Who are the Koch Brothers and why are they so bad?

[Natural Citizen]

NC conveniently leaves off Amash & Massie, among others, every time he posts this. I suggest he edit them into his post next time.

Well...this data is taken from the 2010 cycle. As I recall, Massie was just announced his intention to run for the office of Lewis County Judge Executive in 2010. As for Justin, did he receive money from them in 2010? I don't think so. I could be wrong but I don't think so.

But sure...will certainly update the money trail for the current cycle. Just haven't really felt like it, compromise.

 

[Natural Citizen]

There's a good chance that he matured politically.

You know...there's also a very good chance that a frog wouldn't bump his rear end on the rocks if he had wings. Of course, Mr. Frog doesn't have wings. And so he's hopping around with a sore butt a lot of the time.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Can you please explain this statement?
Thanks.

Here you go. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalking_horse

 

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Rather ironic that you've got the name of a Koch group in your username.

When I created my account here, our campus group was created without prior knowledge of the national SFL organization. Needless to say after our members attended the Midwestern conference at University of Chicago held by SFL, we were disappointed in the Republican guests they invited to speak. And then I found out about how the Koch brothers screwed over Rothbard.

We ended up transitioning to YAL in 2012.

 

[kcchiefs6465]

Here you go. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalking_horse

Right.

And while you've sourced a definition of "stalking horse" you've yet to answer what specifically you are referring to.

I would say the stalking horse of fascism is collectivism. A large brand (though not the only) of collectivists are progressives.

It's odd you keep saying this while providing simply veiled "evidence" or allusions of it being so.

Can you expound a little [more]?

 

[Natural Citizen]

Right.

And while you've sourced a definition of "stalking horse" you've yet to answer what specifically you are referring to.

I would say the stalking horse of fascism is collectivism. A large brand (though not the only) of collectivists are progressives.

It's odd you keep saying this while providing simply veiled "evidence" or allusions of it being so.

Can you expound a little [more]?

Sure. Although I've described the phenomenon in depth elswhere more than once around the boards when it has come up. It's disingenuous to infer that I haven't.

The definition of fascism is the merge of corporation and state. Period. I just shared with you the fact that the Koch network has merged with Monsanto and aquired the services of Congressman Mike Pompeo (who has received more money from these two than anyone else in office) to introduce and attempt the industry backed legislation that specifically says that the natural citizen has no right to know or establish any mechanism to act upon their right to ever ask what it is that they are consuming into their bodies. This corporate merge with the government by way of a congressman like Miike Pompeo to legislate on behalf of these corporate interests is fascism by any sense of the word.

And here some of us are selling the Koch brothers like they are some kind of savior of liberty for the people. That's the biggest load of crap I've read on these boards. These people, along with Pompeo are disfranchising the people, bypassing the people, assuming the name of the people and operating from within the process of representation that was designed for the people. But here, in this case, the people, the real ones, have no representation or say so in the matter whatsoever. Only the interests who have aquired the services of Pompeo for a couple of hundred thousand dollars to buy a little government.

This is yet another example of a fascist model being pawned from within the liberty community as some sort of march for liberty but what is essentially happening here are that the people themselves are being disfranchised.

Now, It's early and I don't even have coffee yet so maybe I'll come back once I'm a bit more awake and explain what we have happening within the liberty community as some continue to prop up these corrupt, treasonous companies and elected representatives as some sort of liberty minded supermen as they use our processes of representation to hijack government and disfranchise the people.

There is no veiled evidence of anything. They're doing it live and in your face. And they are being celebrated for it within the liberty community.

 

[unknown]

Apparently they use their money to lobby politicians.

But somehow theyre more evil than the zillion other groups that do the same thing?

 

[otherone]

The definition of fascism is the merge of corporation and state. Period.

Thank you for the clarification, although I was hoping for something a little meatier. I disagree with your definition of fascism completely. What you are describing is corporatism, which is at odds with fascism. Corporate Oligarchy is international, and is at odds with Nationalism, the driving force behind fascism. I was hoping you could draw a link from closet fascists to present liberty types, in that fascists "take the liberty pulse" of the population by voicing libertarian causes.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Thank you for the clarification, although I was hoping for something a little meatier. I disagree with your definition of fascism completely. What you are describing is corporatism, which is at odds with fascism. Corporate Oligarchy is international, and is at odds with Nationalism, the driving force behind fascism. I was hoping you could draw a link from closet fascists to present liberty types, in that fascists "take the liberty pulse" of the population by voicing libertarian causes.

Oh. Ok. I'll have to think of a really good one. One that cannot be contested. I'm probably going to disagree with you on how fascism is defined and applicable though. I've covered this in a few different threads of late. Specifically with Monsanto and the particular thing that I've brought up here regarding Pompeo and these corporate raiders. I think some of it is in the foreign policy section but it's scattered about in other areas as well. I was thinking about merging them all into a single thread thoug before they are lost.

In the mean time, what do you think about this? Seems like a case where industry manipulated the courts to disfranchise some kids from their first amendment right for the rest of their lives. A corporate repatriation of the constitutional rights of a new generation.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...out-Fracking&p=5503682&viewfull=1#post5503682

 

[kcchiefs6465]

Sure. Although I've described the phenomenon in depth elswhere more than once around the boards when it has come up. It's disingenuous to infer that I haven't.

