A-10 Program Discontinued

[KCIndy]

An article from a few weeks back..

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-05-15/soldiers-fight-to-save-a-10-warthog-jet

The Air Force says that newer, faster aircraft, such as the F-16, F-15E, and, eventually, Lockheed Martin’s (LMT) new F-35 fighter, can perform the A-10’s principal mission of “close air support,” striking targets on the ground to help soldiers in a land battle. “We’ll figure out how to do it better than it’s ever been done before,” General Mark Welsh III, the Air Force chief of staff, said at an April 10 hearing of the Senate Armed Services Committee.

The Warthog was routinely sent to protect troops in Iraq and Afghanistan. Its supporters question whether the military would risk doing the same with the costly F-35. “You really think they’re going to allow a $200 million airplane to get down in the weeds, where it’s extremely vulnerable?” says retired Lieutenant Colonel William Smith, an airline pilot who flew the A-10 in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Wow! That is truly insane.

Like others here have mentioned, I don't like the idea of war or the U.S. meddling around overseas. I *ALSO* don't like getting gouged as a taxpayer to pay for a $200 million dollar aircraft that can't do the job as effectively or as safely (for the pilot) as the A-10, which probably costs about 10% of what an F-35 costs.

The F-35 isn't designed to take the kind of beating an A-10 can routinely take flying low and slow.

This is like going out and buying a brand new Corvette to enter in the local demolition derby.

 

[eduardo89]

The real reason it is being cancelled: it's not cost efficient...for the MIC.

 

[fisharmor]

The A-10 was always my favorite airplane. I remember playing a 90's video game, A-10 Tank Hunter (or something like that), which had some awesome music playing while you were flying.

The Air Force has been actively campaigning to get rid of the A-10 since at least that time.
The institution has always hated it, practically from the beginning.

This is like going out and buying a brand new Corvette to enter in the local demolition derby.

No, it's more like buying a brand new Aston-Martin.


Food for thought: The Air Force didn't exist before 1947.
Prior to that, we won every war we fought.
After that, we've lost every war we fought.

I second the idea of giving these planes to the Marines or Army.
But then let's follow that up.
The Air Force should be the very first branch of the military to be cut in its entirety.

 

[eduardo89]

Food for thought: The Air Force didn't exist before 1947.
Prior to that, we won every war we fought.
After that, we've lost every war we fought.

The US hasn't lost a single war since the Air Force was created. But that's just because there hasn't been a single declaration of war since WWII.

 

[Henry Rogue]

Air Force brass hated A-10s from the get go. A-10s went directly to National Guard units, when they were brand new. The Air Force didn't want the close air Support, anti tank role, they considered that the Army's role, but the Army is prohibited from operating armed fixed wing aircraft The Air Force warmed up to the A -10s after the old brass retired and A-10 pilots advanced in rank.

 

[loveshiscountry]

The A-10 was beautiful. It protected our military personnel. Which is a lot more than I can say for Congress.

 

[alucard13mm]

So how come they don't design and build a new aircraft to use the GAU 8 if the MIC wanted to spend bunch of money? If we gonna spend boat load of money to design a new combat aircraft, might as well design it based on something that works. Shit, I'd make the whole aircraft out of tWolverine's indestructable Adamantium metal alloy.

There are no counter measures or any way to fool a bullet... but many ways to fool a guided missile.

 

[Pericles]

Maybe the marines or army can get it for cheap.

they should make a new version of the a10 if they wanna spend money so badly.

The Army is not allowed to have fixed wing aircraft mounting weapons - the AF won that food fight at the Pentagon.

 

[Victor Grey]

The darned F-35 nonsense is sucking up more money than it'll ever be worth. At that from the whole western world.

We already have the F-22 for a massive money sink. Least it's role makes sense and seems to have few problems. Wouldn't say getting our money's worth, because good gracious, but it's darn impressive. Even if it is made by hand of gold for all it matters.

I've never seen an argument, cost-wise, to support that F-35 program, particularly to the sheer scale it's been.

After air superiority is gained in a conflict, why need the f-35? Anything above a Cessna can drop bombs and rounds on a target.
A-10 and assorted bombers do the job well. So why spend multiple billions, creating something that (if some of the things I've read that aren't advertizements/propaganda have any truth) is at best an average jack of all trades, and very much a master of none?

 

[phill4paul]

Dumb fucks. For close-in air support the A-10 has no match. "Antiquated" platform means there is no billion dollars in new contracts in it. SMDH.

