Why do the non-anarchists seem to be so anti-anarchist?

And I sees this one as the pot calling the kettle black. Or more like the pot calling the teapot black.

I see you're still self righteous and confused.

I'm historically correct on the meaning of anarchism...it isn't my fault you're willfully ignorant because you're too lazy to care.
 
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When you realize the State made that left/right shit up, you'll be on your way to clarity.

I'm not having any problem with clarity. If you want to do away with my State, then I'm sworn to take-up arms against you.

I re-read most of this thread this morning and learned that you either don't bother reading what people write, or you cannot learn, or you have an agenda. Most people adjust their thinking when new information comes to light. I hope you are one of them.
 
It's funny all the anarchists agree what the definition is for the most part, while all the non-anarchists continue to use a definition provably changed by the State over time to sound negative. Who knows what it means more? Us or you guys? It's just juvenile what your doing with semantics here. You want to be lazy about it because that's the only way it fits your argument. If you read up on it, it will immediately become clear, even with the slightest of effort.

Out of the thousands of anarchists authors who have written books and lengthy pamphlets on the subject, you will be hard pressed to find one who defines anarchism as "choas, disorder, lawlessness, and violence"...because unless the author was a nutter or a propagandized fool, 'anarchy' and 'anarchism' don't mean that.

But you're right...lol...we don't know what our own personal philosophy and code of ethics means. We didn't convert to anarchism from the run of the mill positions many of you hold or anything...lol. You're soooo right, we are the brainwashed willfully ignorant ones... LOL!

Any further response against our definition will be looked down upon as just more drivel. I want intellectual debate, not more dogmatic PC BS.
 
Link or it didn't happen.

READ BOOKS.

Try Antithenes and the subsequent Cynics, Stoics, and Eastern philosophers like Laozi in China.

Try anything by Spooner, Tucker, Thoreau, Warren (the first self described anarchist, and American), etc., etc.
Try anything by Prouhon (the first self-described anarchist outside of America).
Try Thomas Paine!
Try Rothbard, David Freidman, etc.

Try the Anarcho capitalists like Bob Murphy and Tom Woods from the Mises Institute Austrians, and the RON PAUL campaign.

Try anlmost any damned source of what anarchism is outside your PC State styled dictionaries.


This isn't complicated...anarchism means spontaneous order (a main tenant in capitalism), voluntary organization, and non-aggression except in instances of direct self defense or if harm is intended immanently. It DOES NOT mean what PC dictionaries and the State schools who taught you to trust them tell you, it DOES NOT mean chaos, disorder, or violence. Any SLIGHT FUCKING ATTEMPT to look it up for yourself will prove that.

I'm not going to link you, not because I can't, but because the Austrian school of economics is mostly an anarcho capitalist organization...and the fact you don't even realize that makes me ill. I could link you all day, but many anarchists on this forum have those links already available...but you have yet to TRY and look them up for yourself.

And so I scold you for willfull ignroance. And then you attempt to say "link it or it doesn't exist..."

...how about you get off your lazy ass and do it your self. I don't owe an education, you owe educating yourself to those you think you have the right to laud statist, sadist, sociopathic power over...

...PERIOD.

This is the moral theory I have to combat, this is the sense of entitlement. "Link me!"

You have wikipedia, google, and every other resource everyone else does. Go to Amazon and buy some damn books.
 
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It's funny all the anarchists agree what the definition is for the most part, while all the non-anarchists continue to use a definition provably changed by the State over time to sound negative. Who knows what it means more?
As far as the name, it's Greek...an- means without, archon means ruler...Archons were Greek regional tyrants, at the dawn of the city-states.
It means as you say, "without ruler."

Analyze that.
If no ruler, then no one enforces anything because there is nothing to enforce. Make a rule, then a ruler is required because unenforced rules are the same as no rules. Given a rule; Who rules? Either pick someone or don't. If someone is picked, then they are the ruler. If no one is picked then each person is their own ruler. That may be fine with two or three people but when it comes to larger groups, the strongest will dominate. When you get to millions of people it leads to chaos.
What are you talking about?
 
If you want to do away with my State, then I'm sworn to take-up arms against you.

And defend the government against the people it is obstensibly therew to make safe....thank you...you just proved why the State is too dangerous to exist, why fools mistake patriotism for nationalism, and why you sir are a sociopath.
 
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It's funny all the anarchists agree what the definition is for the most part, while all the non-anarchists continue to use a definition provably changed by the State over time to sound negative. Who knows what it means more? Us or you guys? It's just juvenile what your doing with semantics here.

