White House DENIES bow to king!

[jrich4rpaul]

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0409/White_House_No_bow_to_Saudi.html

"It wasn't a bow. He grasped his hand with two hands, and he's taller than King Abdullah," said an Obama aide, who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

Are you kidding? The video clearly shows he didn't even use "both hands" as stated.

 

[acptulsa]

 

[gls]

At least he didn't kiss him

 

[Jeremy]

Right, I'm sure Obama bowed to a foreign leader. OMG NWO lol

 

[armslist]

55 seconds...looks like a bow to me.

 

[Jeremy]

55 seconds...looks like a bow to me.

maybe he's pregnant and was having some pains

we can't jump to conclusions

 

[angelatc]

At least he didn't kiss him

In Saudi Arabia, that's considered a culturally correct greeting. As far as protocol goes, Bush was absolutely correct with this.

Bowing is an indicator of subservience, like a dog that rolls over and exposes an underbelly. Only the subjects of a king bow to a king.

Furthermore, American protocol is that a president absolutely never defers to any man. Obama should fire Kumar and hire Miss Manners.

 

[Jeremy]

In Saudi Arabia, that's considered a culturally correct greeting. As far as protocol goes, Bush was absolutely correct with this.

Bowing is an indicator of subservience, like a dog that rolls over and exposes an underbelly. Only the subjects of a king bow to a king.

Furthermore, American protocol is that a president absolutely never defers to any man. Obama should fire Kumar and hire Miss Manners.

Then what does the Japanese leader do to him?

 

[acptulsa]

Then what does the Japanese leader do to him?

I don't know, but I intend to avoid him.

 

[angelatc]

Then what does the Japanese leader do to him?

I'll look it up, but I remember Clinton catching a rash of sh*t for almost bowing to the Japanese leader.

ETA: OK - I looked it up. Now If PResident Obaba is reading this I would encourage him to do a little more research, but the bowing thing is tricky. In the Saudi world, it clearly signifies subservience, and was utterly wrong. The Muslim papers are chattering like crazy about it.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/apr/07/barack-takes-a-bow/

Article I Section 9 of the Constitution forbids titles of nobility and stipulates that no officeholder or government employee may "accept of any present, emolument, office, or title, of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state" without the consent of Congress. Judith Martin wrote in her Miss Manners column in 2001 that bowing "is not an ordinary bit of foreign etiquette one might adopt out of courtesy when traveling. ... Americans do not properly bow to any royalty. We show respect for other countries' leaders the same way we do to our own."

In Japan, refusal to return a bow is considered a blatant display of aggression and dominance, so I would guess that the President is supposed to bow, but only soooo slightly.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/apr/07/barack-takes-a-bow/

Press outlets have been conspicuously silent on Mr. Obama's bow. Compare this to the New York Times' reaction when former President Bill Clinton inclined a bit too far when meeting Japanese Emperor Akihito in 1994. According to the Gray Lady, "The image on the South Lawn was indelible: an obsequent president, and the Emperor of Japan." Former President George W. Bush received thorough press attention after being photographed holding hands with then-Crown Prince Abdullah in 2005. "It clearly strikes a nerve," CBS News reported, while David Letterman satirized Mr. Bush as "officially the gayest president since Lincoln." These two cases were tame compared to Mr. Obama's full-out genuflection, which makes us wonder why it is not worthy of comment.

 

[Jeremy]

I'll look it up, but I remember Clinton catchingt a rash of sh*t for almost bowing to the Japanese leader.

That's dumb... would the Japanese people be mad if their leader shook hands?

 

[angelatc]

That's dumb... would the Japanese people be mad if their leader shook hands?

It is only dumb if you don't have any respect for the gentle art of protocols and subtle nuances that define us. BUt to answer your question, yes - I suspect the Japanese people would absolutely be furious if their leader gave an unreciprocated bow. Would we be mad if another leader walked deliberately by Obama's outstretched hand?

http://www.nytimes.com/1994/06/19/w...ent-s-inclination-no-it-wasn-t-a-bow-bow.html

Guests invited to a white-tie state dinner at the White House (a Clinton Administration first) were instructed to address the Emperor as "Your Majesty," not "Your Highness" or, worse, "King." And in what one Administration aide called "some emperor thing," an Army general was cautioned that he should not address the Emperor Akihito at all as he escorted him to the Tomb of the Unknowns at Arlington National Cemetery.

