Adam Kokesh Very Eloquently Defends Rand Paul

[Christian Liberty]

My take on the business thing, if you want to require your employees to drink Miller products and not Budweiser ones, even when they aren't working, if that's in the contract, that's legit. But there's no way they should be allowed to spy on you with drones.

 

[VoluntaryAmerican]

What about the objections in this thread? Do they seem knee jerk to you? I think they are very legitimate.

I think it is bizarre to say we'd rather have drones shooting criminals than officers, especially in the tyrannical environment in which we live. Id rather that ALL drones be (at the very least) de-weaponized until we can get the implications of them figured out with regard to civil liberties. It is nuts to give our police state a free pass on weaponized drones to kill Americans.

I agree with this. And as a matter of fact, so does Rand, if you take him at his word when he said he does not want the Feds funding local police to use drones.

So not being bothered by drones wasting robbery suspects coming out of a liquor store is cool? I'd write it off as a misspeak if I could, but I can't. Won me with the filibuster, lost me with more recent head shake worthy comments. Not a big deal, I am just one person. I can't stand pandering.

This is just dumb knee-jerk reaction.

 

[green73]

They already do consider "imminent" - The use of force continuum should apply to drones, no?

You must not read this forum too much, for you'd have a picture how immaculate cops are with applying the use of force continuum. Here's an example: "Justified": Uniformed Invaders Shoot a Man 16 Times in his Bed. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?400913-Cops-shoot-unarmed-man-in-bed-16-TIMES

No, I don't want these geniuses in charge of armed drones.

 

[kcchiefs6465]

You must not read this forum too much, for you'd have a picture how immaculate cops are with applying the use of force continuum. Here's an example: "Justified": Uniformed Invaders Shoot a Man 16 Times in his Bed. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?400913-Cops-shoot-unarmed-man-in-bed-16-TIMES

No, I don't want these geniuses in charge of armed drones.

But if they had a stabilized platform to aim from, everyone would be safer./logic fail

Kokesh did make some good points and I liked his last minute but that is seriously the weakest argument I could imagine.

 

[bolil]

I agree with this. And as a matter of fact, so does Rand, if you take him at his word when he said he does not want the Feds funding local police to use drones.




This is just dumb knee-jerk reaction.

so its a dumb knee-jerk reaction when it involves your savior? But when Obama shows his colors and is called on it... what is it then?

Also the vote to back an Israeli offensive. Not good.

 

[KingNothing]

You must not read this forum too much, for you'd have a picture how immaculate cops are with applying the use of force continuum. Here's an example: "Justified": Uniformed Invaders Shoot a Man 16 Times in his Bed. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?400913-Cops-shoot-unarmed-man-in-bed-16-TIMES

No, I don't want these geniuses in charge of armed drones.

Well, I'm of the belief that most of the harm cops cause is due to their own sometimes irrational fear for their own safety. Removing them from as much physical harm as possible should, I think, serve to decrease their aggressive and deadly behavior.

 

[Christian Liberty]

Rand Paul might be the best option we've got but he's still disappointing me of late.

@Sola_Fide- Are you backing Rand ATM?

 

[torchbearer]

this was a bullshit freak-out. you can then make statements that its important for you to be vigilant... and that is fine. but if you are freaking over this interview- I hope to god, you are not the person i'm beside in the fox hole. kiss my ass goodbye.

 

[VoluntaryAmerican]

so its a dumb knee-jerk reaction when it involves your savior? But when Obama shows his colors and is called on it... what is it then?

Also the vote to back an Israeli offensive. Not good.

No.

It's dumb because you are still going by the first statement Rand made on Cavuto. He has clarified himself on multiple media appearances and released a statement.

It's knee-jerk because you clearly only supported Rand based on small actions he makes, and not the issues the man represents as an entirety and the fate of the nation.

 

[Christian Liberty]

this was a bullshit freak-out. you can then make statements that its important for you to be vigilant... and that is fine. but if you are freaking over this interview- I hope to god, you are not the person i'm beside in the fox hole. kiss my ass goodbye.

What did your comment about the fox hole have to do with the rest of this?

I'm not "Freaking out". I'm disappointed. Rand apparently has an unhealthy degree of faith in the government, or is pretending to for the sake of those who do. I hope its the latter, but its impossible to tell for sure.

 

[bolil]

No.

It's dumb because you are still going by the first statement Rand made on Cavuto. He has clarified himself on multiple media appearances and released a statement.

