An African American defends Rand Paul on Civil Rights Act position

[RSLudlum]

I just emailed Elizabeth Wright asking her to comment on the segment.

Here's her blog: http://issuesviews.blogspot.com/

 

[cswake]

Whoa... look at this drivel:

This was a major hole in Barry Goldwater's argument in his seminal book, "Conscience of a Conservative" that is the primary source citation by modern-day conservatives making such arguments. Sen. Goldwater failed to consider the rights of those discriminated against and weigh whose rights were superior and worthy of protecting and many conservatives keep right on making that very same mistake.

 

[Bman]

Well, his official site says

·What's Oteil's birthday?

August 24, 1967 --a Virgo

Could be he's trying to shave off a few years to look more attractive to the ladies. Wouldn't be the first musician I've seen use this ploy for some extra in out action.

 

[BlackTerrel]

That or his wiki is wrong.

Wiki is never wrong

 

[Bman]

Whoa... look at this drivel:

That is complete drivel. I think Oteil's letter spells out exactly why. Not only is the business owner losing his right to decide who he does business with. The patron is also losing his ability to decide if he wants to do business with such people.

 

[Romulus]

Like I said, this attack is only going to fall back on Maddow and the left. It will educate and enlighten.

 

[Romulus]

http://www.oteilburbridge.com/

 

[Ninja Homer]

Wow, if that really is Oteil Burbridge, the campaign should get in touch with him to see if he'd do a press release or something. He knows what he's talking about, and it would immediately put an end to this line of attack.

Regardless, Rand needs to tackle this head on, and soon. Explain how he's in favor of private property rights and the free market rather than government intervention. Explain how the free market would take care of the problem better than the government. How long do you think it would be before a restaurant would be out of business if they openly segregated? There was no need for the Civil Rights Act to infringe on private property rights, because the free market would have taken care of it.

 

[FunkBuddha]

I've heard this same argument from several older black men. They said that prior to '64 they knew who the racists were and they preferred it that way so that they could avoid those establishments.

If you ever get a chance to sit down with an older black man or woman and talk to them about what life was like for them growing up, I highly recommend doing it. It's always been a valuable experience for me.

Also, if you think you know how to play Spades or Dominos and you've never played with a table of black folks, you're not as good as you think you are. Anytime I've ever played with black people its like they are on a whole different level.

 

[TheeJoeGlass]

Someone please contact him to make sure it's legit, so we can change the title of this thread.

I'm pretty sure it's legit, though. How will make up this stuff so quickly?

I want to know if its fake, why choose that guy? Like he is a well known person? Now I am just curious.

 

[Ninja Homer]

follow-up posts from Oteil

"Cracker means racist. I'm just calling a spade a spade.

And by the way Pavana I toured the deep south in 15 passenger vans in the 1990's and believe me you better know where to not be out of gas ahead of time anyway. And yes I do think that King would have let Rand Paul march with him. King and company were about coalition building. Rand Paul said he agreed with 9/10ths of the Civil Rights Bill. Everything is so hyper divided nowadays. King was a Republican for Christ's sake.

And Don Quixote, I guess I assumed that if they had a "whites only sign" on their restaurant than they were in effect wearing their Swastika on their sleeve anyway.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think the real racists will always alienate themselves from true Libertarians because they are really against individual freedom for all. And I think that Rand Paul is a true Libertarian. I hope he doesn't prove me wrong. I've always liked his dad.

Let me leave you with another thought. I don't mean this to be a direct analogy but jut something to ponder. Say I invest my life savings in my longtime dream and open a restaurant, then 10 Klansmen come in with full regalia on. Should I be forced to serve them? What if I have little old Black ladies eating there who can "remember when"?

Shalom,

ob"

______________________

"Lee, I never said it would be better for private businesses to "re-institutionalize" racism. Your fear that every single business would automatically "revert to being racist" is disproved by the fact that you have a black President. The numbers aren't what they used to be. And again, I would rather my children not support a racist business than "feel" like they can go anywhere. My kids are gonna know damn well that there are certain places they can't go because of the color of their skin, like a Klan rally. The reality is that both whites and blacks have places they can't go today and be safe because of the color of their skin. I don't want my kids being that naive. I would tell them the same thing I'm gonna have to tell them anyway, "Those people are filled with hate, you don't want to eat there anyway."

If you think I don't have to put up with racism because I'm "successful" that you need to go and talk to Skip Gates. I have experienced more racism in television, movies and music business than you realize. I am 45 man. It was a covert racism that I experienced in Washington DC and I prefer mine out in the open.

Saying that my support for big gov't staying out of our private businesses is as damaging as the diehard klansman is intellectually irresponsible. Die hard klansmen of yesterday had the full weight of a racist executive, judicial, and legislative branch behind them. What does the modern day Klansman have to support him comparatively? We have limited institutionalized racism to the point of electing Obama. Plus, we (Blacks) can own guns now. The playing field is quite different. And Rand Paul is far from a Klansman.

