Why the IRS?

[jfer45]

Why does Ron Paul want to abolish the IRS? Don't they just collect taxes and enforce tax law?

 

[ButchHowdy]

Ron Paul wants to abolish the IRS and replace it with NOTHING!

His argument is that they contribute less than a third to the gov't coffers and by curbing spending, we could even reduce that.

That is, simultaneously nixing the federal reserve as well.

 

[jfer45]

Where does the other 2/3 come from?

 

[DrStrabismus]

I think he also feels it's unconstitutional. That's usually his reason, ultimately.

 

[Melchior]

Why does Ron Paul want to abolish the IRS? Don't they just collect taxes and enforce tax law?

Have you watched AFTF? The IRS is literally a criminal organization. They are capable of more and do more than just "collect taxes."

 

[jfer45]

AFTF? No I have not... Where can I watch it?

 

[TheConstitutionLives]

AFTF? No I have not... Where can I watch it?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?d...832&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

 

[Misesian]

Why does Ron Paul want to abolish the IRS? Don't they just collect taxes and enforce tax law?

Not at all. There actually is no law.

1.) There is not Act of Congress that has established the IRS post 16th amendment. It is not legally a federal government agency.

2.) There is no law that defines income tax as being wages. There are court rulings that also set this as precedence and define what income is as allowed under the 16th amendment.

Also it's worth mentioning that the 16th amendment was never legally ratified. They didn't have enough states that certified the amendment that the federal government sent to them, but then Secretary of State Knox illegally stamped the amendment as certified.

This is all moot unless we can get a majority of Supreme Court justices that would think of all these points and rule as Constitutionalists. Then they would overturn much more than the Income Tax.

The only realistic way we're going to eliminate the Income Tax and the IRS is from the FairTax plan which is gaining a LOT of grassroots steam as well as in Congress as well. It is not perfect by any stretch of the means but the first part of the grassroots plan is to eliminate the Income Tax Law, and the IRS, which it does. The 2nd part of the plan is to repeal the 16th amendment, which only allows income taxation but does not require it.

The FairTax IS flawed in the sense that the FairTax.org organization chose to remain non-partisan so the plan is revenue neutral, and it also protects the poor (though does it in a way that still treats everybody equally). I support this just because it's the only real way we have a chance (I will say by 2012 it will pass) to eliminate the biggest portion of socialism in our government anytime soon without bloodshed. Ron Paul is a supporter just not a cosponsor of the bill.

www.FairTax.org

 

[mikelovesgod]

Because collecting taxes on income is un-Constitutional. That's the easy answer. Taxing someone's income has no basis in the Constitutional design of the country. If we were socialist you might be right.

Also, Paul is in favor of a fair tax (I believe) which taxes good and services so you cannot avoid taxes to what is fair to true supported gov't departments that can be sanctioned by the Constitution.

 

[angrydragon]

Besides individual income taxes, the government's revenue also comes from corporate income taxes, social insurance taxes, excise taxes, estate and gift taxes, customs duties, and miscellaneous receipts.

http://www.mises.org/story/2552

 

[jd603]

Also, we're paying interest on money we borrow from "central banks". we don't need to be paying that interest, it is the american people paying it. Watch "The Money Masters" , it explains how the federal reserve and the IRS operates. Or, "Freedom to Fascism" for a more shocking in-your-face look.

Keep in mind Ron doesn't condone not paying your taxes, but he is aware that the tax laws need to be reformed, he is the only candidate that dares to question the system. JFK was just about to do just that before they assassinated him, possibly a coincidence but probably not.

I wouldn't even be paying attention to politics right now if it wasn't for Ron Paul, I just hope he's able to catch on and there's enough people that understand what he stands for...

 

[CJLauderdale4]

Just an FYI..

The IRS collects ONLY income taxes. It does not manage the collection of other forms of revenue. The Treasury Dept. handles the rest.

No income taxes - no IRS.

If Ron doesn't staff all of the Cabinet Departments he claims he will like to see removed, that's a big savings... 2/3, I'm not sure...

 

[Harald]

Because collecting taxes on income is un-Constitutional. That's the easy answer. Taxing someone's income has no basis in the Constitutional design of the country.

Mike,

What about 16th amendment?

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

 

[Gee]

Erm, the IRS is constitutional, unless you don't believe the stories about how the 16th amendment wasn't ratified properly. But thats really a case for the courts.

In any case, Paul is against it because income taxes are incredibly complicated, and everyone hates filing out all the paper work involved. Wealthier people can hire others to do it for them, and can use the complexity of the system to find loopholes. Really, any simpler system would probably be much, much better. The income tax code is so complicated, I don't think any one person really understands it all.

 

[Shmuel Spade]

Please read this: The Income Tax: Root of all Evil

Ignore any arguments about the taxes being "legal" or not, ignore any arguments about the IRS being a criminal organization, ignore any arguments about the legitimacy of amendments. The argument is purely a moral one, and is applicable whether or not any "laws" support something.

 

[jfer45]

Let us assume that the 16th Amendment was properly ratified. Does the IRS have the legal capacity to create and enforce an income tax code?

Wouldn't this be similar to the Environmental Protection Agency in that they have the ability to pass regulations?

 

[peruvianRP]

Mike,

What about 16th amendment?

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

True but the definition of Income in the constitution does not state hta tis wages and labor but profits and gains from business.

Check it out. I will be so happy the day I stop paying fed income taxes. I don't pay full now just 1/2

 

[wwycher]

Income tax is collected to pay the intrest on the federal deficit. The 16th ammendment was ratifiedthe same year the Federal Reserve was created. Every country that has come under the thumb of a central bank has had to tax the wages of it's people to pay off the intrest on their debt. Transfer of wealth, now you see it and now you don't, except in our country, where you never see it. The Grace Commission said that not one cent of our income taxes went to any of the services we expect from our government.
There is no law that states it's manditory to fill out a 1040. I like the way Mr.Russo put it "If the mob tells you have to pay $2000 to live in their neighboorhood, you better do it." It's no different with the IRS, if you don't pay them what they think you owe them, you go to jail and they take everything you own. Only with the mob you go to the government for protection.
If Dr. Paul has his way this fraud will end. It's sickening the way they have made it out to patriotic to be raped by your government. There is no law, they just do it.

 

[Texan4Life]

Where does the other 2/3 come from?

Your not the only on jfer45... Where does the other money come from?

 

[kylejack]

Its more like a little less than half.

"According to the Congressional Budget Office, the total revenue of the federal government during its most recently completed fiscal year (FY 2006) was $2.406 trillion. Individual income taxes accounted for $1.043 trillion of the government's total take."