American Atheists Target Christmas in Billboard

I noticed that in the "see also" section, these is a "List of Virgin Births" link, which actually takes you to "Miraculous Births," and none of the other ones are like the Christian story of Christ being born of a virgin. These lists are meant as a convenient way of denigrating the Christian religion without actually showing evidence of story stealing. If you actually read about these deities/prophets, then you will find out that their stories have significant enough differences that the Christian writers of the Holy Bible could not have stolen from them.
 
Fr. Barron in the video I posted earlier makes the important point that the majority of the deities proclaimed to be "similar" to Jesus are in no way based in actual history. One of the unique things about Jesus is that his historical reality cannot be denied, whereas all of these other myths happened as Father B. put it "a long time ago in the distant past" (simliar to Star Wars a long time ago in a galaxy far far away
 
Speaking of “all over”, there you go again with your profane hostility. Is calling people “assholes” and my disagreements “bullshit” things your Personal Savior Jesus Christ told you to do?

“Onward Christian Aggression”, right? ;)

Onward atheistic passive aggression...
Crying wolf once more....
With the pen of Darwin....
Marching on before....
Claiming persecution....
And every mildest slight....
Always play the victim....
So to prove you're right...

Onward atheistic passive aggression...
Crying wolf once more....
With the guns of Stalin...
Marching on before....
 
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Easy. Pool of Siloam. People thought that was a myth until recently.

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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6750670/ns/technology_and_science-science/
 
If reason is reduced to mere physical processes occurring inside the brain, then everyone reasons, whether it's Christians who celebrate Jesus during Christmas, or "atheists" who complain against Christians for celebrating Jesus. Both groups have physical processes going on inside the brain, so how does one determine which one is being reasonable or not? In other words, in a physicalist paradigm, whose brain process becomes the determining factor of reason, say, between a Christian celebrating Jesus or an "atheist" crying about it?

Also, you fail to understand the metaphysical nature of concepts, such as reason. Reason has no physical element to it. It does not take up space, nor can it be observed empirically (by a microscope or something else). For a physical object like a box, we can examine its tangible qualities, such as its weight, length, texture, etc. With other things like reason, we cannot do any such thing. Reason is an immaterial entity. It makes no sense to say "Reason weighs 13 lbs.," or "I took Reason out of my pantry today."

But "atheists" have no way to account for immaterial realities like reason in terms of their worldview because they only allow empirical/physical entities to be observed as true. They have to borrow assumptions and terms from the Christian worldview in order to even appeal to reason. And in so doing, they attest that God is true, even if they suppress knowledge of His existence.

My argument is not that "atheists" don't use reason. In fact, they do. Rather, what I'm arguing is that "atheists" cannot account for why we should use reason or what reason is, in terms of their own worldview. Instead, "atheists" have to work off borrowed capital from another worldview to explain reason, and that worldview is Christianity.

My challenge to any "atheist" is to give an account for why reason should be celebrated (as was mentioned in the OP), and then tell us why all people should agree with their definition and understanding of reason. I say they can't do it, and on philosophical grounds, reason is nonsense for "Atheism."

You conflate two definitions of “reason”; one defines the process of thinking, the other defines the degree of validity/logic OF THAT THINKING. IOW a person can “reason” (verb), but in a very unreasonable way.

I can’t figure out why you think atheists have to work off borrowed capital from the worldview of Christianity to explain reason. Reason is easily explained without the slightest reference to Christianity: Reason should be celebrated simply because it is a faster route to more-accurate knowledge and wisdom, which are more life-supporting than less-accurate knowledge and ignorance. And supporting life/survival is an ethic that is quite independent of religion.
 
1. I think many people are dumb. Does not mean I am hostile to them. And yes this guy is dumb.

2. Perhaps. But there are a number of people on this forum who do just that. Put it this way when that idiot wanted to burn a Koran almost everyone here agreed that he was an idiot.

1. Surely you are not seriously claiming that name-calling someone “dumb” is not hostility. HINT: You believing it does not render it non-hostile! Please educate yourself on the definition of such fundamental elements of discussion-forum rules against initiated aggression, insults, ad hominem, and the concept of crossing the line from attacking the message and attacking the person. These elements are not only fundamental to most discussion forums, but also to the concept of individual liberty. SECOND HINT: This forum is about individual liberty. If you still wish to deny such fundamentals, at least check out the rules section of this forum. Individual liberty depends on people agreeing to control their aggressive behavior. Do you understand that?

2. And had he been participating in a discussion here on LF, you would have violated the rules by calling him an “idiot”. Do you reject the rules set forth by the admin?
 
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1. Surely you are not seriously claiming that name-calling someone “dumb” is not hostility. HINT: You believing it does not render it non-hostile! Please educate yourself on the definition of such fundamental elements of discussion-forum rules against initiated aggression, insults, ad hominem, and the concept of crossing the line from attacking the message and attacking the person. These elements are not only fundamental to most discussion forums, but also to the concept of individual liberty. SECOND HINT: This forum is about individual liberty. If you still wish to deny such fundamentals, at least check out the rules section of this forum. Individual liberty depends on people agreeing to control their aggressive behavior. Do you understand that?

