20% Is Good! Keep It In Perspective...

[coffeewithchess]

You don't seem to have a clue about what's going on.

What's that? Again, perhaps I'm missing the point of donating millions to a campaign...that will roll that money into CFL when it's finished?
What clues am I missing? 2008, RP raised 30+ million, and rolled I think $6 million into CFL at the end of it.

Currently, most of CFL's "staff" is on "leave", working for RP's campaign...raising millions of dollars, yet not addressing issues that are holding RP back from doing better than he could be...

Again, what am I missing here?

 

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Your recent posts have essentially all been negative, and I don't want you spreading negativity to the rest of the supporters. The last thing they need is to be demotivated by a negative Nancy. What kind of a soldier does that after a few setbacks? Weak.

A FEW setbacks? Come on. This campaign has been trending downward since the results of Iowa. When they had momentum coming out of New Hampshire, they somehow managed to botch that in South Carolina, resulting in a last place finish. And I don't think I need to tell you about Paul's percentage in Florida. There is no point in deluding yourself with comparing the numbers between this election and '08 when Paul is failing to show how he is going to win even one caucus. Him coming in third in Nevada will not be of any help to him in Colorado or Minnesota.

 

[sailingaway]

What's that? Again, perhaps I'm missing the point of donating millions to a campaign...that will roll that money into CFL when it's finished?
What clues am I missing? 2008, RP raised 30+ million, and rolled I think $6 million into CFL at the end of it.

Currently, most of CFL's "staff" is on "leave", working for RP's campaign...raising millions of dollars, yet not addressing issues that are holding RP back from doing better than he could be...

Again, what am I missing here?

they did not roll money to cfl they rolled it to Ron's campaign account and about a million has been fed into this campaign, at least.

 

[Student Of Paulism]

Can't say Coffee doesn't have a point here.

1. No ads on health care/medicare/obamacare, something targeted at seniors, done with his wife
2. An ad with a more direct assault on the FP issue voters have with him, with contrasts shown of neocons saying the same things he has been saying, including Bush
3. The Newt/Toffler connection never being brought up a single time (just inexplicable this was never vetted in a debate, a huge nail in Newt's coffin that could be and no one wants to talk about it)

4. Ron being too nice in debtates (yes he has had great moments this time around), but guys, ever watch the 08 debates? Huge difference in his attitude. Very direct, forceful, offensive (in a healthy way of course) and really vocal and even agitated, talked down to the moderators, very sternly. Where did all that go this year? Welp...Newt did it, and sure helped him.

5. Yes, i know they didnt spend consider SC and FL to be important, but as coffee said, it is kind of embarrassing getting beat by a guy with barely any ground game, no grassroots and nowhere near the money, two f'n times in a row. I dont think about it much, but when i do, its just really agitating.

I dunno. I too believe things could have been done better, and ill say it again, every great moment in history has a turning point, or an area you can look to that tells you 'where it went sour'. Well, look to right after Ron's NH speech, because that's where it happened. Things just weren't managed properly after that, and as Coffee said, skipping events/taking time off when complaining about being blocked out on MAJOR Establishment networks, is just, and im sorry, but completely stupid and a terrible decision. Ron would have had 3rd place in SC if not for those choices and Santorum may have dropped out after FL.

Yes, i do agree with others about the movement philosophy too though. I realize things do take time to wake up an electorate that is basically in a fucking coma and is prone to all the psyops and mind games by the media and lying politicians. It definitely wont happen over night, that is for sure. When more people wake up and stop worrying about what Lindsay Lohan is doing, and actually start to give a shit about life, their future, and the country's future, then maybe things will go our way. Until then, things will continue to be a work in progress.

Personally, I think America is screwed. Rome 2.0. Too many mindless individuals that gobble up soundbites, and more on the way thanks to our wonderful educational system.

This country will not change peacefully. Ever. Even if there are a mountain of Liberty supporters, the powers that be will never let things change.

Well, TJ did say that the tree of liberty needs to be refreshed with the blood of tyrants and patriots. Sadly, i too, believe that is just what it may take.

 

[jacmicwag]

At least we finally beat Frothy (again). On the upswing of sorts but we'll all have to dig deep to keep things moving forward.

 

[69360]

20% is good if you are trying to spread a message.

20% won't win you the white house.

