Abortion Opponents Don't Want Patients Crossing State Lines

Abortions in legal states should only be for legal residents of said state. Legal residency should be necessary before abortions be performed. What is the difference between a husband going out of state on vacation and not returning with his wife that he pushed off a cliff, and a pregnant woman coming home without her baby? At that point in a babies life, the only person that can take care of that baby is the mother. After birth, anyone can take over.

Well the difference is that murder of born people is punishable in all 50 states and in every country in the world. So the husband that killed his wife in another state would be prosecuted under the laws of that other state. A criminally minded husband might choose to kill his wife in a state that didn't have the death penalty for example. He would most likely be prosecuted in the state where the body was found.

A better use of the time and energy of the pro-life movement would be on educating young people within their sphere of influence about the facts surrounding abortion. Not in a preachy "You know this is wrong correct?" way but in an informative "This is how a baby develops inside the womb" way. Yes, the best defense against abortion is that "birds and the bees" talk that conservatives sometimes shy away from. Every church youth group should screen the movie about Kermit Gosnell and have a discussion about it afterwards. Have people who survived abortions be guest speakers at large events. Show them via Zoom if you have to. I went through 12 years of Christian education, 14 if you count two years at a Christian college, and the only abortion discussion we had was from one religion teacher who approached the subject from the "preachy" way. I got better information about the dangers of tobacco and alcohol than I did what the abortion debate was really about. And now our children are learning for other children on the Chinese communist backed TikTok.
 
We need a ruling that the unborn are people with a right to life so murder laws outlaw it everywhere.

At what point do the unborn people become people? If you say "conception" then outlaw IVF clinics. I think the babies Kermit Gosnell killed after they survived abortion counted as people before the abortion was performed. They had fingers, toes, a beating heart and a functioning brain. Had he run an IVF clinic and was found flushing the embryos of parents who quit paying the $200 a month cryogenic fee to keep them on ice indefinitely, I doubt very many people would have cared. I sure would not. Having some kind of cutoff is what is needed to move the debate forward. It solves the "Well what about rape" question. A raped mother should have a reasonable time to decide if she really wants to carry the rapist's baby. Texas gives her 6 weeks. I think that's enough.
 
At what point do the unborn people become people? If you say "conception" then outlaw IVF clinics.

I see it as a stage of development.

None of us would be here if we hadn't started our life as a fertilized egg. It isn't like anyone gets to skip that step. So, from my point-of-view it starts at conception.

A sperm on its own doesn't develop. Neither does an unfertilized egg. So, no penalties for masturbation.

Also with IVF, I'm pretty certain the egg is fertilized just prior to transfer to a uterus. I don't think it is common (or even possible) to store fertilized eggs long-term. Usually about 5 days at most before they transfer.

But regardless I think it still stands that the states will have various time frames on abortion and people will have many more options than the all-or-nothing that was coming from the Fed's POV.
 
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I see it as a stage of development.

None of us would be here if we hadn't started our life as a fertilized egg. It isn't like anyone gets to skip that step. So, from my point-of-view it starts at conception.

A sperm on its own doesn't develop. Neither does an unfertilized egg. So, no penalties for masturbation.

Also with IVF, I'm pretty certain the egg is fertilized just prior to transfer to a uterus. I don't think it is common (or even possible) to store fertilized eggs long-term. Usually about 5 days at most before they transfer.

Clinical death is when brainwave activity ceases. It stands to reason that clinical life doesn't begin until brainwave activity starts. No brain...no pain. As for fertilized embryos, they are often kept a long time before they are used, and sometimes they are discarded.

https://fertilitycenterofdallas.com/blog/unused-embryos/

What Do We Do With Unused Embryos?
Posted at 18:53h in dallas, IVF by Fertility Center of Dallas
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When you create the embryos for your IVF cycles, all of the focus is on successful transfer and implantation. However, the team at the Fertility Center of Dallas likes to take a comprehensive approach to the IVF timeline – which includes planning what to do with our patients’ extra embryos when they are finished with their IVF cycles.

Your Family Is Complete: What’s Next For Embryos?
For the first several years, embryos typically remained frozen and stored, waiting for any future IVF cycles that would yield additional children. Once a family is complete, it can be challenging to determine what comes next for the embryos.

