1.4 Million March Against Gay Marriage in France

[erowe1]

What happened to égalité? They finally have enough of it?

What's that? The French word for equality?

Now if only they had a word for entrepreneur.

 

[torchbearer]

And not one accepted my all of Christianity. My faith (Mormon) believes that children are not help accountable for their actions until they are 8 years old, and that men must be punished for their own sins and not for adam's transgressions. We do not baptize until 8 years old. That being said, Life is still precious to Christianity. Abortion ends life, and is evil. We do not have the choice to decide when someone dies.

I didn't say anything contrary to what you wrote. I just stated an obvious- if death leads to everlasting life, it should be welcomed, not feared. and i'm not advocating the world drink the Kool-Aid and get it over with, I do suggest if people really believe what they say they believe- their perspectives should reflect that reality. if your life choices end up sending you to hell- wouldn't it have been better to die as a baby?

 

[erowe1]

if death leads to everlasting life, it should be welcomed, not feared.

I don't think those are mutually exclusive.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

the world of heaven and hell- with god as judge, leaves me with a view that life is a test of being righteous and staying on a true path to god. right or wrong?
heaven is a life after death. right or wrong?
we are born without sin. right or wrong?
if we are born without sin, it is the risk of life to loose our soul through bad choices. right or wrong?
thus, the quickest path to god is to die as a baby. right or wrong?

The answer to all these questions depend on perspective. Catholics/Orthodox have a very different worldview than protestants, and protestants have some 10,000 worldviews which tend to conflict with each other. So, from what denomination's perspective do you want an answer from?

 

[jcannon98188]

I didn't say anything contrary to what you wrote. I just stated an obvious- if death leads to everlasting life, it should be welcomed, not feared. and i'm not advocating the world drink the Kool-Aid and get it over with, I do suggest if people really believe what they say they believe- their perspectives should reflect that reality. if your life choices end up sending you to hell- wouldn't it have been better to die as a baby?

Well now that gets into a whole nother subject, one not suited for this thread, and one that no two beliefs would agree on. I would be more then happy to have this discussion in the religion subforum, but not here.

 

[jmdrake]

not that I disagree with what you are saying, but others are making what I said seem unreasonable, which it is not. not if people truly believed those planks I wrote as being true.

You know, that reminds me of a thought that coalesced in my head over the weekend. Every debate about every truth, biblical or otherwise boils down to 4 "I's". Investigation (gather the facts), Interpretation (determine what they mean), Implication (what other facts derive from them), Implementation (what are you doing to do about what you learned). And "facts" are really just established or agreed upon opinions. Based on that I suppose someone could reasonably reach the same implication that you did. (Abortions are doing these kids a favor). I think the implied "implementation" (go along with abortion) is problematic for the reason I mentioned (the souls of the adults either involved or complicit). That all bears more investigation.

I understand the debate of original sin. though the argument that babies go to hell because they didn't accept jesus through a life commitment is a hard sell to the rational.

Well some get around that problem by declaring that its not the babies' lack of commitment that might cause it to go to hell, but God's lack of love for "non-elect" babies. Not sure what qualifies someone to be an elect baby, but it seems to be the election of his/her parents. So those aborted babies better hope their parents get saved! (Or rather that God has predestined those parents to be saved.)

Others, take the position that everyone eventually gets saved anyway. Personally? I assume God has this all figured out as far as the afterlife is concerned and just try to have the best life possible and help others do the same.

 

[Ranger29860]

Dont see anything wrong with that. Marriage is religious institution between man and woman. Just like apple is apple and not orange. Gay are trying to force people to call marriage institution between anyone or forcing people to call apple orange. In this case gays are acting like aggressors. Do whatever you want with your life but get out of my bedroom my house and my church. Apple is not an orange no matter how you spin it how you push, whine, insult and lobby it to be.


Also keep in mind that this is not just about gay marriage. it is about lot more. Some of it was mentioned in article:



.. and some of it was not mentioned at all.

I think what you meant to say was "Marriage is a religious institution defined as a man and a woman for YOUR religion. The religious institution crap is not a valid argument against gay marriage (marriage as in state contract marriage not a ceremony)since you can not force your religion on me nor can I on you. Also no one is forcing you or your church to call something anything.

The aggressors in the gay marriage case are the states that are trying to define marriage between one man and one woman (again a religious definition)see prop 8 as an example.

Also has there been a case where someone has tried to force a church to marry them (as in the ceremony)? I would not be shocked if there has been but I really doubt a state has passed a law or a judge has ruled that churches can not refuse to marry LBGT people.

