Walmart Strike

[Todd]

I am guessing you grew up in the city, and have never even had an outdoor herb garden.

Actually, I live in the country and have a great one. A member of a local co-op too. Have seen first hand how Government destroys the ability to eat healthy. Listen, there are many ways to grow and produce cheaper healthier food through INNOVATION that can at least "compete" with some of the Monsanto GMO produce. You sure are reading alot into my position and several others as well.

This is some funny shit. I get called a right wing extremist by the Co-op hippies for telling them Big government is destroying their livelihood, and I basically get called a leftist on Ron Paul forums for arguing the same. LOL.

 

[angelatc]

Actually, I live in the country and have a great one. A member of a local co-op too. Have seen first hand how Government destroys the ability to eat healthy. Listen, there are many ways to grow and produce cheaper healthier food through INNOVATION that can at least "compete" with some of the Monsanto GMO produce. You sure are reading alot into my position and several others as well.

This is some funny shit. I get called a right wing extremist by the Co-op hippies for telling them Big government is destroying their livelihood, and I basically get called a leftist on Ron Paul forums for arguing the same. LOL.

Well then, I stand corrected. I think it's hard to believe that someone who farms doesn't think that crops that are pest resistant, drought tolerant, maturing faster in a weed free field aren't much easier to grow and therefore cheaper to produce.

There's no evidence that organic, GMO foods are healthier than organic.

 

[angelatc]

When I was in college, we were told that the best way to advance is to change companies, which would also give us opportunities to learn a wider variety of techniques to get jobs done. And we were also told that average 30 year old professional has had something like 8 different jobs in his lifetime.

"Job hopping" is only a problem if you're changing positions at an absurd rate. If you're spending 18+ months at a position, no one cares how many jobs you've had.

Glad to see you've come around to seeing things my way. Now, on to the rest of the world!

 

[angelatc]

Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they advocate force.

That's true, but Weston is a liberal.

 

[Todd]

Well then, I stand corrected. I think it's hard to believe that someone who farms doesn't think that crops that are pest resistant, drought tolerant, maturing faster in a weed free field aren't much easier to grow and therefore cheaper to produce.

There's no evidence that organic, GMO foods are healthier than organic.

We agree sort of..... I do understand the concept talthough there is still debate. http://www.ucsusa.org/food_and_agri...tem/genetic-engineering/failure-to-yield.html

But I'm not really arguing that it is much cheaper to have Organics or that I wish to force the Government to subsidize the industry.

But what I do expect is when the Government says they promote healthy eating and healthy lifestyle, that they don't work against those of us who "choose" not to partake in the GMO industry by altering the market in favor of them and allow people who wish to go another route to compete

I don't expect to get blueberries in December unless I go to a big Box mart. I understand this.

Maybe my intial post wasn't as clear as should be, but my argument is basically that it's fundamentally wrong to subsidize and give advantage to those that wish to market processed unhealthy foods over people trying to eat foods the way God intended them to be.

It is debatable whether Organics are healthier than GMO, but maybe I just like the taste better.

 

[Weston White]

Other people should forced to work harder so that you can have what you want, at the expense of what the rest of the nation is demanding?

So increasing efficiency is being lazy. Just wow....

Yes. Absolutely, as with most business arrangements, such is part of our free-market economy—a la the rules of supply and demand. If you want my business, you better be prepared to break an honest sweat for my patronage (e.g., neither Foster Farms nor Tyson Foods get by money, but Organic Valley does).

Moreover, spraying chemical compounds into the air that then drains into the water tables is by no means increasing the efficiency of anything positive and beneficial, save to pollute the environment for years and years to come.

Apropos, if you have failed to notice, when American companies outsource their factories to third-world slave factories, they do not kindly reduce the purchase prices of their products for their loyal customers (yet do pad the profits of their shareholders), rather their prices stay the same and are then raised over time (e.g., Apple, Dell, Guess, Levi's, Nike, etc.); and consequently in obverse relation the selection and quality of their products in nearly every instance gradually diminishes over time.