Ideally, the conversation about what to do with extra embryos is best had before you begin your first IVF cycle. It doesn’t mean your feelings and choices won’t change down the road, but having a plan means you’ve considered the entire IVF picture – from start to finish.

1) Keep Them Frozen And Stored Until You’re Ready To Do Otherwise
There’s absolutely no reason to do anything at all until you are ready. You can keep them frozen and stored for as long as you want. However, many families find that once their family building is complete, the funds used to store them may be better served elsewhere – like to support their children’s extracurricular activities or begin saving for college.

That said, you have time to decide what you want to do with your embryos, and FCD or your embryo lab will keep them safe for you until you are 100% confident with your choice.

2) Donate Embryos To A Family Who Needs Them
Sometimes, couples just like you don’t have the option to use their own eggs and sperm or the embryos created from their egg and sperm aren’t viable for IVF (usually the result of chromosomal or genetic abnormalities). In this case, they can use donated embryos from other couples.

For many infertile couples in Dallas, this feels like a win-win option because it protects healthy embryos from being thawed and disposed of. Donated embryos are treated like an adoption, so there will be a bit of legal paperwork involved. They can also be treated as open or closed adoption, depending on your wishes. Once those documents are all in order, you’ll have the peace of mind that comes from knowing you’ve helped a couple who has walked your path to achieve their own family building miracle.

Your fertility specialist and staff can help you learn more about the embryo donation/adoption process. You can also visit the Snowflakes website – which is one of the most widely used and respected organizations that facilitates embryo adoptions.

3) Donate The Embryos To Science
First, it is important to clarify that embryos donated to science are never transferred into another woman’s uterus and will not become babies or children. While they will ultimately be destroyed via whatever research causes they are donated to, you will know they were used for research designed to further the cause of medicine and, perhaps, to save lives.

You absolutely have the right to know what your embryos will be used for, which gives you some agency in choosing the right place to send them. Like adoption options, this will require some amount of paperwork on your side to make sure the transaction falls within Texas and United States legal guidelines.

4) Thaw Them And…
Finally, you have the option to thaw the embryos and let them reach a natural conclusion to their life cycle. Options for this include:

Compassionate transfer. We can transfer the remaining embryos into your uterus at a time when there is no chance of them implanting. This allows nature and the body to take it’s course, and the embryos will be absorbed by your body the same way they would have been if an egg was conceived and unable to implant on its own.
Thawing and disposal. If it’s simply too much for you to handle or plan for, we completely understand. In that case, you just let us know and our lab will respectfully thaw and discard them for you. We are passionate about the work we do and will handle these embryos with the utmost care.
Are you considering IVF or do you have embryos stored here at the Fertility Center of Dallas? Contact us to discuss your options and create a plan that honors what to do with extra embryos after IVF, in alignment with your wishes.

But regardless I think it still stands that the states will have various time frames on abortion and people will have many more options than the all-or-nothing that was coming from the Fed's POV.

I agree. It's time for people to actually start having a conversation on the issue instead of merely shouting at each other about it.
 
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Well the difference is that murder of born people is punishable in all 50 states and in every country in the world. So the husband that killed his wife in another state would be prosecuted under the laws of that other state. A criminally minded husband might choose to kill his wife in a state that didn't have the death penalty for example. He would most likely be prosecuted in the state where the body was found.

A better use of the time and energy of the pro-life movement would be on educating young people within their sphere of influence about the facts surrounding abortion. Not in a preachy "You know this is wrong correct?" way but in an informative "This is how a baby develops inside the womb" way. Yes, the best defense against abortion is that "birds and the bees" talk that conservatives sometimes shy away from. Every church youth group should screen the movie about Kermit Gosnell and have a discussion about it afterwards. Have people who survived abortions be guest speakers at large events. Show them via Zoom if you have to. I went through 12 years of Christian education, 14 if you count two years at a Christian college, and the only abortion discussion we had was from one religion teacher who approached the subject from the "preachy" way. I got better information about the dangers of tobacco and alcohol than I did what the abortion debate was really about. And now our children are learning for other children on the Chinese communist backed TikTok.
What do you think would be the lefts response if I videoed a performed abortion on my pregnant female dog and killed 12 puppies?
 
What do you think would be the lefts response if I videoed a performed abortion on my pregnant female dog and killed 12 puppies?