 

[alucard13mmfmj]

Exactly, growing support of the Liberty movement is not the same as winning an election. Sure, Paul might influence the platform at the convention, but it will never be followed through with any sort of substance. I understand the desire to be optimistic, I really really do. But being optimistic when there is nothing to be optimistic about is kind of pointless in this instance. I'm not quite ready to throw in the towel yet, but maybe it's time to come to a conclusion that America is just not ready for a Ron Paul yet. Ron Paul strikes me more as the guy who people years from now will get pissed that we didn't put in the whitehouse. Kinda like Goldwater, but on crack. Or perhaps he will be a modern day Noah warning all about the coming flood, yet no one will listen until the flood comes. Then they will scream "Why didn't anyone warn us?!"

sadly.. in 2016, the general public will not remember why they are in this mess and vote for the same bullshit, status quo candidate. you know it and i know it. this is our last damn chance to put someone into office that we all collectively like. sure we are winning over supporters, slowly but surely.. but 4 years till next election cycle is a long time ^^ and we have trouble rallying around a "new ron paul".

maine.. CMON MAINE!! Maine is my main man!

 

[TomtheTinker]

20% is good? For the campaign that raised more than any but the guy in 1st? Perhaps, but if they lose Nevada to Newt...ahahahahahah. Personally, if they lose Nevada to Newt, RP's campaign needs to refund all donations immediately, and he needs to quit.

neg rep pile on!! I have a few other choice words for you..ill just keep them to myself this is a family movement. Get your attitude in check bro..that's not even constructive criticism.

 

[Fredom101]

RP was never going to win NV. Romney had it sewed up all along with the heavy mormon populace. 20% IS good, great in fact!

 

[anaconda]

I thought we were polling way ahead of Newt yesterday or the day before...

 

[anaconda]

Ron can still easily sink the GOP with a 3rd Party run...so what difference does it make if Mittens or Newt win primaries? It's a meaningless endeavor for them. 20% is very good if those same individuals will vote for Ron in a general election.

 

[Peace&Freedom]

My thoughts on the campaign's status, from another thread:

The campaign was always betting on a delegate pickup/long term marathon strategy, mainly from February onward. Winning Iowa would have enhanced that strategy, but even as is, he achieved momentum and delegates in IA and NH ahead of projections. The real calculation is we can use the establishment's own momentum against it, by playing on the fact that they're saying the race is over, causing many Republican voters to lose interest in attending the upcoming contests. This will give an opening for the continuously energized Paul supporters to rack up a lot of caucus victories. Once that happens, the mood changes, and the prospect of Paul winning primaries increases, and accelerates the pickup of more delegates.

It's been more productive for Paul to be growing the younger population that supports liberty, than to be watering the withering older blocs who will not budge on backing the welfare and warfare state. The senior vote is the most resistant voting bloc to Paul's message, and the Hannity/O'Reilly cable audience is a hopeless enemy demographic to engage, especially on foreign policy. By avoiding wasting resources on them, to focus on the larger broadcast TV viewing audience, Paul is disempowering and punishing them for years of relentless, vicious bias, and he and the movement are much better for it.

Yes, Paul could do better on foreign policy if he challenged the "they threaten us/they attacked us" framework of the last decade, a dogma that (left unchallenged) completely shuts off most Republican ears to his message. If he went more aggressively for social conservative votes more, it would also help. But the campaign has a strategy, it is on track, and yes, the glass is half full.

 

[coffeewithchess]

neg rep pile on!! I have a few other choice words for you..ill just keep them to myself this is a family movement. Get your attitude in check bro..that's not even constructive criticism.

Refunding donations I thought was constructive criticism. Being around since the last run in 2007/08, I know many supporters then (and probably now), were making sacrifices so they could donate to the campaign.
If the campaign/supporters don't see an actual legitimate win for the nomination, I would think some of the supporters would appreciate a refund if possible.
If the supporters have the donations back, they can then choose to donate to a local candidate, or other cause.

 

[freneticentropy]

The campaign needs to be much, much more aggressive. As I and so many others here have advocated over and over, we need a solid campaign effort to address Paul's foreign policy. Without that, he has a ceiling, and it's far too low to win. He must immediately come out with a major foreign policy speech and outline 'The Paul Doctrine' for the American people. Sadly, it's probably already too late.