Lastly, I am not "downplaying" any part of the Civil rights movement, I am merely disagreeing with part of it in principle. And only in the sense that it is a different scenario now. We Blacks have many more choices now than we used to. How long do you think a "whites only" business would last in a city like D.C or Atlanta? Let's get real. This is starting to feel more like a theological debate.

And Input Thought Output Project you sure have made a giant leap from a Libertarian viewpoint to a "separatist Ideology". Holy mackerel maybe your brain has already exploded. You said that "You'd change your tune pretty quick if you lived in an area where all private establishments had the right to not serve you." You forget than in the 21st century I have the choice to live in a different area. Why do you want your kids to have to swim with crackers that hate them? That's why they made the pool PRIVATE, cause Blacks can go to the PUBLIC beach now.

And neither of you answered the question about being forced to serve Klansman in your restaurant.

Shalom,

ob"

________________

Seriously, the campaign should reach out and get in touch with him.

 

[ashura]

This guy's awesome!

 

[Bergie Bergeron]

How long would a whites only business last in South Carolina?

 

[Cowlesy]

"Cracker means racist. I'm just calling a spade a spade.

And by the way Pavana I toured the deep south in 15 passenger vans in the 1990's and believe me you better know where to not be out of gas ahead of time anyway. And yes I do think that King would have let Rand Paul march with him. King and company were about coalition building. Rand Paul said he agreed with 9/10ths of the Civil Rights Bill. Everything is so hyper divided nowadays. King was a Republican for Christ's sake.

And Don Quixote, I guess I assumed that if they had a "whites only sign" on their restaurant than they were in effect wearing their Swastika on their sleeve anyway.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think the real racists will always alienate themselves from true Libertarians because they are really against individual freedom for all. And I think that Rand Paul is a true Libertarian. I hope he doesn't prove me wrong. I've always liked his dad.

Let me leave you with another thought. I don't mean this to be a direct analogy but jut something to ponder. Say I invest my life savings in my longtime dream and open a restaurant, then 10 Klansmen come in with full regalia on. Should I be forced to serve them? What if I have little old Black ladies eating there who can "remember when"?

Shalom,

ob"

______________________

"Lee, I never said it would be better for private businesses to "re-institutionalize" racism. Your fear that every single business would automatically "revert to being racist" is disproved by the fact that you have a black President. The numbers aren't what they used to be. And again, I would rather my children not support a racist business than "feel" like they can go anywhere. My kids are gonna know damn well that there are certain places they can't go because of the color of their skin, like a Klan rally. The reality is that both whites and blacks have places they can't go today and be safe because of the color of their skin. I don't want my kids being that naive. I would tell them the same thing I'm gonna have to tell them anyway, "Those people are filled with hate, you don't want to eat there anyway."

If you think I don't have to put up with racism because I'm "successful" that you need to go and talk to Skip Gates. I have experienced more racism in television, movies and music business than you realize. I am 45 man. It was a covert racism that I experienced in Washington DC and I prefer mine out in the open.

Saying that my support for big gov't staying out of our private businesses is as damaging as the diehard klansman is intellectually irresponsible. Die hard klansmen of yesterday had the full weight of a racist executive, judicial, and legislative branch behind them. What does the modern day Klansman have to support him comparatively? We have limited institutionalized racism to the point of electing Obama. Plus, we (Blacks) can own guns now. The playing field is quite different. And Rand Paul is far from a Klansman.

Lastly, I am not "downplaying" any part of the Civil rights movement, I am merely disagreeing with part of it in principle. And only in the sense that it is a different scenario now. We Blacks have many more choices now than we used to. How long do you think a "whites only" business would last in a city like D.C or Atlanta? Let's get real. This is starting to feel more like a theological debate.

And Input Thought Output Project you sure have made a giant leap from a Libertarian viewpoint to a "separatist Ideology". Holy mackerel maybe your brain has already exploded. You said that "You'd change your tune pretty quick if you lived in an area where all private establishments had the right to not serve you." You forget than in the 21st century I have the choice to live in a different area. Why do you want your kids to have to swim with crackers that hate them? That's why they made the pool PRIVATE, cause Blacks can go to the PUBLIC beach now.

And neither of you answered the question about being forced to serve Klansman in your restaurant.

Shalom,

ob"

________________

Seriously, the campaign should reach out and get in touch with him.

Wow.

 

[georgiaboy]

brothers and sisters, unite! turn it around on the liberal collectivist division-makers.

 

[Paulitical Correctness]

Bump. It's good to read this kind of thing when emotions are running high.