^^This argument actually works. I've used it in a few debates against animal-loving leftists and I've never seen a mind shut down so fast. Total short-circuit. One of them is a former co-worker and she hasn't talked to me since. I guess probably because she is still trying to come up with a response, or hopefully, because she is self-reflecting.
 
What do you think would be the lefts response if I videoed a performed abortion on my pregnant female dog and killed 12 puppies?

Hmmm...interesting....

^^This argument actually works. I've used it in a few debates against animal-loving leftists and I've never seen a mind shut down so fast. Total short-circuit. One of them is a former co-worker and she hasn't talked to me since. I guess probably because she is still trying to come up with a response, or hopefully, because she is self-reflecting.

Yeah...leftists are quick to try to traumatize you with their arguments but can't take t he reversal. I had this one friend who kept trying to feed me global warming BS. Her fallback position was "Well isn't it a good thing to try to save the environment anyway?" What I knew is these nonsense "solutions" to a non-existent problem has the potential to do more harm than good. For example, supposedly cows damage the environment by grazing are releasing methane. But what eats more grass and farts more than a cow? Why and elephant of course. It didn't take me long to find the story of an environmentalist who killed 40,000 elephants in order to stop climate change.

 
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Second best option is to make it an exile-able offense.

Exile should be a much more commonly used punishment.
Yes.
We need to offer the option of choosing, death, life at hard labor, or exile for many crimes.
We will also have to exile any surviving leftists after they start the next civil war.
 
At what point do the unborn people become people? If you say "conception" then outlaw IVF clinics. I think the babies Kermit Gosnell killed after they survived abortion counted as people before the abortion was performed. They had fingers, toes, a beating heart and a functioning brain. Had he run an IVF clinic and was found flushing the embryos of parents who quit paying the $200 a month cryogenic fee to keep them on ice indefinitely, I doubt very many people would have cared. I sure would not. Having some kind of cutoff is what is needed to move the debate forward. It solves the "Well what about rape" question. A raped mother should have a reasonable time to decide if she really wants to carry the rapist's baby. Texas gives her 6 weeks. I think that's enough.
That's a conversation I'm willing to have.
At least that conversation recognizes that life has a beginning and after that point it can't be terminated for any reason but to save the life of the mother.
I don't think many pro-lifers would be too concerned if different states had different reasonable positions, but I don't think the left will accept even the most lenient reasonable position, the left wants to kill the baby right up until birth or even after.
 
All of the lawsuits that I've heard up to this point have been against gun manufacturers rather than gun dealers.

Edit: I did find this.

https://www.npr.org/2022/06/29/1108698652/oxford-high-school-shooting-gun-dealer-sued

Sounds like the dealer is in the same state. We'll see how the case goes.

I was sure there was a case where Illinois or some other blue state attempted to sue a gun store just across the border in a red state because they claimed many guns from there eventually found their way to big city crime scenes in the blue state.
But the principle is the same with the manufacturers in other states.
 
That's a conversation I'm willing to have.
At least that conversation recognizes that life has a beginning and after that point it can't be terminated for any reason but to save the life of the mother.
I don't think many pro-lifers would be too concerned if different states had different reasonable positions, but I don't think the left will accept even the most lenient reasonable position, the left wants to kill the baby right up until birth or even after.

Of course. Did you see this thread?

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...able-to-kill-my-baby-in-order-to-save-it-quot
 
We need a ruling that the unborn are people with a right to life so murder laws outlaw it everywhere.

This should do it.

https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/preamble/#:~:text=to%20ourselves%20and-,our%20Posterity%2C,-do%20ordain%20and

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
 
Abortion Opponents Don't Want Patients Crossing State Lines


I'm in Illinois, across the river from St. Louis. There are two abortion clinics within 5 miles of me. Prior to the SC decision, they were getting less than 20 calls a day. Now they're getting hundreds. You can still purchase fairly inexpensive homes around here - so I'm thinking it might be a good time to get into the AirBnB business.

Americans have the right pursuant to the NINTH AMENDMENT To Abort and to travel or locomotion. Come on Conservatives , you know that very well.
 
Bad idea. Nobody needs a precedent like this in place when, say, Washington State, home of Bill Gates, starts euthanizing old people.

"We call it a medical procedure, so you can't leave! Ha ha!"

Too far fetched for you? Everything was too far fetched in 2018...

Starts?

<"Covid-19 vaccine rollout to our most vulnerable" has entered the chat>
 
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