Anyone else here a left-leaning libertarian?

[jamesmadison]

A "right" is something that you can legitamely use force to enforce. If biology says you need sex does that make it ok to get it by force?

Biology doesn't say you need sex, maybe you should take a biology course at a local university. Honestly, your arguments are horrible.

 

[xao]

Ok. So when Mexico comes and invades your land - go take your gun and defend yourself against Mexican tanks.

Most states already have tanks, jet fighters, service men and women, and militias.

 

[murrayrothbard]

Well, if the state promotes the liberty of individuals I would disagree with you that it is predatorial in fashion. You have to justify things you say, otherwise I will not respond to them. There is nothing logical about your arguments.

You see.

You have rich people who may live a better life than others. You have a government that protects rich people. The rich people pay the government for protection. Without the government the poor would disapprove of this inequality. The rich would be murdered. The money redistributed. The government is not stealing from the liberty of the rich, it is GRANTING THE RICH LIBERTY.

If the state (a group of individuals) takes by force from one individual, and gives it to another it is predatory against the first by definition. What's hard about that?

 

[jamesmadison]

Most states already have tanks, jet fighters, service men and women, and militias.

Hmm.. I wonder what we spent all that money on during the cold war.

 

[jamesmadison]

If the state (a group of individuals) takes by force from one individual, and gives it to another it is predatory against the first by definition. What's hard about that?

It's a hired bodyguard. Not too difficult to understand.

 

[constituent]

Uh.. you have government dollars that are come from wealthy and are redistributed for the healthcare of poor. You have companies compete over these government dollars and the one that affords the most care for the least amount of money you award them. No one suffers from universal healthcare.

People suffer from not having healthcare and dying.

you're kidding right?

government dollars are printed out of thin air, stolen from your wallet and our childrens' futures.

 

[murrayrothbard]

Biology doesn't say you need sex, maybe you should take a biology course at a local university. Honestly, your arguments are horrible.

But it could. It's an example. What if it is "discovered" that you "need" sex. Surely some schools of psychology already claim this. So isn't it then a basic necessity? By your theory of rights, this justifies rape. Nothing complicated or illogical about this.

 

[jamesmadison]

you're kidding right?

government dollars are printed out of thin air, stolen from your wallet and our childrens' futures.

It's your choice to hold government dollars.

 

[jamesmadison]

But it could. It's an example. What if it is "discovered" that you "need" sex. Surely some schools of psychology already claim this. So isn't it then a basic necessity? By your theory of rights, this justifies rape. Nothing complicated or illogical about this.

No, go get an education.

 

[murrayrothbard]

It's a hired bodyguard. Not too difficult to understand.

I bodyguard is hired to "guard", not steal.

 

[murrayrothbard]

No, go get an education.

No you are educating me. Basic necessities are rights and required for freedom, per your previous statements. IF sex was determined to be a basic necessity, then your theory justifies rape. It is very clear. Where am I wrong?

 

[LibertyOfOne]

Biology, basically.

You need food.
If you're sick, you need care.

Otherwise you're dead.

It's simple. I'm not sure what is so difficult to grasp.

What gives you the right to rob from another to provide for someone else? Taxation no matter how you slice it is theft. You don't even understand what the word right means. So if someone does not want to work we should be forced by law to provide for said individual? What would the penalty be for someone who refuses to pay for such? Jail? Death? You end up pushing for something that robs people of their liberty and justly acquired property. Rights are something you are born with and are not something some bureaucrat can grant. Whether or not someone respects those rights they are still yours. Rights are derived from self recognized axioms. I own my body, therefor no one else has a higher claim to it. I own my time, therefor no one else has a higher claim to my wealth. In order to provide said "basic care" you have to violate the rights of others. Rights are not determined by government irregardless of the official titles bureaucrats give themselves.

 

[jamesmadison]

No you are educating me. Basic necessities are rights and required for freedom, per your previous statements. IF sex was determined to be a basic necessity, then your theory justifies rape. It is very clear. Where am I wrong?

It's not a necessity.

 

[jamesmadison]

What gives you the right to rob from another to provide for someone else? Taxation no matter how you slice it is theft. You don't even understand what the word right means. So if someone does not want to work we should be forced by law to provide for said individual? What would the penalty be for someone who refuses to pay for such? Jail? Death? You end up pushing for something that robs people of their liberty and justly acquired property. Rights are something you are born with and are not something some bureaucrat can grant. Whether or not someone respects those rights they are still yours. Rights are derived from self recognized axioms. I own my body, therefor no one else has a higher claim to it. I own my time, therefor no one else has a higher claim to my wealth. In order to provide said "basic care" you have to violate the rights of others. Rights are not determined by government irregardless of the official titles bureaucrats give themselves.

I already explaind this.

 

[murrayrothbard]

It's not a necessity, you idiot.

I didn't say it was! The claim is simple:

IF sex was a necessity (the fact that many psychologists would already say it is is irrelevant) THEN your theory of rights justifies rape. Is that not true?

 

[jamesmadison]

I didn't say it was! The claim is simple:

IF sex was a necessity (the fact that many psychologists would already say it is is irrelevant) THEN your theory of rights justifies rape. Is that not true?

No, it's not.

 

[murrayrothbard]

No, it's not.

Why not?

If food is a necessity it is legitimate to take someone else's.
If "health care" is a necessity it is legitimate to force someone else to provide it.

You already made these claims.

So it quite obviously follows that:

If sex is a necessity it is legitimate to force some else to provide it (aka rape).

Simply saying no doesn't really work. Why is this not correct?

 

[xao]

Hmm.. I wonder what we spent all that money on during the cold war.

I wonder too. What a waste. If we were on the gold standard instead of the fed reserve scam-system and saved properly and responsibly my guess is that we wouldn't have ran up so much money to make nukes. It's not like we needed 50 thousand of them. The states combined could work of Reasearch and Developement, as well as production. There are many different ways this could be funded.

 

[anotherone]

Ok. So when Mexico comes and invades your land - go take your gun and defend yourself against Mexican tanks.

Federal income tax is only 40% of our national budget. We must have a strong military, I agree.

 

[jamesmadison]

Why not?

If food is a necessity it is legitimate to take someone else's.
If "health care" is a necessity it is legitimate to force someone else to provide it.

You are made these claims.

So it quite obviously follows that:

If sex is a necessity it is legitimate to force some else to provide it (aka rape).

Simply saying no doesn't really work. Why is this not correct?

Ok. The human body is made up of cells, cells contain mitochondria - mitochondria take glucose and convert it into adinosine tri phospate - atp is basic currency of energy for the cell. a human requires ATP to live, it's a thermodynamic equation. a human also requires h2o and various vitamins and minerals. it's basic cellular biology and a course at a universe would really clear it up for you.

A human that is loosing blood rapidly will die if he does not get a transfusion. this is a function of oxygen supplied to the brain and other body organs through hemoglobin found in red blood cells.