enhanced_deficit
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Why Ron Paul Supporters Should Vote For Bernie Sanders
- Thread starter Adam133
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I think I can finally come out of the closet on this one
I'm really not a huge fan of Sanders at all, but I would highly consider voting for him over Bush.
If that's the case, I'll just take George Carlin's approach to voting, tyvm. No point in even voting at that point.....even the illusion of the vote mattering would be lost.
erowe1
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That article includes the important qualification "actively publishing climate scientists." In other words, they narrow it down to the scientists who are involved in government funded research. But they can't get government funding unless they agree to propagate the government's line on global warming.
If you don't like that statistic, have another one:
Look at the graph and read the data:
1. When compared with pre-1800s levels, do you think that mean global temperatures have generally risen, fallen, or remained relatively constant?
2. Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?
90% of participants answered “risen” to question 1.
82% answered 'yes' to question 2.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2009EO030002/epdf
Feeding the Abscess
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I haven't read through the rest of the thread, but if I may ask the OP something:
What is the issue that animates you most? Top three issues? Top five?
Conversely, are there any issues that would automatically disqualify a candidate in your view?
What is the issue that animates you most? Top three issues? Top five?
Conversely, are there any issues that would automatically disqualify a candidate in your view?
His foreign policy and civil liberties positions, along with his relative lack of corruption, make him arguably the second-best candidate in this election behind only Rand Paul. But Ron Paul supporters interested in voting in this election should certainly vote for Rand before Sanders.
kcchiefs6465
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'Arguably' would be putting it mildly.
I'd put him on the level with Donald Trump. And if Donald Trump's tax plan was actually legit, Trump would be better.
Bernie Sanders is what, like an 8 on FreedomWorks?
The, 'Americans would be better off if we had a government organization determining if a given endeavor was 'useful' or 'hazardous,' robbing 'the people' (see: people), subsidizing those who HE thinks should be subsidized, unabashed socialist?
I'd write in Jar Jar Binks before that fool. And that's assuming I'd waste the gas to stand in line.
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hells_unicorn
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If it was Sanders vs. Bush, it would be the same as Clinton vs. Bush. I'd stay home if I wasn't a poll worker, but since I can't I'd probably support a 3rd candidate in. I'm amazed at how this guy keeps coming here thinking we'll back Sanders.
acptulsa
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But the OP has faith that he doesn't need to hit us over the head to make us stupid enough to buy that the establishment media is playing Sanders up and giving him air time because Sanders is anti-establishment. See, he thinks the establishment is as stupid as he is. That's why he thinks the path to liberty is letting a socialist dole us out dribs and drabs of liberty instead of electing a libertarian and quitting tyranny cold turkey.
And either he thinks we're also as stupid as he is, or he thinks his own stupidity is contagious. But he's the one getting hit over the head. With his own foolishness, at that.
angelatc
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Democracy is evil.
angelatc
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We didn't keep temperature records prior to the 1800s. And just because a majority believe something to be true does not make it true, so the polling is only reflective of the messaging, not the reality.
Socialism and it's sister, Communism, are tyrannical and controlling and corrupt and inefficient, but the message that people get is that it's warm and caring and will give us all free ponies because that's the messages that the children get.
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cajuncocoa
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OK, I've spoken with one of these kids recently (and I use the term "kid" loosely...a high school friend of my sons, meaning he's in his late 20s) My head almost exploded, but I think I won the discussion in the end.
This young man knows I was an RP supporter (as he was) in 2008 & 2012...he was attempting to convince me that I should consider Bernie Sanders. He pointed out Bernie's anti-war stance, determination to slash the military budget, and opposition to the war on drugs. "OK," I said, "but do you know Bernie's a socialist? That's a deal breaker for me. I can't support a socialist."
The young man proceeds to tell me we're headed that way anyway, and his generation has little faith it can be stopped (and he disturbingly wondered if it would be so bad anyway since we'd have all these other freedoms -- see above. I tried to explain exactly how they most certain could be so bad!!)