2. And had he been participating in a discussion here on LF, you would have violated the rules by calling him an “idiot”. Do you reject the rules set forth by the admin?

I'll tell you what I'm starting to feel hostile right now.
 
I'll tell you what I'm starting to feel hostile right now.

I have no problem with you expressing how you feel, but that’s different than engaging in ad hominum. Few find confrontation a pleasant experience, but it all depends on how you handle it. The challenge to every defender of individual liberty is to control your desire to initiate aggression. Again: HAVING the desire is fine; acting on it is not.
 
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Thanks, LFoD. Apparently some claiming to be Christians have put up such billboards. I don't agree with that, either. Two wrongs do not make a right, however.

This board was established to promote Ron Paul for President. Many of us think he will run again in 2012. Whether he does or not, he reinvigorated a revolution to reinstate our Constitution and regain our liberty. This revolution in inclusive of people of a number of faiths, and hate it as many do, the faith is predominantly Christian.

Also, as you all know, Ron Paul is a Christian. If I remember correctly, two of his brothers are pastors. Rand Paul is also a Christian. So, I really do not understand why you feel the need to smear this man's good name by interjecting your hate for his faith all over this board, over and over again. At this point, most of you must know that it does not further our cause, so why do you do it? Or does your hate for God so cloud your thinking that it takes priority over us making headway in our quest?

I do realize that hating God is the "in thing", today and in fact, it is being pushed. Did it ever dawn on you that just like so many other things, this is also being done for a purpose and by the very same people who are heralding all the other things we are fighting against? As much as you hate it, remember that history has shown that just as guns are confiscated in countries as one of the last steps before complete totalitarianism, so is the worship of God made illegal. And yes, I do think this is part of the agenda. I honestly do. Just think about it, please.
 
Thanks, LFoD. Apparently some claiming to be Christians have put up such billboards. I don't agree with that, either. Two wrongs do not make a right, however.

Well I don't see anything wrong with this billboard which LFoD linked to.

George_Washington_quote_billboard.jpg


Are we to become so politically correct that founding father quotes become insults in and of themselves?

However this one does cross the line:

christian+billboard+one.jpg
 
Yeah that second billboard goes way too far. For one, it assumes being anti-american is a bad thing. I hate the nation of America and the american government, so am I anti-american too? In fact I fail to see why any true Christian would love America or any worldly nation for that matter.
 
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Don't fall for the passive aggressive trap. The whole game is to push the envelop of civility to the edge and beyond, get you to react, and then say "See? Look at the aggressive Christians and how terrible they are."

Mmm I've been insulted by plenty of online Christians when I try to civilly discuss things like Israel or religion and they are the first to use insults. If you're a Christian and read the Bible then you should actually celebrate when one insults you, since it's regarded as a test. And one is suppose to "turn the other cheek."
 
Mmm I've been insulted by plenty of online Christians when I try to civilly discuss things like Israel or religion and they are the first to use insults. If you're a Christian and read the Bible then you should actually celebrate when one insults you, since it's regarded as a test. And one is suppose to "turn the other cheek."

Did you even pay attention to the context of the discussion? I never said that Christians never insulted anyone. I pointed out that the particular atheist that BT was responding to has a particular history of baiting people and then trying to play victim. As for "turning the other cheek", that was kind of my point to BT. That is to learn to spot passive aggression for what it is and not respond with the kind of aggression that the person who's playing the game is hoping for.

That said, the same Jesus who preached turning the other cheek was not above calling His enemies "vipers" or "whitewashed graves" or "blind" or "liars" or "murderers" or "sons of Satan" to their face. How do these two different faces of Jesus square up? Ecclesiastes 3:1 There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven:

I wish atheists would first fully learn about Christianity before trying to lecture Christians on its application. ;)
 
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:rolleyes: Did you even pay attention to the context of the discussion?

Haha, another cherry-picking Christian. I've been paying attention to the conversation, your snobby attitude isn't going to win anyone over btw.

I never said that Christians never insulted anyone. I pointed out that the particular atheist that BT was responding to has a particular history of baiting people and then trying to play victim.

So who are you to judge? Like most modern day Christians you haven't read your bible. You are to turn the other cheek and stop insulting this person. Accusing people of baiting isn't going to get them to come to Christ. Someone that truly followed the scripture would dust their shoes off and move on if someone was unwilling to accept Christ. But I guess the same rules don't apply for RPF Christianity.
That said, the same Jesus who preached turning the other cheek was not above calling His enemies "vipers" or "empty graves" or "blind" or "liars" or "murderers" or "sons of Satan" to their face. How do these two different faces of Jesus square up? Ecclesiastes 3:1 There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven:


This is going off-topic. This is one of the reasons why I reject Christianity as a religion.
I wish atheists would first fully learn about Christianity before trying to lecture Christians on its application. ;)

I'm not an atheist, and I've been Christian for years. I've been a Christian for years, and I know how little Christians actually know of their religion. Especially the ones that have their heart set on promoting the faith.
 
