"Why I won't vote for Ron Paul" and My Reposte

[Paul Or Nothing II]

I've met and spoke with people like your friend. While they're very smart, all they're logic comes back to the idea of people in government behaving like they should behave. I guess you could say they're idealists.........

+1

Well said. And what I usually find really funny about these big-government people is that they THINK libertarianism is unrealistic & out of touch with reality when the fact is that THEY are being unrealistic & out of touch with reality by not recognizing the fact that governments are made up of self-interested people just as much as private sector is so it's foolish to hand more & more to the government & expect them not to use it to advance their self-interests

 

[Paul Or Nothing II]

They "thought" that they were "informed" but most people that I know who voted for Obama simply hated Bush and Republicans and were the same one's who cited to me over the years all sort of conspiracy theories about Bush and blamed him for everything from cloudy days to their mother's giving birth to them in a back alley.
They were "informed" by strictly liberal blogs, mainstream media and each other. Few to none cared a bit about the Constitution, freedom or prosperity. They couldn't and still can't grasp the fact that Democrats were and still are the original war party, police the world party, the one world govt party, the freedom robbing-anti individual choice party. To them it's all "Republican bad bad bad-Democrat good good good". They are every bit as irrational as ANY loyal partisan whether Republican or Democrat and maybe even more so. To this day most of the people who voted for Obama will say NOTHING about his globocop trots into Libya, Uganda, Somalia, Sudan, Pakistan or his broken promises relative to Iraq and Afghanistan. They say nothing about his corporate welfare, bail outs and buy outs or his freedom robbing re-authorization of the Patriot Act, signing of NDAA or support of SOPA and his continued authoritarianism relative to the war on drugs-medical marijuani raids in California.
I am actually talking baout some of my closest friends here by the way along with people I encounter on a daily basis.

The partisan mind is inherently an irrational mind no matter what level of intelligence or how many years of formal education. In fact, I am becoming more and more convinced that the longer one remains in a formal educational setting, the less rational they become.

+1

 

[cajuncocoa]

They "thought" that they were "informed" but most people that I know who voted for Obama simply hated Bush and Republicans and were the same one's who cited to me over the years all sort of conspiracy theories about Bush and blamed him for everything from cloudy days to their mother's giving birth to them in a back alley.
They were "informed" by strictly liberal blogs, mainstream media and each other. Few to none cared a bit about the Constitution, freedom or prosperity. They couldn't and still can't grasp the fact that Democrats were and still are the original war party, police the world party, the one world govt party, the freedom robbing-anti individual choice party. To them it's all "Republican bad bad bad-Democrat good good good". They are every bit as irrational as ANY loyal partisan whether Republican or Democrat and maybe even more so. To this day most of the people who voted for Obama will say NOTHING about his globocop trots into Libya, Uganda, Somalia, Sudan, Pakistan or his broken promises relative to Iraq and Afghanistan. They say nothing about his corporate welfare, bail outs and buy outs or his freedom robbing re-authorization of the Patriot Act, signing of NDAA or support of SOPA and his continued authoritarianism relative to the war on drugs-medical marijuani raids in California.
I am actually talking baout some of my closest friends here by the way along with people I encounter on a daily basis.

The partisan mind is inherently an irrational mind no matter what level of intelligence or how many years of formal education. In fact, I am becoming more and more convinced that the longer one remains in a formal educational setting, the less rational they become.

I completely agree with this (+1 rep); it was my own experience with Obama supporters as well, as I previously mentioned in this thread.

Among other reasons Obamabots (at least those I was communicating with in 2008) were drooling over him include: they thought he was super-cool(!) and that he looked really, really HOT while walking shirtless on the beach in Hawaii. Not kidding at all.

 

[beezle]

why bother?

This was part of a discussion I was having with one of my Obama supporting, liberal acquaintances and why he said he wont vote for Ron Paul. I am now planning on researching each one of these individual "complaints" and responding to them in detail (I don't have anything better to do). I figured it would be a good idea to post it here, not only to potentially aid others but in hopes of some additional jewels of information from this very informed community. As soon as I get my response typed up, I will make sure to post it here.

Joshua - I'll preface with I do not know what state you are registered in. But wouldn't you be better off trying to convert a few Republicans to vote for him? Why put so much effort into converting one progressive liberal? Even if you get them to grudgingly say Paul is better than Obama, are you going to get them into a poll booth to vote in a Republican primary?

 

[Joshua2585]

I suggest you all do a thorough read-through of twoggle's response. It was fantastic. Also, please upvote him as he obviously put some work and time into it. Thanks!

@beezle I have a tremendous amount of people (around 1000) that follow me pretty regularly on facebook. As such, I have had about 30-40 private messages thanking me for my coverage of the election, the congress, Ron Paul, and just general world events and political happenings. I have gotten to the point where there are quite a few people that have come to rely on me for their news. I take this pretty seriously. (the conversation i was having with this guy had about 10 people interject as well.) Through facebook alone I have gotten about 10-12 democrats to register republican in their states in order to vote for RP. I have converted several of my neo-con friends to RP supporters. I even have one guy that was 100% clueless and apathetic that has really become very outspoken on RP and has converted several people himself.

The point is, people are always watching. They are listening. The power that just one individual via social media has in affecting hundreds and potentially thousands of votes is rather astonishing. That is why I feel this is a worthwhile effort. Look at Egypt... a people's revolution started via twitter and facebook. There is power here!

 

[freeforall]

Every RP supporter I have met has been significantly more informed than the average voter. Again, are we the most informed on the planet? Political experts? No, not by any means. Do we tend to have a better working knowledge of history and politics... I think so.

This will be less true as he appeals to more average voters. There are a lot of potential voters that will never dig as deep into the issues and candidates as most of us here. Sometimes I think we miss appealing to voters on a less intellectual level. It doesn't take an above average IQ to understand integrity and freedom.

 

[Narmical]

the fact that governments are made up of THE SAME self-interested people just as much as private sector

Remember Carl Rove? well he was on Milton Friedman show "Free To Choose" as a Representative of "Big Corporations". So he was evil then, and an angel when he was in government?

 

[Chieppa1]

More often I find that they are simply libertarians who don't like government as a rule and are meer breaths away from simply being anarchists.

Yeah, I'm at that point. Guy is simply a statist. Statists just don't understand.

 

[Captain Shays]

I completely agree with this (+1 rep); it was my own experience with Obama supporters as well, as I previously mentioned in this thread.

Among other reasons Obamabots (at least those I was communicating with in 2008) were drooling over him include: they thought he was super-cool(!) and that he looked really, really HOT while walking shirtless on the beach in Hawaii. Not kidding at all.

Well at least you got a reason for their support. Have you ever seen people being asked what specific issue they support Obama on? The confused looks on their faces was fodderfor much good humor

 

[wowrevolution]

The difference between a Ron Paul supporter and everyone else is that a Ron Paul supporter is primarily concerned with eliminating the debt and everyone else wants to expand breads and circuses.

 

[cajuncocoa]

Well at least you got a reason for their support. Have you ever seen people being asked what specific issue they support Obama on? The confused looks on their faces was fodderfor much good humor

 

[Captain Shays]

If only they would ask the simple questions "who is your representative to Congress and who are your two sentators"? I ask people that all the time to seemingly intelligent people and I am amazed at how many people don't even know. This is why we're in the state we're in.

I am totally convinced at this point that the two party crimocracy thrives on a dumbed down, ill informed and un-involved electorate.