Who are the greatest expounders and defenders of liberty?

Who are the greatest expounders and defenders of liberty?


  • Total voters
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I thought the people here didn't like watered down libertarianism?

I don't and the Chicago School hardly porposes Liberty.

5th PLANK OF THE COMMUNIST MANIFESTO has ANYTHING to do with MONETARY FREEDOM?

Gtfo.

And whilst we're on about your 'criteria'... I hate the cow, but how do you justiffy not putting Ayn Rand up there?

Book Sales? :confused: lol......

And Rothbard wrote 25 books, Smith? pfffffft... I'd buy Wealth of Nations just to wipe my ass with.
 
Ron Paul is today's star for liberty. Rothbard never comes close in fame or influence. Ron Paul does nation TV interviews almost every day it seems.

DiLorenzo is a personal favorite of mine and still current, with potential. His books on Lincoln are brillaint and persuassive.

Woods, while I disagree with him on a number of things is a friend of mine, and he has best-sellers.

The two people on the list who are tomoorow's stars for liberty are Woods and Alex Jones, as both are in their mid-30s, and both are gaining a mass audience.

Jones has the bigger audience with his websites and films, but Woods has better academic credentials and might be more influential with intellectuals.

Jones two main websites get more combined hits than cbsnews.com at this time, amazing.

Another thing.

The liberty movement will just tread water if we let the govenrment get away with mass murder. Jones understands that. I'm not sure if the rest do.

What about Rockwell? Your criteria seems to be quite arbitrary.
 
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Its not easy, you have to read 1000s of history books to make a fair judgement, which I have done.

You also must distiguish fame in their own time from fame after death.

Most people have an easier time determining who is still famous now than in their own time. But being famous in your own time is more critical in my opinion because once you achieve fame, you have a large audience. Typically, the most creative thinkers in history are those gain a large audience.

Of those on the list who were the most famous in their time, I'd say that Origen of Alexandria (185-254) is number one, the most famous. He was the first famous Christain in history who was known all over the Roman Empire. He was so well regarded that the wife of the Roman Emperor sought him out for personal teaching. This was in time time when Christianity was persecuted.

Origen wrote more books than any other single author in history, about 6000 of them (according to Epiphanius, his enemy), many which still remain. He employed many scribes. He memorized the entire Bible, and wrote multiple books at the same time, much like a chess grandmaster playing games against multiple opponents at once, moving around a circle making one move at a time.

Origen had 8 scribes in a circle. He wrote 8 books at one time, dictating a sentence or paragraph for each scribe for each book as he moved around the circle. He kept this pace up for decades, until the Romans nabbed him and had him tortured.

Origen also was fluent in several languages including Greek, Latin, Hebrew, Syriac, and others. He took different manuscripts of the Bible, and arranged them in parallel columns, 6 to 8, comparing the text by different scribes and in different languages, a gargantuan effort.

In those times, there were not many books. As you can imagine, Origen's books were distributed all over the Roman Empire, flooding the market.

Origen became known as Adamantius, the Man of Steel, and was very popular up until about 400 A.D. when the anti-Liberty, pro-Augustine pro-state forces started to attack Origen in death (even thought they borrowed a large chunk of their stuff from him). Augustine couldn't even read Greek! Then around 550, more anti-Origen forces launched another onslaught against Origen (who had now been dead 300 years).

Frankly, there was a war for liberty raging for 150 years, from the attacks of 400 by Methodius and Augustine, until the Council of Chalcedon in 451, when Justinian clamped down on Origen. Origen's defenders fought vainly for liberty during these times, but then the dark age began.

You won't find any support for the crusades in Origen, but you will in Augustine.

Origen was a man who defended human liberty like no other has done before or since. He promoted the human soul to be free and to think, and to resist government authority. He promoted doctrines that lead to a free society, like mercy. Origen believed that the devil could be saved!

Origen also synthesized Greek philosophy with the Bible, so the ideas of Greek liberty could be learned by Christians.

To get an idea of what he was like, please check out:

Early Opposition to Origen
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd10.html

Origen--Continued
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd11.html

The Eulogists of Origen
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd12.html

Augustine and Origen Contrasted
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd20.html

This is what I mean by fame. Origen was the foremost intellectual in the world, from his time in the early 200s, well into the 500s. He changed world history forever. There has never been a man who ever lived who did what Origen did. We today, are all the better for it.

Even today, the part of Christianity that is good and promotes liberty can be traced back to Origen.

Rothbard is nothing but a pimple on an elephant's ass when come comes to comparing Origen with Rothbard's impact on the history of liberty

PS

Usually, the more famous people get, the less radical they get. Not so with Origen.

Origen said:

"It is not irrational, then, to form associations in opposition to existing laws, if done for the sake of the truth. For as those persons would do well who should enter into a secret association in order to put to death a tyrant who had seized upon the liberties of a state, so Christians also, when tyrannized over by him who is called the devil, and by falsehood, form leagues contrary to the laws of the devil, against his power, and for the safety of those others whom they may succeed in persuading to revolt from a government which is, as it were, "Scythian," and despotic."

Contra Celsus (248 a.d.)

Correction:

Justinian condemned Origen in 553 at the Second Council of Constantine, not at the Council of Chalcedon in 451.

I apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you.
 