 

[Weston White]

That's true, but Weston is a liberal.

Not really so much. No. Wrong answer. False. Incorrect.

 

[Weston White]

There's no evidence that organic, GMO foods are healthier than organic.

You are being dishonest. GMO crops likely contain unnatural molecules that your body is incapable of processing that remain behind to wreak havoc during your digestive process (leading to a myriad of longterm health related concerns), while the nutritional value of crops are really dependant upon the soil contents.

Here is one such example study: The Devil in the Details; Are Organic Foods Safer or Healthier Than Conventional Alternatives?: A Systematic Review

“The published literature lacks strong evidence that organic foods are significantly more nutritious than conventional foods.”

“Consumption of organic foods may reduce exposure to pesticide residues and antibiotic-resistant bacteria.”

“Vitamin C, antioxidants, and phenolic acids tend to be higher in organic food about 60% to 80% of the time, while vitamin A and protein is higher in conventional food 50% to 80% of the time.”

 

[NationalAnarchist]

My wife worked at wal mart twice. They suck! They keep you at about 35-38 hours a week so as to make sure you get no benefits and the pay is lousy as well. She got up to 8.90$ an hour with a raise! Only damn thing I liked about Wal Mart is the fact she could transfer and she did...then eventually quit and found a job making less money per hour but more hours over all.

 

[pcosmar]

They are probably overpaid as it is.

Most of them are not overpaid. ($2 an hour would be overpaid for a few) And though it is Not a high paying job,, Walmart does pay more than minimum wage,, plus bonuses and benefits.
My wife works there (part time) and has her health insurance,, and gets bonuses and stocks.
I wish they would hire me.

http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2013/06/05/wal-mart-dismisses-protesters-as-paid-agents/

“Let me be clear these associates are not part of Wal-Mart,” said Gisel Ruiz, Chief Operating Officer at Wal-Mart Stores Inc., to a stadium full of U.S. workers the company brought to Arkansas to attend its yearly employee pep rally Friday.

“They are part of the United Food and Commercial Workers International Union (UFCW) and they are paid to be here and disrupt this week’s activities and that is just plain wrong,” Ms. Ruiz said of the protesters.

About 100 protesting workers walked off their jobs last week and traveled from all over the country,

100,,?
the local store has more that 100 employees,, and there are dozens of stores in this state alone. (Several dozens)

100 union agitators,, with very little "rank and file" support.

long thread for a non-story.

 

[thequietkid10]

Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they advocate force.

I don't think it's the use of force that offends angelatc, it's the amount of economic ignorance.

 

[Todd]

I don't think it's the use of force that offends angelatc, it's the amount of economic ignorance.

my economics is just fine. Free market = Food competition.

More Freedom please

 

[Weston White]

I don't think it's the use of force that offends angelatc, it's the amount of economic ignorance.

How so? You don’t actually believe that the higher-ups at Walmart, McDonalds, Taco Bell, etc., actually make their purchases at their place of occupation do you; no, right? Because while their customers are all busy drooling over their fake-food cheesy-burgers, greasy fries, GMO soy-beef, and cheaply imported crap, they are all out dining on porterhouses, lobster, mignon, and the like laughing their rumps all the way to the bank in their fancy imported cars.

And so the saying goes: Once you’ve seen sausage being made, all you want to do is make sausage.

 

[angelatc]

How so? You don’t actually believe that the higher-ups at Walmart, McDonalds, Taco Bell, etc., actually make their purchases at their place of occupation do you; no, right? Because while their customers are all busy drooling over their fake-food cheesy-burgers, greasy fries, GMO soy-beef, and cheaply imported crap, they are all out dining on porterhouses, lobster, mignon, and the like laughing their rumps all the way to the bank in their fancy imported cars.

And so the saying goes: Once you’ve seen sausage being made, all you want to do is make sausage.