It's knee-jerk because you clearly only supported Rand based on small actions he makes, and not the issues the man represents as an entirety and the fate of the nation.

Lost me at fate of the nation. A, shall we say, dumb phrase. Yeah, like I said, the vote to back an Israeli offensive is not a small action.

 

[torchbearer]

What did your comment about the fox hole have to do with the rest of this?

I'm not "Freaking out". I'm disappointed. Rand apparently has an unhealthy degree of faith in the government, or is pretending to for the sake of those who do. I hope its the latter, but its impossible to tell for sure.

the first part is about depending on someone to hold it together when shit gets tough... people who freak out over the little things can't be trusted to handle the big things. basically a summary. i don't want to be by someone who's emotions and fear and stirred so easily. i'd rather by in a fox hole with someone who has seen a couple of decades of battle and knows how to be handle themselves.

i keep reminding myself i'm surrounded by political neophytes.. as a way to excuse the behavior... but it doesn't work. i expect everyone to have the long view of the war against tyranny.

 

[KingNothing]

Rand apparently has an unhealthy degree of faith in the government, or is pretending to for the sake of those who do. I hope its the latter, but its impossible to tell for sure.

I have no idea how you come away thinking this.

He is not a guy who jumped onto the scene and said "RIP IT ALL DOWN! AND DON'T EVEN START OVER!" he said "let's just stop doing the terrible things and do what we can to get government out of the way." He's never once tried to pass himself off as something that he isn't. And what he IS, is the best significant politician in America.


And I say this as an anarchist! He's the closest that we can get right now to my ideal, so I support him.

 

[green73]

this was a bullshit freak-out. you can then make statements that its important for you to be vigilant... and that is fine. but if you are freaking over this interview- I hope to god, you are not the person i'm beside in the fox hole. kiss my ass goodbye.

I don't want to be in a foxhole next to you when a drone is zeroed in.

 

[bolil]

the first part is about depending on someone to hold it together when shit gets tough... people who freak out over the little things can't be trusted to handle the big things. basically a summary. i don't want to be by someone who's emotions and fear and stirred so easily. i'd rather by in a fox hole with someone who has seen a couple of decades of battle and knows how to be handle themselves.

i keep reminding myself i'm surrounded by political neophytes.. as a way to excuse the behavior... but it doesn't work. i expect everyone to have the long view of the war against tyranny.

A couple decades of battle? You are speaking metaphorically? Expect everyone? Sounds like a tyrannical disposition.

 

[Sola_Fide]

Rand Paul might be the best option we've got but he's still disappointing me of late.

@Sola_Fide- Are you backing Rand ATM?

Yes. I probably will vote for Rand and I might (possibly) even be motivated to spend time and money helping him win, although that motivation is waning.

Adam is right in this video that Rand is not a libertarian, and libertarians shouldnt freak out when Rand takes an anti-liberty position. Rand is a principled conservative, not a libertarian. There is no need to freak out about this...we all understand this. But my thinking is that if Rand does not get pushed to be more principled from our side, then he isn't going to get it anywhere. And if Rand thinks the Ron Paul independents are automatically going to vote for him and campaign for him, he is wrong. And without the Ron Paul independents, he cannot beat Hillary.

 

[torchbearer]

I don't want to be in a foxhole next to you when a drone is zeroed in.

my coworkers say the same thing.. but then i remind them- that drone missile will be coming at any time. you can't avoid it.. really. so why fear it.
so, just say no to fear. if you are using fear to rally people- you are a tyrant.

 

[KingNothing]

i expect everyone to have the long view of the war against tyranny.

As do I. Remember what it was like around here when Ron's campaign was winding down and the usual suspects were shouting "I don't know if we'll even make it to 2014, let alone 2016!" -- it was annoying, immature, and silly. We have to change minds and win elections, and we need to continue doing those things for as long as humans exist. It is our duty, and it is our only hope. And because of that, we WILL win. We have no alternative.

 

[torchbearer]

A couple decades of battle? You are speaking metaphorically? Expect everyone? Sounds like a tyrannical disposition.

i'm not talking about a metaphorical battle. i'm talking about a real battle that also includes violence.


fortunately, i was with people that could hold it together.

 

[green73]

my coworkers say the same thing.. but then i remind them- that drone missile will be coming at any time. you can't avoid it.. really. so why fear it.
so, just say no to fear. if you are using fear to rally people- you are a tyrant.

So in your longterm view of the fight against tyranny let's just concede now that the gov't (fed and local) can use drones against the citizens?