Or maybe we're just acknowledging the fact that when we say it, this is the reaction we get 99 44/100% of the time. Which is hardly a philosophical outlook, we readily admit. But surely you can admit that the reactions we get when trying to defend your asses isn't exactly funny either...

You want to be lazy about it because that's the only way it fits your argument. If you read up on it, it will immediately become clear, even with the slightest of effort.

Just because it's clear doesn't mean it will work in the real world.

Out of the thousands of anarchists authors who have written books and lengthy pamphlets on the subject, you will be hard pressed to find one who defines anarchism as "choas, disorder, lawlessness, and violence"...because unless the author was a nutter or a propagandized fool, 'anarchy' and 'anarchism' don't mean that.

Sure, and we've all seen it work. In committees of six or fewer people.

But you're right...lol...we don't know what our own personal philosophy and code of ethics means. We didn't convert to anarchism from the run of the mill positions many of you hold or anything...lol. You're soooo right, we are the brainwashed willfully ignorant ones... LOL!

Don't bust a gut. But by all means, decline to participate in what is right up to totalitarianism.

Any further response against our definition will be looked down upon as just more drivel. I want intellectual debate, not more dogmatic PC BS.

So do we, PI, so do we. But, you know, want in one hand and crap in the other, and see which fills up faster...

And defend the government against the people it is obstensibly therew to make safe....thank you...you just proved why the State is too dangerous to exist, why fools mistake patriotism for nationalism, and why you sir are a sociopath.

...case in point. He's here to make the sociopaths in charge obey codified law, not to be one himself. And to say differently is false, and maybe libel.
 
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Travlyr I have nothing else to say to you...you just saif you will take up arms against me to protect the State...not the country, nation, or people (which are all synonymous), but the State (a totally separate entity). I don't care what you think you meant by that...look up those words...or better yet, read this you statist, nationalist, anti-patriot sociopath:

Traitors and Patriots: The Difference Between Nationalism and Patriotism

traitor - a person who betrays his or her country, cause, friends, etc.; one guilty of treason or treachery

(Notice it doesn't say "state" or "government", as the word "country" above does not mean either of those things. In fact, "country, "nation", "society", and "people" are all synonyms, all meaning basically the same thing...the physical people, their society, culture, and other cohesive identifiers. "State" and "government" often come in conflict with "country" and the like. For this reason, support for your government where it hurts your country is treasonist.)





Patriotism
is a love and devotion to one's country. It has had different meanings over time and its meaning is highly dependent upon context, geography, and philosophy.


It is a related sentiment to nationalism, but nationalism is not necessarily an inherent part of patriotism.

(Notice again, "country" is the word, not "state" or "government".)

The English term patriot is first attested in the Eliabethan era, via Middle French from Late Latin (6th century) patriota "fellow countryman", ultimately from Greek πατριÏ�της (patriÅ�tÄ“s) "fellow countryman". The abstract noun patriotism appears in the early 18th century.

(Notice again, "countryman"...see the theme?)





Nationalism
involves a strong identification of a group of individuals with a political entity defined in national terms, i.e. a nation. It can also include the belief that the state is of primary importance, or the belief that one state is naturally superior to all other states. It is also used to describe a movement to establish or protect a homeland (usually an autonomous state) for an ethnic group. In some cases the identification of a national culture is combined with a negative view of other races or cultures. National flags, national anthems, and other symbols of national identity are often considered sacred, as if they were religious rather than political symbols. Deep emotions are aroused.


Gellner and Breuilly, in Nations and Nationalism, contrast nationalism and patriotism. "If the nobler word 'patriotism' then replaced 'civic/Western nationalism', nationalism as a phenomenon had ceased to exist."

(As you can see, nationalism is not patriotic, it can be opposed to patriotism in fact, as it finds blind allegiance to a government to be preferable to true national interests, the interests of society, the interests of the people, and the interests of the country. A simple example is fascist nationalism, where the nations were effected detrimentally by their governments interests. Secrecy is rarely about true national security, it's usually about government security, and therefore nationalist, not patriotic.)

A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government.

