67 confirmed cases of measles in California-centered outbreak

We can make up whatever numbers we want.

No, not "we." You. You made up numbers. I based my conjecture on actual numbers--and called it a "guess" at that.


If we assume the distribution is the same as the known vaccination rates,...

That's a tall order that discounts what you just said. I would also say that is a poor assumption, based on the reasons I outlined.
 
i rest my case.


Resting on what? Everybody is supposed to endlessly vaccinate themselves from everything because you're to lazy to take care of your own health? Why don't you just get a giant bottle of Formula 409 and spray the whole earth?
 
Resting on what? Everybody is supposed to endlessly vaccinate themselves from everything because you're to lazy to take care of your own health? Why don't you just get a giant bottle of Formula 409 and spray the whole earth?

Resting on the fact you agree with me that vaccines are just like seatbelts.
 
Resting on the fact you agree with me that vaccines are just like seatbelts.


Seatbelts are mandated because of lazy people who refuse to do things like calculate proper distance. I am required to wear a seatbelt because of lazy people. Some guy tailgates me and now it's my problem.
 
Seatbelts are mandated because of lazy people who refuse to do things like calculate proper distance. I am required to wear a seatbelt because of lazy people. Some guy tailgates me and now it's my problem.

Seat belts are mandated because the government thinks it's their business to protect my children. I have the right to risk my child's life if I choose to drive recklessly. Yes, I'm lazy, and that's my choice, I am not harming anybody but myself and my children.
 
Seat belts are mandated because the government thinks it's their business to protect my children.

Don't blame it on the government. Government is made up of people. People like you. YOU think it's your business. People like you act like you generally care more about my kid than I care myself. People like you are lazy and arrogant.

Anyway, seatbelt laws were actually pushed heavily by the car companies as early as the 1970s. They saw airbags being pushed and saw the grand expense of them. Mandatory seatbelt laws were a way to bypass that, but it hardly worked out that way. Thanks Ralph Nader. Thanks big government types. Thanks PRB.
 
I don't know how many of you are familar with the Homeopathic principal of like cures like I think vaccines were built around this principal in the beginning. The people who create new vaccine are not following the other fundamental of small doseages. Homeopathic is thoroughly rejected by the FDA and all those other 3 lettered dumbasses. But homeopathic is declared safe for use as directed.
Rejecting homeopathic other principal of small dose is a big mistake because it over looks the bodies amazing ability to protect itself. If vaccines were in homepathic dose all the problems with vaccine would disappear.
 
Yeah, I'm just going to point out that regardless what the reason is for these parents not vaccinating,
At no point have I heard anyone in medicine try to address the reasons they don't vaccinate.

It's always crackpot this and religious zealot that... never "well gee, you know what, I guess we really are involved in some massively shitty science with respect to autism, so maybe we ought to stop that and figure out why 1 in 68 kids is now autistic, because if that goes any higher our entire society is going to genuinely collapse, and the parents might actually have weighed that against a statistically insignificant number of measles cases".

Makes me wonder how these jackasses managed to get through 8 years of college.
 
Yeah, I'm just going to point out that regardless what the reason is for these parents not vaccinating,
At no point have I heard anyone in medicine try to address the reasons they don't vaccinate.

It's always crackpot this and religious zealot that... never "well gee, you know what, I guess we really are involved in some massively shitty science with respect to autism, so maybe we ought to stop that and figure out why 1 in 68 kids is now. autistic, because if that goes any higher our entire society is going to genuinely collapse, and the parents might actually have weighed that against a statistically insignificant number of measles cases".

Makes me wonder how these jackasses managed to get through 8 years of college.

I wonder too.
 
I don't know how many of you are familar with the Homeopathic principal of like cures like I think vaccines were built around this principal in the beginning. The people who create new vaccine are not following the other fundamental of small doseages. Homeopathic is thoroughly rejected by the FDA and all those other 3 lettered dumbasses. But homeopathic is declared safe for use as directed.
Rejecting homeopathic other principal of small dose is a big mistake because it over looks the bodies amazing ability to protect itself. If vaccines were in homepathic dose all the problems with vaccine would disappear.

I definitely agree. The homeopathic nosodes are not injected, they are given orally and are not loaded down with toxic ingredients that go straight to your bloodstream.