But the "thou need not bow" commandment from the State Department's protocol office maintained a constancy of more than 200 years. Administration officials scurried to insist that the eager-to-please President had not really done the unthinkable.

"It was not a bow-bow, if you know what I mean," said Ambassador Molly Raiser, the chief of protocol.

Looking at the press reaction that Clinton got for his non-bow bow and the almost no attention Obama's bow got in the mainstream media is very telling about how far the media itself is bending over.

 

[Aratus]

it seems to me the "semi-bow" was reciprocated by the queen of england acting so informally to
our first lady, the semi-hug seems to have followed this "semi-bow" that barack obama obviously did!

 

[acptulsa]

it seems to me the "semi-bow" was reciprocated by the queen of england acting so informally to
our first lady, the semi-hug seems to have followed this "semi-bow" that barack obama obviously did!

It is quite a reversal of the double standard, compared to once upon a time. Imagine Eisenhower bowing to the king of a sheikdom and Maimie hugging the ailing father of Elizabeth. Or try to imagine it--I can't, myself...

 

[angelatc]

it seems to me the "semi-bow" was reciprocated by the queen of england acting so informally to
our first lady, the semi-hug seems to have followed this "semi-bow" that barack obama obviously did!

Two wrongs don't make a right. It actually makes another wrong. Obama bowed to a king, but did not bow to a queen?

Michelle Obama was wrong to touch the Queen. The fact that the Queen responded gracefully speaks volumes to the grace of the Queen. A proper hostess does not acknowledge any breech of etiquette, and actually is supposed to defend the transgressor as to spare them further embarassment.

But it does not in any way absolve Mrs Obama of the faux pas.

 

[angelatc]

It is quite a reversal of the double standard, compared to once upon a time. Imagine Eisenhower bowing to the king of a sheikdom and Maimie hugging the ailing father of Elizabeth. Or try to imagine it--I can't, myself...

A Kennedy story mentions that Jackie was instructed not to bow when she met a British royal because heads of state and their wives do not bow to each other.

After her husband died, she again met the royal and gave him a curtsy. The person was with her was surprised, because Mrs. Kennedy was a stickler for such things. She caught his eye and whispered "I am no longer a head of state," which sent people out of the room in tears.

In case it ever comes up, we Americans don't ever have to bow to anybody. But you'll piss off the Japanese guy who wants to do business with you if you don't.

 

[Aratus]

a very long long long tyme ago, when jamie monroe was initially sent to be our ambassador
to france, he made the mistake of hugging a member of the french revolutionary committee
in 1794 and then the british were furious at him! a friendly gesture that perhaps stabilized
an interum gov't actually was not an approval gesture for the bloody reign of terror. the tories
in the U.K did not see anything positive in what monroe innocently did on the spur of the moment...

we have often told the british we aren't into titles. obama seems to be more flexible and less
rigid and i did think he was not being so stuffy or formal. i do admit this flies against a tradition...

 

[Ninja Homer]

"It wasn't a bow. He grasped his hand with two hands, and he's taller than King Abdullah," said an Obama aide, who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

White House FAIL

 

[Kludge]

A thread for whether or not Obama bowed to a king...? Really...?

I would have bowed. Kings are pretty badass. Some of England's kings were pretty progressive in realizing that government is not greater than the sum of its people, as shown by the English Charter of Liberties issued way back in 1100.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charter_of_Liberties

 

[Anwar_S]

In Saudi Arabia, that's considered a culturally correct greeting. As far as protocol goes, Bush was absolutely correct with this.

Bowing is an indicator of subservience, like a dog that rolls over and exposes an underbelly. Only the subjects of a king bow to a king.

Furthermore, American protocol is that a president absolutely never defers to any man. Obama should fire Kumar and hire Miss Manners.

Your correct, kissing on the cheek is the correct way to greet someone if they are a friend or family member. A handshake will do if they are an aquantance.

As far as bowing, I've never seen anyone bow to the king. It's ussually a slight tilt of the head but this only extends to citizens not heads of other countries.

I think in the effort of trying to make a good first impression with King Abdullah Obama just made cultural faux pas. Muslims don't really care, its not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be.

Can we go back to critisizing policies now?