-Edward Abbey











Politics, as a practise, whatever its professions, has always been the systematic organization of hatreds.
-Henry Brookes Adams


And that the said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms; or to raise standing armies, unless necessary for the defense of the United States, or of some one or more of them; or to prevent the people from petitioning, in a peaceable and orderly manner, the federal legislature, for a redress of grievances; or to subject the people to unreasonable searches and seizures of their persons, papers or possessions.
-Samuel Adams


If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.
-Samuel Adams


The freedom to read is essential to our democracy. It is continuously under attack... These actions apparently arise from a view that our national tradition of free expression is no longer valid; that censorship and suppression are needed to avoid the subversion of politics and the corruption of morals.
-quote found at the American Library Association


If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans, but Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free, Americans who have been lulled away into a false security.
-Ezra Taft Benson


The constitutional right of free speech has been declared to be the same in peace and war. In peace, too, men may differ widely as to what loyalty to our country demands, and an intolerant majority, swayed by passion or by fear, may be prone in the future, as it has been in the past, to stamp as disloyal opinions with which it disagrees.
-Justice Louis D. Brandeis


If you think we are free today, you know nothing about tyranny and even less about freedom.
-Tom Braun


Men in authority will always think that criticism of their policies is dangerous. They will always equate their policies with patriotism, and find criticism subversive.
-Henry Steele Commager


The republic was not established by cowards, and cowards will not preserve it.
-Elmer Davis


They have always taught and trained you to believe it to be your patriotic duty to go to war and to have yourselves slaughtered at their command. But in all the history of the world you, the people, have never had a voice in declaring war, and strange as it certainly appears, no war by any nation in any age has ever been declared by the people.
-Eugene Debs


But, when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security.
-Declaration of Independence


Never do anything against conscience even if the state demands it.
-Albert Einstein


Here in America we are descended in spirit from revolutionaries and rebels -- men and women who dare to dissent from accepted doctrine.
-Dwight D. Eisenhower


They [the founders] proclaimed to all the world the revolutionary doctrine of the divine rights of the common man. That doctrine has ever since been the heart of the American faith.
-Dwight D. Eisenhower


Let me write the songs of a nation - I don't care who writes its laws.
-Andrew Fletcher


Where liberty dwells, there is my country.
-Ben Franklin


The evils we experience flow from the excess of democracy. The people do not want virtue, but are the dupes of pretended patriots.
-Elbridge Gerry


None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
-Johann Wolfgang von Geothe


To oppose corruption in government is the highest obligation of patriotism.
-G. Edward Griffin


I only regret that I have but one life to lose for my country.
-Nathan Hale


From the saintly and single-minded idealist to the fanatic is often but a step.
-Frederich August von Hayek


Love your country, but never trust its government
-Robert A. Heinlein


Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death!
-Patrick Henry




The following quotes are from Mark Twain:

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."

"Man is the only Patriot. He sets himself apart in his own country, under his own flag, and sneers at the other nations, and keeps multitudinous uniformed assassins on hand at heavy expense to grab slices of other people's countries, and keep them from grabbing slices of his. And in the intervals between campaigns he washes the blood of his hands and works for "the universal brotherhood of man"- with his mouth."

"Patriotism is usually the refuge of the scoundrel. He is the man who talks the loudest."

"Patriot: the person who can holler the loudest without knowing what he is hollering about."

"We teach them to take their patriotism at second-hand; to shout with the largest crowd without examining into the right or wrong of the matter -- exactly as boys under monarchies are taught and have always been taught. We teach them to regard as traitors, and hold in aversion and contempt, such as do not shout with the crowd, and so here in our democracy we are cheering a thing which of all things is most foreign to it and out of place -- the delivery of our political conscience into somebody else's keeping. This is patriotism on the Russian plan."

"The soul and substance of what customarily ranks as patriotism is moral cowardice -- and always has been."

"[Patriotism] ...is a word which always commemorates a robbery. There isn't a foot of land in the world which doesn't represent the ousting and re-ousting of a longline of successive "owners" who each in turn, as "patriots" with proud swelling hearts defended it against the next gang of "robbers" who came to steal it and did -- and became swelling-hearted patriots in their turn."

"...the true patriotism, the only rational patriotism, is loyalty to the Nation ALL the time, loyalty to the Government when it deserves it."




Dude, you make me sick.
 
And defend the government against the people it is obstensibly therew to make safe....thank you...you just proved why the State is too dangerous to exist, why fools mistake patriotism for nationalism, and why you sir are a sociopath.

I will defend my property.
 
acptulsa, not one good point yet.


But you might go read eventually, and quit wasting your time here convincing me I don't know what anarchy means.
 
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He has made several great points.

Only if you're a statist whackjob who doesn't know what anarchy means and keeps rambling on about BS he knows nothing about, obviously. READ people, it's the most patriotic thing you can do.
 
Thank God you're not a minarchist, PI. I'd hate to have you using insult in place of argument and associated with me all along.
 
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