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Haha, another cherry-picking Christian. I've been paying attention to the conversation, your snobby attitude isn't going to win anyone over btw.

Fine. Whether I "win you over" or not isn't important. My message was for BT, not you.

So who are you to judge? Like most modern day Christians you haven't read your bible. You are to turn the other cheek and stop insulting this person.

LOL. Talk about a "snobbish attitude"? Talk about "cherry picking"? You misquote one verse, take it out of context, take on your own interpretation to the end of it ignore what Jesus actually did according to the Bible and then falsely accuse others in a most insulting way of "not reading their Bible".

And "who am I to judge"? Who are YOU to judge? I've seen enough of the poster in question to discern a pattern. You jump in on the middle of a conversation that was not directed at you and you attempt to pass judgement on me by cherry picking the parts of the Bible that best fit your argument? And I should be concerned because....?

Accusing people of baiting isn't going to get them to come to Christ. Someone that truly followed the scripture would dust their shoes off and move on if someone was unwilling to accept Christ.

Yes. I've shaken the dust off my feet from idirtify. And I've shaken the dust off my feet from you also. My message was for BlackTerrel. If you didn't like it you didn't have to read it. The message wasn't "Please flash and idirtfy won't you come to Christ?" You two have already made your decision. My message to BT was "Don't fall into the trap of letting idirtify ruffle your feathers". That's all. It wasn't an insult. If you took it that way, that's your problem.

But I guess the same rules don't apply for RPF Christianity.

What rules? The ones that you make up? Those rules only apply to you.

This is going off-topic. This is one of the reasons why I reject Christianity as a religion.

Fine. You are free to make whatever decision you want. I'm not going to stand in your way or be fake in order to con you into becoming Christian. Again my message was for BT. The same sun that melts butter hardens clay.

I'm not an atheist, and I've been Christian for years. I've been a Christian for years, and I know how little Christians actually know of their religion. Especially the ones that have their heart set on promoting the faith.

Let's see. Because I don't agree with you, and because I apply the entire Bible, you mistakenly assume I haven't "read my Bible". That's fine. I've seen such superficial application of Christianity as what you are doing done before. It's funny how people like you complain that Christianity is too "restricting" and yet wish to impose your own interpretation of Christianity on others. Ok, if that makes you feel better about yourself who am I to stand in the way?
 
Fine. Whether I "win you over" or not isn't important. My message was for BT, not you.

Once again, you're not following the Bible. I don't know why you continue on and on.

LOL. Talk about a "snobbish attitude"? Talk about "cherry picking"? You misquote one verse, take it out of context, take on your own interpretation to the end of it ignore what Jesus actually did according to the Bible and then falsely accuse others in a most insulting way of "not reading their Bible".

Read my post again. I've had PLENTY of Christians do to me what Atheists have done to you Christians. Even worse. And I don't sit here bitching about it constantly like the RPF-Christians. Oh noes them atheists are mad at me boohoo. If you're so secure in your faith then someone complaining about the Bible shouldn't be a problem. Hell, it wasn't when I was a Christian.

And "who am I to judge"? Who are YOU to judge? I've seen enough of the poster in question to discern a pattern. You jump in on the middle of a conversation that was not directed at you and you attempt to pass judgement on me by cherry picking the parts of the Bible that best fit your argument? And I should be concerned because....?

Calm down, you're not making any sense whatsoever. If I'm not a Christian, that how am I bound to the rules of the Bible? I believe in passing judgement in a constructive way. It's not my ideology.

Yes. I've shaken the dust off my feet from idirtify. And I've shaken the dust off my feet from you also. My message was for BlackTerrel. If you didn't like it you didn't have to read it. The message wasn't "Please flash and idirtfy won't you come to Christ?" You two have already made your decision. My message to BT was "Don't fall into the trap of letting idirtify ruffle your feathers". That's all. It wasn't an insult. If you took it that way, that's your problem.

It was for bt, it was for bt, it was for bt, it was for bt. This is a public forum. I have the ability to respond to whatever I like.


Let's see. Because I don't agree with you, and because I apply the entire Bible, you mistakenly assume I haven't "read my Bible". That's fine. I've seen such superficial application of Christianity as what you are doing done before. It's funny how people like you complain that Christianity is too "restricting" and yet wish to impose your own interpretation of Christianity on others. Ok, if that makes you feel better about yourself who am I to stand in the way?

I'm imposing what's in the Bible. If you're so secure in your faith you should be able to disagree with me respectfully. But once again, that's too much for any Christian to ask. Don't bother replying, I'm leaving this thread.
 
Once again, you're not following the Bible. I don't know why you continue on and on.

I will agree with you on one thing. This isn't worth going "on and on" about. I've proven my point from the Bible. You've only misquoted a single Bible verse and twisted it to your on pathetic ends. If you want the last word fine. I have better things to do than to continue to, as Jesus put it, "cast my pearls before swine".
 
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