 

[RSLudlum]

Elizabeth Wright responds

Elizabeth Wright, of www.Issues-Views.com and the American Conservative Magazine, responds to the CRA issue in reference to Burbrigde's comment:

I recieved this in reply to an email I sent asking her thoughts. She gave me permission to post it:

Shawn,

Thanks for the link, but I happened to have read the text of
Burbridge's statement in your forum. I must say I agree with 99% of
what he says. The 1% left over is due to his antagonism towards those
he calls "racists." A prejudice is simply an attitude, which every
human being has the right to hold. In fact, we cannot help but hold
some prejudices. I don't consider prejudice immoral. As long as one
is not abusive to the target of the prejudice, there's no reason for
vilification by talking about "Klan Hoods." This implies a certain
ugliness about the prejudiced person that is not necessarily so. And
it also sounds like whining on the part of the black who uses such
terminology.

However, as to the rest of his message, he is on target. Those whites,
like Barry Goldwater, who opposed the Civil Rights Act had every good
reason to do so. It and other laws that followed were as
unconstitutional as anything could get. The basic notion of granting
blacks the right to full citizenship made sense, but creating laws
designed to foist blacks upon others, and into places where they were
not wanted, to make up for the past, was downright injurious to all of
us. These laws actually removed the rights of one set of citizens,
while exalting the rights of another set. And made this a sacred
cause. This did great damage to blacks themselves, as they came to
believe in the superiority of their rights.

Because whites were so chicken-hearted and fearful of blacks and all
that rioting and mayhem of the 60s and 70s, they never took the time
to sort out the cunning black elites from the ordinary masses. Whites,
instead, fell in love with a treacherous form of the black middle
class. Whites were fooled by those opportunists who, led by the likes
of W.E.B. Du Bois in the early part of the 20th century, worked to
undermine the sensible economic principles of Booker T. Washington.
As Thomas Sowell has been pointing out for decades, all blacks had to
do to eventually elevate themselves was to continue the initial
successes they had begun as entrepreneurs during the segregation era,
that is, continue to work at economically developing their own
communities.

I get weary of repeating this stuff over and over, so I will offer
these links to articles on my website, which I think tell the story
well:
==========

Long before slavery was officially over, there were blacks fighting
against that which the NAACP would eventually succeed in creating,
i.e., aggrieved, dependent blacks:
http://issues-views.com/index.php/sect/1000/article/890
The Proper Means of Elevating Ourselves

See how certain blacks in Chicago tried to curtail entrepreneurial
activities of others, because they feared whites might not think there
was a need for integration:
http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=1004
Charles Smiley: Going Against the Grain

Blacks take the initiative, during segregation, to provide capital for
business creation:
http://issues-views.com/index.php/article/1014
Banker Pioneers

http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=1020
Booker T. Washington: Legacy Lost

http://www.issues-views.com/index.php/article/1021Booker T.
Washington: True Believer

See Marcus Garvey's comment on the NAACP at bottom of this article:
http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=1022
Without Commerce and Industry, The People Perish

http://www.issues-views.com/index.php?article=894
On Black Entrepreneurs, Marxists, and the New Deal

See the speech, delivered in the 1960s, by the dynamic businessman
S.B. Fuller on what blacks need:
http://issues-views.com/index.php/sect/1000/article/10031
It's Not Racial Barriers That Keep Blacks From Prospering

And this article about him: http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=1003
S. B. Fuller: Master of Enterprise

Better to stress failure and defeat, to keep the interest of whites:
http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=900
Keeping the Spotlight on Failure

You've probably heard of the riots in Tulsa, Oklahoma – see the rest
of that story: http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=1019
Who Killed Greenwood?

Thanks to integration crusading elites, ordinary blacks had to give up
an excellent school:
http://issues-views.com/index.php?article=1017
Williston High School

The section entitled, http://www.issues-views.com/index.php/sect/1000
"When We Were Colored," is full of pertinent articles.
==========

Had the black masses stayed on the economic track, instead of being
dragged away by eager elites who craved intimacy with whites, the
story would be a different one today. Mr. Burbridge claims that
"integration cannot be forced." Nor should it be. Integration is
inevitable between groups that live in contact with one another; it
usually happens slowly. What those black elites wanted was to speed
up the process, as they destroyed the fabric of the communities
already built by blacks. All the dysfunction that eventually overtook
black society stems from this treachery.

Regards,

Elizabeth

 

[skyorbit]

The BIg BANDS of the era did much more to integrate people then government ever did.

Most Jazz bands were integrated, and they were refuse to patron any restaurant that wouldn't take the whole band. As a result, many restaurants were integrated even before the Civil Rights act was passed.

Tracy

 

[FunkBuddha]

Elizabeth Wright, of www.Issues-Views.com and the American Conservative Magazine, responds to the CRA issue in reference to Burbrigde's comment:

I recieved this in reply to an email I sent asking her thoughts. She gave me permission to post it:

Wow. I went to her website and read a few of her articles and I must say that her perspective is enlightening. Thanks for the links!

I like my women like I like my coffee, strong and black! Haha, j/k. I do like strong, intelligent, well spoken women though.

 

[sirgonzo420]

Wow. I went to her website and read a few of her articles and I must say that her perspective is enlightening. Thanks for the links!

I like my women like I like my coffee, strong and black! Haha, j/k. I do like strong, intelligent, well spoken women though.

But not black women?