If you think that gay people are somehow wrong in this view of aggression or have no legitimate qualms with what some of these cases, laws, or protest mean for them I would suggest you go back and read the history of how gay people were treated all through last century and then compare it to other groups like women and minorities groups that were treated in a way that we are appalled at today. (here is a hint - involuntary electro shock therapy)

 

[S.Shorland]

I don't care what people do as long as they don't bring it into the church.People's tendency is to believe that their own sin is right.That leads to Jezebels and 'everything is accepted and honourable'.We're perfectly free but that should bring forth gratitude and humility rather than pride in sin.

 

[The Free Hornet]

What's that? The French word for equality?

Now if only they had a word for entrepreneur.

They do, depardieu, but it is the same word for fat fucking Frenchman fleeing France for freedom.

 

[The Free Hornet]

What's that? The French word for equality?

Now if only they had a word for entrepreneur.

Sorry, I missed your joke the first time.

en·tre·pre·neur (ntr-pr-nûr, -nr)
n.
A person who organizes, operates, and assumes the risk for a business venture.
[French, from Old French, from entreprendre, to undertake; see enterprise.]
entre·pre·neuri·al adj.
entre·pre·neuri·al·ism, entre·pre·neurism n.
entre·pre·neurship n.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/entrepreneur

 

[amy31416]

That awkward moment...

When one forum member dresses another down for being as big a jerk as he can be?

 

[TER]

14 years of theological study. read the book many times. have learned the doctrine and beliefs of many people. and for each answer you declare wrong, you don't bother to say why its wrong, and what would be correct. perhaps it is you who hasn't read the bible? if i'm wrong, tell me the how/why.

And yet you still haven't learned that the name God is capitalized, and not spelled 'god' (as you so wantonly and intentionally prefer to write). Do you try to insult God or just Christians?

 

[whoisjohngalt]

When you take pride in being associated as a libertarian,which is supposed to believe that a person can do whatever they want as long as that don't hurt someone else.Yet you belittle and demean anothers opinion simply because you disagree with it.

First of all, I agree with you that it's desirable to not be judgmental.

That being said, you characterize libertarianism incorrectly. It is only the idea that you can't use force to prevent someone else from doing something that isn't a violation of another's rights to life, liberty, or property. You can have opinions and belittle and demean all you want while being a consistent libertarian.

 

[whoisjohngalt]

I don't care what people do as long as they don't bring it into the church.People's tendency is to believe that their own sin is right.That leads to Jezebels and 'everything is accepted and honourable'.We're perfectly free but that should bring forth gratitude and humility rather than pride in sin.

How about disgust at your judgement? Is that a sin you self righteous piece of shit? Suck a dick.

 

[Ranger29860]

And yet you still haven't learned that the name God is capitalized, and not spelled 'god' (as you so wantonly and intentionally prefer to write). Do you try to insult God or just Christians?

lol, not sure if you are serious there. If you are then god help you.

 

[speciallyblend]

1.4 million tyrants. bottom line remove marriage from gov or stfu on gay marriage. who cares if gays marry? Christians did not copyright marriage they actually copied it from pagans! Doesn't matter if gays marry or not unless your being forced against your will! end of story

 

[Deborah K]

 

[torchbearer]

And yet you still haven't learned that the name God is capitalized, and not spelled 'god' (as you so wantonly and intentionally prefer to write). Do you try to insult God or just Christians?

was anything capitalized in my post?

 

[torchbearer]

You know, that reminds me of a thought that coalesced in my head over the weekend. Every debate about every truth, biblical or otherwise boils down to 4 "I's". Investigation (gather the facts), Interpretation (determine what they mean), Implication (what other facts derive from them), Implementation (what are you doing to do about what you learned). And "facts" are really just established or agreed upon opinions. Based on that I suppose someone could reasonably reach the same implication that you did. (Abortions are doing these kids a favor). I think the implied "implementation" (go along with abortion) is problematic for the reason I mentioned (the souls of the adults either involved or complicit). That all bears more investigation.



Well some get around that problem by declaring that its not the babies' lack of commitment that might cause it to go to hell, but God's lack of love for "non-elect" babies. Not sure what qualifies someone to be an elect baby, but it seems to be the election of his/her parents. So those aborted babies better hope their parents get saved! (Or rather that God has predestined those parents to be saved.)

Others, take the position that everyone eventually gets saved anyway. Personally? I assume God has this all figured out as far as the afterlife is concerned and just try to have the best life possible and help others do the same.

right. and at least you don't throw a lil' flame turd at my post and get others to snicker with it.
this forum has become a place of group think and not welcoming to those who say things that aren't popular. of course, the site is dedicated to a person who constantly said things that weren't popular.
I didn't really see any detailed refutation of my points. just addendums or caveats.

 

[torchbearer]

The answer to all these questions depend on perspective. Catholics/Orthodox have a very different worldview than protestants, and protestants have some 10,000 worldviews which tend to conflict with each other. So, from what denomination's perspective do you want an answer from?

each person answers the questions from their perspective. the debate is more for each individual, than it is to convince of anything. if you think about something you've never thought about- that is a good thing.