regulations that penalize generating food, income, and shelter for everyone. This planet has resources to be able to sustain more people, but government gets in the way.

Texas would instantly become the shittiest place in the world to live, lol.

But I'll admit that what I define as 'overpopulation' has a lot to do with personal preference, more than scientific argument. I'm the sort of guy who gets depressed when a dirt road gets paved or a developer builds a neighborhood of houses 3 feet from each other, which all look the same.

That, and from what I've seen, there's a tendency for people to become more supportive of big government as population density increases. It's easier to keep track of cattle when they're crammed in the same pen, rather than dispersed across the meadow. Those are just my observations. I know that in reality I won't be able to shield myself from the coming unrest by living way out in the middle of Bumfuck, No-where. Those times are fading fast.

My idea of:

Heaven:

Hell:

 

[paleocon1]

Let people have all of the kids they want, PERIOD. Allow no one EVER a tax paid subsidy for their offspring, PERIOD.

 

[Voluntarist]

xxxxx

 

[PaulConventionWV]

It is not the poor, sparsely populated areas that are of concern. It is a place like Japan. They have over 120 million people crammed into a place the size of California, and most of the land is uninhabitable and inarable. As creative as they are, they have forced on themselves a lifestyle that is unstustainable. They are not able to produce enough food for their own people, so they overfish waters of other nations and import food that is very expensive. They are not reproducing at a replacement level, so when the check comes due for all the people who will eventually retire, they will be in big trouble. They have insanely long lifespans there.

Our planet can sustain a much larger population than we currently have. You could fit every person on the planet in the state of Texas. Unfortunately, big government has imposed regulations that penalize generating food, income, and shelter for everyone. This planet has resources to be able to sustain more people, but government gets in the way.

You could fit them in a much, much smaller area than one the size of Texas. In fact, if you want to really squeeze, the world's population can fit inside Jacksonville, Florida... twice.

I find it really interesting that you say the world can sustain many more people than it currently has, and yet you think Japan is in trouble... why? Are there statistics showing that, although the world can sustain its population, Japan is just TOO small to be able to do that? Why do you think this? From what I can tell and from what you've acknowledged, they're doing rather well. Even with all those people crammed into that space, they have one of the most technologically advanced societies on this planet and insanely long lifespans. How could this be if they are so overcrowded as you presume? California has about 1/4th that population with approximately the same land area, but it's easy for anyone to see that California still has vast uninhabited areas, so why do you think Japan is in such trouble, especially considering how well they're doing? Sure, paying for the retirees might cause a bump in the road, but that has nothing to do with not being able to provide. It's simply an unexpected burden that will be taken on and, eventually, overcome.

 

[PaulConventionWV]

That is one of the most dangerously ignorant articles I have ever read. How in hell does he or anyone else know whether a fetus is a so-called "person"? How does he know whether a fetus has subjective experiences and what their nature might be such that they are not valid?

What a scummy, ignorant, I'll-adept chump.

I rather agree. He just straight up claims that it's a fact that a fetus is not human and this mindless conjecture is supposed to save him from having to even give it any thought. He just decided that a fetus is not the same as a normal human and that settles it. No evidence, no inquiry, just a blind statement of putrid, stinking ignorance and idiocy. How can someone with any intelligence bring themselves to arrange black letters on a white page in such a way as to give the impression that they believe the simple assumption that a fetus is not a human will automatically save them from having to think about other possibilities.

 

[PaulConventionWV]

As long as you are not paying their bills that is not your concern. BTW, it will not be possible for the civilised world to feed every baby africa and the moslems can breed. Eventually THEY will EAT us if we let them.

Why do you think that's not possible? What's the evidence to back up these stupid assertions? More importantly, why do people keep making them and thinking ignorance is acceptable?

 

[Occam's Banana]

You could fit every person on the planet in the state of Texas.

Texas would instantly become the shittiest place in the world to live, lol.

But I'll admit that what I define as 'overpopulation' has a lot to do with personal preference, more than scientific argument. [...]

It has everything to do with personal preference (subjective value) and nothing at all to do with "scientific argument."

If everyone alive on the planet today moved to Texas (or any area of the same size), the population density would be about equal to that of New York City - which is around 27,000 per square mile. Just for comparison, the population density of Manila is about 111,000 per square mile. So while you and I might think that Texas under such circumstance would become the shittiest place in the world to live, many Manilans might strongly disagree - and New Yorkers might not even notice the difference at all ...

 

[osan]

No, on both points. He said this to me in a plus rep comment: "Yeah, it was ... practicing my closed borders argument so I can fit in".

So, it was sarcasm, and no we do not increase tyranny to cure other tyrannies...we also don't give someone with AIDS more AIDS to cure their AIDS.

Not sure I understand this response, but if I'm reading it right, then you completely misunderstood my response.