Sorry to the optimism police. I hope we can keep the momentum for future candidates, but in THIS election, we're losing. The ground game is simply not going to be enough. The campaign needs to throw a few 50 yard bombs, and do it immediately. They may fail, but if we don't do anything, we definitely lose.

 

[Xhin]

You guys are the opposite of the MSM during Iowa. "Nevada is where we'll make the biggest impact!" "Nevada is the heart of liberty country!" ... "If Ron Paul does badly in Nevada, then Nevada doesn't matter."

That said, I still have hope that the campaign is deliberately playing badly so the other candidates will focus on tearing each other apart instead of focusing on Paul. Basically what Peace&Freedom said.

 

[coffeewithchess]

You guys are the opposite of the MSM during Iowa. "Nevada is where we'll make the biggest impact!" "Nevada is the heart of liberty country!" ... "If Ron Paul does badly in Nevada, then Nevada doesn't matter."

That said, I still have hope that the campaign is deliberately playing badly so the other candidates will focus on tearing each other apart instead of focusing on Paul.

LOL, I have thought that RP supporters might want to start voting for Newt, to help actually cause a brokered convention. I think Newt is the one candidate with the ego to challenge Romney all the way, and if RP supporters start voting for Newt (not that I would in the general), that would perhaps increase our chances at a brokered convention.

 

[abstrusezincate]

I daresay there were many people who gave in the '07 effort who held back this time with this knowledge in mind.

The truth is while more people get the ideas, which is a good thing, they are not a majority. The majority of people don't research their politics. The problem with this movement is the requirement it has that people take responsibility for themselves and educate themselves. A large number of people who learn about the issues, care about politics, and advocate share our positions and put it out there widely. The problem is the electorate as a whole isn't anything like that.

It's people who vote because someone is tall, looks nice, goes to a church on Sunday, worked their job, or a hundred other personal reasons that have nothing to do with policy. The truth is Ron is an old man who wears the wrong size suit. And that hurts him, more than anything else, because people never really graduate from high school in too many cases: they vote for the words and the people who are pretty.

All that said, people are doing a hell of a job. I've come to think the only way it could be different is if conscientious people went to some place and emigrated en masse, but realistically, that's not going to happen. It would be one thing if there was a true frontier, but the world is smaller than that these days.

 

[Xhin]

LOL, I have thought that RP supporters might want to start voting for Newt, to help actually cause a brokered convention. I think Newt is the one candidate with the ego to challenge Romney all the way, and if RP supporters start voting for Newt (not that I would in the general), that would perhaps increase our chances at a brokered convention.

Haha, I like that idea. I'm still going to vote for Ron Paul though since in my state Gingrich is definitely going to beat Romney.

 

[abruzz0]

Politics as usual is and always has been an industry and a complete racket. Candidates don't run on issues, they run on "electability." That is, how well they can be marketed to the consumer, or in this case, the American electorate. Like any other product on the shelves, we're manipulated on a mass scale and spoon-fed whatever the mainstream marketers push on us. Of course there will always be a minority of people who see through it and try to do something about it, but the size of this monster is too large to overcome in such a relatively short period of time. Remember, we're up against decades, if not centuries of this marketing mind-control mixed with cronyism. The general public at large has absolutely no idea what's really going on in this country, nor at they probably even aware of what planet they're on.

 

[coffeewithchess]

I daresay there were many people who gave in the '07 effort who held back this time with this knowledge in mind.

The truth is while more people get the ideas, which is a good thing, they are not a majority. The majority of people don't research their politics. The problem with this movement is the requirement it has that people take responsibility for themselves and educate themselves. A large number of people who learn about the issues, care about politics, and advocate share our positions and put it out there widely. The problem is the electorate as a whole isn't anything like that.

It's people who vote because someone is tall, looks nice, goes to a church on Sunday, worked their job, or a hundred other personal reasons that have nothing to do with policy. The truth is Ron is an old man who wears the wrong size suit. And that hurts him, more than anything else, because people never really graduate from high school in too many cases: they vote for the words and the people who are pretty.

All that said, people are doing a hell of a job. I've come to think the only way it could be different is if conscientious people went to some place and emigrated en masse, but realistically, that's not going to happen. It would be one thing if there was a true frontier, but the world is smaller than that these days.

I like the idea of having a "refuge" place to try and locate, and heck, with all the millions raised/spent on politics, I would think the RP supporters might be better off donating to buy a few islands or something....it just depends what you're looking for I guess.