He said he and many of his friends (not including my sons, thank God) like Bernie because he "shakes things up." They sort of like Trump for the same reason. If neither gets their party nomination, he hopes they both run as independent candidates...he thinks they could really make a statement against the 2-party monopoly like never before. This is where he really tried to pressure me to vote for either of them if Rand doesn't get the nomination...he knows I won't budge from that at this point. I still refused...I told him that I would either vote LP (but not Gary Johnson) or stay home. I will NOT vote for a socialist!! He chastised me with that tired line about throwing my vote away when I could really make a difference this time.
I have to point out here, we've had discussions before about whether our votes even count anymore...whether elections are decided even before we (the people) get to the voting booth on Election Day. He knows all about corporations buying politicians and, therefore their influence on elections. I asked him what makes him think it would be different this time? Does he really believe the oligarchy will really allow a Trump or Sanders to be elected if they really had intentions of "shaking things up?" No, of course not. (And I still think this is true about Rand, and it was true about Ron, too.) My son's friend acknowledged this. I wrapped it up by telling him, "at least , if I do vote, I will be able to sleep at night knowing I didn't contribute to the continuing slide toward socialism. Because if that happens, you will look back on this conversation and wonder how you could possibly think it couldn't be so bad."
This young man knows I was an RP supporter (as he was) in 2008 & 2012...he was attempting to convince me that I should consider Bernie Sanders. He pointed out Bernie's anti-war stance, determination to slash the military budget, and opposition to the war on drugs. "OK," I said, "but do you know Bernie's a socialist? That's a deal breaker for me. I can't support a socialist."
The young man proceeds to tell me we're headed that way anyway, and his generation has little faith it can be stopped (and he disturbingly wondered if it would be so bad anyway since we'd have all these other freedoms -- see above. I tried to explain exactly how they most certain could be so bad!!)
He said he and many of his friends (not including my sons, thank God) like Bernie because he "shakes things up." They sort of like Trump for the same reason. If neither gets their party nomination, he hopes they both run as independent candidates...he thinks they could really make a statement against the 2-party monopoly like never before. This is where he really tried to pressure me to vote for either of them if Rand doesn't get the nomination...he knows I won't budge from that at this point. I still refused...I told him that I would either vote LP (but not Gary Johnson) or stay home. I will NOT vote for a socialist!! He chastised me with that tired line about throwing my vote away when I could really make a difference this time.
I have to point out here, we've had discussions before about whether our votes even count anymore...whether elections are decided even before we (the people) get to the voting booth on Election Day. He knows all about corporations buying politicians and, therefore their influence on elections. I asked him what makes him think it would be different this time? Does he really believe the oligarchy will really allow a Trump or Sanders to be elected if they really had intentions of "shaking things up?" No, of course not. (And I still think this is true about Rand, and it was true about Ron, too.) My son's friend acknowledged this. I wrapped it up by telling him, "at least , if I do vote, I will be able to sleep at night knowing I didn't contribute to the continuing slide toward socialism. Because if that happens, you will look back on this conversation and wonder how you could possibly think it couldn't be so bad."
cajuncocoa
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I want to add this to the above: I can understand how his generation has lost faith in the economic system. This is a generation that still struggles to find jobs in fast food restaurants after college graduation. (My sons are looking OK...one is a music teacher, the other is going back for his Education degree, he wants to teach Biology.)
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acptulsa
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Still hoping for change--and still going back to the same source hoping to get it.
Did you define 'insanity' for the guy?
dannno
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Our buddy adam will do well to watch this.. I gave him a brief history of the last couple thousand years of climate history and he completely ignored it, he would do well to go back and read my posts in detail but this video will give him and even broader perspective as it goes back much further.
bunklocoempire
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y u like force?
cajuncocoa
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He wasn't an Obamabot the last go-round. He was one of us...but getting disillusioned.
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