The Cuban Experience
In October and November 2007, three provinces of the eastern region of Cuba were affected by strong rainfalls causing widespread floods severe damage to sanitary and health systems. The risk of leptospirosis infection was raised to extremely dangerous levels with about 2 million of people exposed to potentially contaminated water. The Finlay Institute (which manufactures vaccines for South America and Africa) prepared a leptospira nosode 200 CH using 4 circulating strains and following international quality standards. A multidisciplinary team travelled to the affected regions to conduct the massive administration of the nosode. Coordinated action with public health system infrastructures allowed the administration of a preventive treatment. Prevention consisted of two doses (7- 9 days apart) of the nosode to over 2.2 million of people (4.5 million doses). The coverage of the intervention rose up to 95% of total population of the three provinces most at risk.

The epidemiology surveillance after the intervention showed a dramatic decrease of morbidity two weeks after and a reduction to zero mortality of hospitalized patients. The number of confirmed leptospirosis cases remains at low levels, and below the expected levels according to the trends and rain regimens. A reinforcing application of nearly 4,500,000 doses was given in 2008 after the hit of the hurricane IKE but using the nosode potentized to 10-MCH. Strict epidemiologic surveillance was carried out on the targeted provinces. Published results show that the incidence of the disease was unchanged in the three intervened regions (the 3 regions most at risk due to the greatest level of hurricane damage), but rose significantly in the rest of the country where the HP program was not used. It provided overwhelming evidence of the effectiveness of the HP intervention. As a consequence, the Cuban Government directed the Finlay Institute to homeopathically immunise the entire country over 12 months of age against Swine Flu in 2009/10 (over 9.8 million people).

More data from Cuba will be released in the coming years regarding the leptospirosis and other interventions, such as their new HP immunisation against Dengue Fever (for which there is no vaccine available).

This immunization program undertaken by the Finlay Institute (a W.H.O. registered vaccine manufacturer) cost around $400,000US. It indicates that the entire population of Australia could be homoeopathically immunised for around $10,000,000. This cost applies for homeopathic immunization against any infectious disease. In 2009, the Australian Government spent $200,000,000 to purchase vaccines (mostly unused) to vaccinate the Australian population against Swine Flu. In fact, most of this expenditure could have been saved using homeopathic immunization against Swine Flu, and this calculation can be repeated many times given the large vaccination schedule now current in Australia. But further, the homeopathic option is non-toxic, and would remove the risk of using a little tested vaccine. We know in America when mass swine flu vaccination was last used that people died from the vaccine and hundreds were permanently damaged, costing the American Government billions in compensation.
http://www.homstudy.net/Research/


Large-scale application of highly-diluted bacteria for Leptospirosis epidemic control.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20674839
 
Don't blame it on the government. Government is made up of people. People like you. YOU think it's your business. People like you act like you generally care more about my kid than I care myself. People like you are lazy and arrogant.

Anyway, seatbelt laws were actually pushed heavily by the car companies as early as the 1970s. They saw airbags being pushed and saw the grand expense of them. Mandatory seatbelt laws were a way to bypass that, but it hardly worked out that way. Thanks Ralph Nader. Thanks big government types. Thanks PRB.

No, I don't think it's my business. I explicitly said that and you insist on saying the opposite.

I may be lazy and arrogant, but I am not a liberal and I don't believe the government should force parents to care for their child.
 
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I think the point is not whether people are vaccinated or not, but that someone came to Disneyland while they were sick with a contagious disease. This is the same thing that happens when sick people travel other places. It can be a big deal if some sort of contagious disease hits a flight or gathering of people. Touch a doorknob or utensil at a buffet, the next ten people are exposed. And then it's all Disney's fault. No, it's the fault of the person who came sick or brought a sick child.

Know the symptoms of disease. If you are sick, stay home. Don't send kids to school when they are sick.

it's not just a mortality or hospitalization issue. It's also a productivity issue. People who should not be sick suddenly are and have to miss work. Their kids have to miss school. Sick people should stay home.
 
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Flashback:

Medical staff warned: Keep your mouths shut about illegal immigrants or face arrest

Editor's note: The contractor running the refugee camp at Lackland Air Force Base is "BCFS," not "Baptist Family and Children's Services" -- as noted in a previous version of this story.

A government-contracted security force threatened to arrest doctors and nurses if they divulged any information about the contagion threat at a refugee camp housing illegal alien children at Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas, sources say.