The definition of fascism is the merge of corporation and state. Period. I just shared with you the fact that the Koch network has merged with Monsanto and aquired the services of Congressman Mike Pompeo (who has received more money from these two than anyone else in office) to introduce and attempt the industry backed legislation that specifically says that the natural citizen has no right to know or establish any mechanism to act upon their right to ever ask what it is that they are consuming into their bodies. This corporate merge with the government by way of a congressman like Miike Pompeo to legislate on behalf of these corporate interests is fascism by any sense of the word.

And here some of us are selling the Koch brothers like they are some kind of savior of liberty for the people. That's the biggest load of crap I've read on these boards. These people, along with Pompeo are disfranchising the people, bypassing the people, assuming the name of the people and operating from within the process of representation that was designed for the people. But here, in this case, the people, the real ones, have no representation or say so in the matter whatsoever. Only the interests who have aquired the services of Pompeo for a couple of hundred thousand dollars to buy a little government.

This is yet another example of a fascist model being pawned from within the liberty community as some sort of march for liberty but what is essentially happening here are that the people themselves are being disfranchised.

Now, It's early and I don't even have coffee yet so maybe I'll come back once I'm a bit more awake and explain what we have happening within the liberty community as some continue to prop up these corrupt, treasonous companies and elected representatives as some sort of liberty minded supermen as they use our processes of representation to hijack government and disfranchise the people.

There is no veiled evidence of anything. They're doing it live and in your face. And they are being celebrated for it within the liberty community.

Just a point of order, in a libertarian society there wouldn't be anything to buy. Those who robbed for a living, or who committed fraud would (if ever the day comes that people wake up) find themselves unappreciated.

"The people," (who you speak of) probably shouldn't advocate for others be robbed to pay for their things and perhaps the Kochs wouldn't have a model to follow. Or was it vice versa? In any case, this is what has become of society. A group of people using the government to attempt to take from some to give to others and to pass regulations or laws in their name. Collectivism is the stalking horse of fascism.

And now that you mentioned it, I think you did answer me before. I apologize for inferring otherwise, I genuinely forgot.

 

[erowe1]

It's intra-libertarian partisanship.

To paraphrase the apostle Paul: One of you says, "I am of Rothbard," and another says, "I am of Koch," and another says, "I am of Ayn Rand," and another says, "I am of Milton Friedman." For many the schisms take precedence over the agreements.

That said, the Kochs themselves have helped make the schisms. They helped fund Trey Grayson against Rand Paul in the GOP primary IIRC. That won't make me abandon the good things the Cato Institute does though.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Collectivism is the stalking horse of fascism.

Yeah, probably that too. I'm really coming around to just adhering to my own personal principles and just concern myself with number 1. That being myself and my family. So many issues to gripe about and on one hand you get folks defending states rights like we see with the "Bundy Ranch" but then when state and individual rights are disfranchised by way of this thing with Pompeo, Koch network and Monsanto scribbling up legislation to force feed people their products they call it liberty. Fuggin nutz, man. You know?

Oh well. In the immortal words of KISS, "We're in the Psyyyyycho Circus....and I say welcome to the showwww..."

Edit - looks like we're dropping ol' Cliven like a bad habit now. So much for states rights over there. Cliven said negro. Nothing to be had politically now. Heh. Carpetbaggers...

 

[P3ter_Griffin]

Mapping the Influence of Koch Cash

2010 cycle...

The Koch brothers’ congressional empire...

haha, just found this on a google search... bump for reading tomorrow

 

[Natural Citizen]

Heh. What an old thread to bump, P3ter_Griffin. This might be fun to go over again, though. I'm much more concise in expressing myself these days.

Unfortunately, this is back in the days when I was "a liberal woman who was brainwashed by Russian propaganda, lobbying for forced labeling and hated Liberty."

Ah well. I have to head out the door right this second. Maybe later.

 

[Natural Citizen]

I think it's a "she," but check this out:



Apparently she has issues with libertarianism too. And let's not forget that she has proudly claimed that all her "news" comes from a communist propaganda station.

Heh.

Pardon me while I go put on my lipstick.

 

[H. E. Panqui]

natural citizen: "There is no veiled evidence of anything. They're doing it live and in your face. And they are being celebrated for it within the liberty community."



...thanks to nc, peter, and several others for the thoughtfulness...best forum ever...

...i might quibble with nc that in some future educated/aware/just 'society' there will be no need for government-forced labeling...that truly 'educated'/aware people wouldn't put excitotoxins, etc. goddamned filth galore, into their bodies and they would surely be smart enough to avoid purchasing 'food' from chemical engineers..(hint for republicrats: learn about your food and get your food from nutritionists, chefs, farmers, etc. people you know and trust....not corporate strangers and chemical engineers...your blood/brain barrier is in danger of further compromise only accelerating your descent into 'republicratism')

...as to 'the koch bros.'....i am convinced that if they were a 'force for good' they would use some of their illion$ to promote 'monetary awareness,' monetary justice, etc....but they don't...

...most/all people you meet, including 'libertarians', are worse than ignorant as to this stinking rotten monetary (dis)order under which we are enslaved...the greatest day-to-day control mechani$m is shrouded in $ecrecy...NEVER in my lifetime has 'it' been 'publicly' discussed...and the miserable puppet$ who dominate 'politics' are shamefully naked...ALL of them..

...'the money power' can and does 'manufacture consent' from a truly poisoned, starving and ignorant population that merely quibbles over which bankster puppet to affirm at the polls every 2/4 years...

...it's been my experience most people avoid hone$t discussion$...?many maybe fearing the eventual loss of their ill-gotten 'job$,' 'retirement$,' florida winter condo$, etc. ad nau$eam?...

... the republicrat pillar$ of our communties are debauched and ignorant...themselves merely puppets to those with more bank...