 

[CaptUSA]

The A-10 was beautiful. It protected our military personnel. Which is a lot more than I can say for Congress.

Actually...

I used to have this on a t-shirt. The A-10 is my favorite aircraft ever.

 

[AuH20]

The darned F-35 nonsense is sucking up more money than it'll ever be worth. At that from the whole western world.

We already have the F-22 for a massive money sink. Least it's role makes sense and seems to have few problems. Wouldn't say getting our money's worth, because good gracious, but it's darn impressive. Even if it is made by hand of gold for all it matters.

I've never seen an argument, cost-wise, to support that F-35 program, particularly to the sheer scale it's been.

After air superiority is gained in a conflict, why need the f-35? Anything above a Cessna can drop bombs and rounds on a target.
A-10 and assorted bombers do the job well. So why spend multiple billions, creating something that (if some of the things I've read that aren't advertizements/propaganda have any truth) is at best an average jack of all trades, and very much a master of none?

 

[Henry Rogue]

Why the ‘Warthog’ Matters
Will military turf battles cost combat troops their best friend in the sky?
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/why-the-warthog-matters/Sprey, who has been around to criticize the Air Force since becoming one of Robert McNamara’s “whiz kids”-turned-rogue at the Pentagon in the 1960’s, said the F-35 program is just another example of how the Pentagon continues to funnel billions of taxpayer dollars into programs that don’t work, while sacrificing ones that do. He takes it a step further: “in a microcosm, this is about how the military industrial complex has basically betrayed the soldier and ruined national defense.”

He and others charge that instead of keeping the A-10, which has support among soldiers, Marines, and the Air Force pilots who fly them, the services want
to develop their own super-expensive alternatives. That’s the way it goes in Washington—high-end all the way. This hits the sweet spot with contractors,
politicians, and the services themselves, which build their pride and identities around big, elaborate programs, even if they are inefficient and underperforming.
[...]
Emerging as well is the drone lobby, which sees the future of close air support in drones like the M-Q Reaper. While even A-10 proponents—let’s call them the Grunts (including Marines and other land war-centric constituencies)—recognize some virtue in drones for reconnaissance, they believe they would never have the vantage, maneuverability, and combat capabilities of manned aircraft like the A-10.

There is the creator of the A-10 right there, Pierre Sprey. One of the original members of The Fighter Mafia.

 

[presence]

Cost effective weapon that the US already owns...


or


...new multi billion dollar weapon system with high maintainance costs





MIC choice is obvious here, expect only more of this.

 

[alucard13mm]

Seems we are making the same mistake as the Germans did in WW2, except worse.

German tigers were expensive to build and maintain, but was pretty good when it did not break down. US Shermans were cheaper to make, easier to maintain, can produce more of them and does its job reasonably well.

Isn't this how Al Qaeda is bankrupting USA in war? Expendable jihadist with AK's and RPG's occasionally destroying expensive US military hardware?

 

[Pericles]

Dumb fucks. For close-in air support the A-10 has no match. "Antiquated" platform means there is no billion dollars in new contracts in it. SMDH.

The Air Force is about missiles and satellites in outer space and really fast and stealthy fighters. Who wants to fuck with a bunch of guys rolling around in the mud?

 

[acptulsa]

The Air Force is about missiles and satellites in outer space and really fast and stealthy fighters. Who wants to fuck with a bunch of guys rolling around in the mud?

Obviously they do or they wouldn't be continuing to support the Army ban on fixed wing aircraft that was put in place when the Air Force was created in 1947.

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

The real reason it is being cancelled: it's not cost efficient...for the MIC.

Yep, no profit, though the MIC does design USAF/USN aircraft for profitable sustaining engineering contracts... until you get the next new design sold off through Congress.

 

[Pericles]

Obviously they do or they wouldn't be continuing to support the Army ban on fixed wing aircraft that was put in place when the Air Force was created in 1947.

Why the Army built helicopters - not covered by the Key West "agreement".

 

[devil21]

The real reason it is being cancelled: it's not cost efficient...for the MIC.

Why not just build a newer, upgraded version of the A-10 then? If they're so determined to piss away billions on planes, at least piss it away on something that we know works and could actually use a refresh. We have enough bomber-this and stealth-that already and these new plane programs are turning into money pits. They could design a new Warthog and it would probably be the most kick-ass thing with wings in the world.