In spite of the threat, several former camp workers broke their confidentiality agreements and shared exclusive details with me about the dangerous conditions at the camp. They said taxpayers deserve to know about the contagious diseases and the risks the children pose to Americans. I have agreed to not to disclose their identities because they fear retaliation and prosecution.

My sources say Americans should be very concerned about the secrecy of the government camps.

“There were several of us who wanted to talk about the camps, but the agents made it clear we would be arrested,” a psychiatric counselor told me. “We were under orders not to say anything.”

The sources said workers were guarded by a security force from the BCFS, which the Department of Health and Human Services hired to run the Lackland Camp.

The sources say security forces called themselves the “Brown Shirts.”

“It was a very submissive atmosphere,” the counselor said. “Once you stepped onto the grounds, you abided by their laws – the Brown Shirt laws.”

She said the workers were stripped of their cellphones and other communication devices. Anyone caught with a phone was immediately fired.

“Everyone was paranoid,” she said. “The children had more rights than the workers.”

She said children in the camp had measles, scabies, chicken pox and strep throat as well as mental and emotional issues.

“It was not a good atmosphere in terms of health,” she said. “I would be talking to children and lice would just be climbing down their hair.”

A former nurse at the camp told me she was horrified by what she saw.

“We have so many kids coming in that there was no way to control all of the sickness – all this stuff coming into the country,” she said. “We were very concerned at one point about strep going around the base.”

Both the counselor and the nurse said their superiors tried to cover up the extent of the illnesses.

“When they found out the kids had scabies, the charge nurse was adamant – ‘Don’t mention that. Don’t say scabies,’” the nurse recounted. “But everybody knew they had scabies. Some of the workers were very concerned about touching things and picking things up. They asked if they should be concerned, but they were told don’t worry about it.”

Continued...
 
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I think the point is not whether people are vaccinated or not, but that someone came to Disneyland while they were sick with a contagious disease. This is the same thing that happens when sick people travel other places. It can be a big deal if some sort of contagious disease hits a flight or gathering of people. Touch a doorknob or utensil at a buffet, the next ten people are exposed. And then it's all Disney's fault. No, it's the fault of the person who came sick or brought a sick child.

The source person is the cause, but it's not a fault unless it was intentional. Besides, nobody is obligated to keep anybody safe, it's definitely not Disneyland's fault.

Know the symptoms of disease. If you are sick, stay home. Don't send kids to school when they are sick.

Why should I stay home? I have the right to travel and endanger other people.

it's not just a mortality or hospitalization issue. It's also a productivity issue. People who should not be sick suddenly are and have to miss work. Their kids have to miss school. Sick people should stay home.

Why should I care if other people get sick and lose productivity? They're not my employees, I didn't ask them to risk getting infected by not vaccinating. They made the choice to leave their house, they risk getting sick and losing productivity. Sick people are people too, and they deserve just the same rights as healthy people to go out and be social. Your immunity is not my responsibility.
 
She said children in the camp had measles, scabies, chicken pox and strep throat as well as mental and emotional issues.

Big deal! people have had those diseases for decades if not centuries, humanity is still alive. Who cares?
 
No, I don't think it's my business.

Then stop making it your business. Progressive liberals like you insist that everyone else pay, but refuse to lift a finger. If you're so concerned about children, then adopt one. There are plenty of orphans. You insist on welfare, but refuse to open your wallet.
 
Big deal! people have had those diseases for decades if not centuries, humanity is still alive. Who cares?

The U.S. government opened up the flood gates and allow third world people in, who have lived in unsanitary areas, are malnourished and ill-- so when those disease start up again, it's blamed on people who do not want the toxic vaccines and it becomes a big deal.
 
Why should I stay home? I have the right to travel and endanger other people.

Sorry, but no. Your rights end where mine start.

You do not have a right to go to Disneyland and infect people with measles. Disneyland is not public property. Nobody has a "right" to be there. An admission ticket is a revocable license. The attraction has the right to deny entrance to anyone they deem not to be in accordance with health and safety standards, and they can remove anyone they deem not acting in accordance with health and safety standards. They can revoke your license to be there, and if you want to try to recover your admission price in small claims court, go ahead and try.

If you are sick with a contagious disease, a hotel can throw you out. They have a lot of other people for whom their health and safety are of concern, and if kicking you out will give them one less thing to worry about, they will do it.
 
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