I don't really understand why Socrates is there.

Me either, except that Socrates was probably the baddest ass raver in history and once danced to Darude's Sandstorm for 15 weeks straight before collapsing in an ocean of his own vomit whereupon ants founded the free nation of Socratikstan in his hair.
 
Its not easy, you have to read 1000s of history books to make a fair judgement, which I have done.

You also must distiguish fame in their own time from fame after death.

Most people have an easier time determining who is still famous now than in their own time. But being famous in your own time is more critical in my opinion because once you achieve fame, you have a large audience. Typically, the most creative thinkers in history are those gain a large audience.

Of those on the list who were the most famous in their time, I'd say that Origen of Alexandria (185-254) is number one, the most famous. He was the first famous Christain in history who was known all over the Roman Empire. He was so well regarded that the wife of the Roman Emperor sought him out for personal teaching. This was in time time when Christianity was persecuted.

Origen wrote more books than any other single author in history, about 6000 of them (according to Epiphanius, his enemy), many which still remain. He employed many scribes. He memorized the entire Bible, and wrote multiple books at the same time, much like a chess grandmaster playing games against multiple opponents at once, moving around a circle making one move at a time.

Origen had 8 scribes in a circle. He wrote 8 books at one time, dictating a sentence or paragraph for each scribe for each book as he moved around the circle. He kept this pace up for decades, until the Romans nabbed him and had him tortured.

Origen also was fluent in several languages including Greek, Latin, Hebrew, Syriac, and others. He took different manuscripts of the Bible, and arranged them in parallel columns, 6 to 8, comparing the text by different scribes and in different languages, a gargantuan effort.

In those times, there were not many books. As you can imagine, Origen's books were distributed all over the Roman Empire, flooding the market.

Origen became known as Adamantius, the Man of Steel, and was very popular up until about 400 A.D. when the anti-Liberty, pro-Augustine pro-state forces started to attack Origen in death (even thought they borrowed a large chunk of their stuff from him). Augustine couldn't even read Greek! Then around 550, more anti-Origen forces launched another onslaught against Origen (who had now been dead 300 years).

Frankly, there was a war for liberty raging for 150 years, from the attacks of 400 by Methodius and Augustine, until the Council of Chalcedon in 451, when Justinian clamped down on Origen. Origen's defenders fought vainly for liberty during these times, but then the dark age began.

You won't find any support for the crusades in Origen, but you will in Augustine.

Origen was a man who defended human liberty like no other has done before or since. He promoted the human soul to be free and to think, and to resist government authority. He promoted doctrines that lead to a free society, like mercy. Origen believed that the devil could be saved!

Origen also synthesized Greek philosophy with the Bible, so the ideas of Greek liberty could be learned by Christians.

To get an idea of what he was like, please check out:

Early Opposition to Origen
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd10.html

Origen--Continued
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd11.html

The Eulogists of Origen
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd12.html

Augustine and Origen Contrasted
http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd20.html

This is what I mean by fame. Origen was the foremost intellectual in the world, from his time in the early 200s, well into the 500s. He changed world history forever. There has never been a man who ever lived who did what Origen did. We today, are all the better for it.

Even today, the part of Christianity that is good and promotes liberty can be traced back to Origen.

Rothbard is nothing but a pimple on an elephant's ass when come comes to comparing Origen with Rothbard's impact on the history of liberty

PS

Usually, the more famous people get, the less radical they get. Not so with Origen.

Origen said:

"It is not irrational, then, to form associations in opposition to existing laws, if done for the sake of the truth. For as those persons would do well who should enter into a secret association in order to put to death a tyrant who had seized upon the liberties of a state, so Christians also, when tyrannized over by him who is called the devil, and by falsehood, form leagues contrary to the laws of the devil, against his power, and for the safety of those others whom they may succeed in persuading to revolt from a government which is, as it were, "Scythian," and despotic."

Contra Celsus (248 a.d.)

Correction:

Justinian condemned Origen in 553 at the Second Council of Constantine, not at the Council of Chalcedon in 451.

I apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you.
 
what about as far liberty is concerneded?

Ever heard of the Pericles golden age of liberty? Ever investigated the link between science and liberty? Ever heard of Thales, the first Greek philosopher?

The fight for liberty goes back thousands of years. It seems like some here are a bit myopic. I could have added Ashurbanipal to the list as well. Or I could have listed Urukagina.

Others deserving merit include Polybius and Tacitus, or the greatest Roman Emperor of Liberty, Antonius Pius (ruled 138-161).

The first known use of the word meaning "freedom" or "liberty" first occurred under the reign of Urumagina, Ruler of Lagash, around 2300 B.C.
 
Ever heard of the Pericles golden age of liberty? Ever investigated the link between science and liberty? Ever heard of Thales, the first Greek philosopher?

The fight for liberty goes back thousands of years. It seems like some here are a bit myopic. I could have added Ashurbanipal to the list as well. Or I could have listed Urukagina.

Others deserving merit include Polybius and Tacitus, or the greatest Roman Emperor of Liberty, Antonius Pius (ruled 138-161).

The first known use of the word meaning "freedom" or "liberty" first occurred under the reign of Urumagina, Ruler of Lagash, around 2300 B.C.

nope, nope, and nope. are you a professor?
 
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