Have you people never been out of your collective basements?

Yes, I absolutely believe that the higher ups at WalMart shop at WalMart. The people in retail are expected to buy the products that pay their bills. Back in the day, my husband worked for a grocery retailer in Indiana (Marsh, for those of you in the know) and one of the Executive Directors was fired when someone saw him at WalMart with only a bag of dog food in his cart.

You people are horrible. The people that run these businesses are intent on providing serrvice to their customers, and they collect money only because other people see value in what they do. Unfortunately, some of that money comes not from consumers, but from elected officials. But that's not WalMart's problem - it's the government's flaw.

 

[angelatc]

You are being dishonest. GMO crops likely contain unnatural molecules that your body is incapable of processing that remain behind to wreak havoc during your digestive process (leading to a myriad of longterm health related concerns), while the nutritional value of crops are really dependant upon the soil contents.

Here is one such example study: The Devil in the Details; Are Organic Foods Safer or Healthier Than Conventional Alternatives?: A Systematic Review

“The published literature lacks strong evidence that organic foods are significantly more nutritious than conventional foods.”

“Consumption of organic foods may reduce exposure to pesticide residues and antibiotic-resistant bacteria.”

“Vitamin C, antioxidants, and phenolic acids tend to be higher in organic food about 60% to 80% of the time, while vitamin A and protein is higher in conventional food 50% to 80% of the time.”

The use of transgenic crops, he points out, has to date prevented the spraying of 473 million kilograms of toxic pesticides, reduced carbon dioxide emissions by 23.1bn kg – equivalent to taking 10.2 million cars off the road – and saved 108.7 million hectares of land from being turned into farmland. Rather than creating environmental havoc, GM crops have, by and large, been better for the environment than growing the equivalent conventional crops, with relatively lower yields and higher chemical input.
Equally, no-one has died or fallen ill directly as a result of eating GM food. Studies showing that GM food damages the health of laboratory animals have been discredited. Contrary to what the pro-organic lobby would have us believe, it is actually more dangerous to eat organic food – as the 53 people in Germany who died in 2011 from eating organic beansprouts tragically discovered.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/if-gm-crops-are-bad-show-us-the-evidence-8641168.html

See, I know that there are lots of GMO foods that are better fo you than the unmodified versions, too. I don't care about GMO food. I want my food to be cheap. You can go shop at Whole Foods while I shop at WalMart....except that isn't adequate. No, you want the government to make the food you find objectionable illegal.

It's like the other liberals and green energy. They want to drive prices up so that their solar and wind power scams can compete, price wise.

And Weston, whats really funny is the Conclusion of your study:

Conclusion: The published literature lacks strong evidence that organic foods are significantly more nutritious than conventional foods.

 

[Weston White]

You are so funny! So let me get this straight you are against unions and government intervention because (aside from raising the costs of products, presumably) they restrict the individual freedoms of employees, employers, and consumers, yet you wholly support businesses that punish its employees simply for exercising their own personal choice and free will (e.g., to shop and make purchases where, when, and how they deem appropriate)?

And “they collect money only because other people see value in what they do.” ...Oh yes, that is exactly why they do it. Sure, sure.

You keep playing the “it’s all our corrupted governments fault” card, as if businesses play absolutely zero roll in the loopholes and statutory exclusions being created to their own benefit—primary by their own lobbyists. Deny it all you want, still you remain ever vigilantly the staunch corporate fascist that you have come to know and love.

 

[UWDude]

I don't think it's the use of force that offends angelatc, it's the amount of economic ignorance.

Nobody has yet been able to counter my argument that labor is just like sprockets. An item, that people can band together, and demand higher prices for, if they wish. It has been conveniently ignored.

Perhaps because it would expose that price fixing laws are actually un-libertarian, as are monopoly busting laws, but they are so popular, that even some of the staunchest of libertarians believe there should be laws against price fixing... ...which is all unions are actually doing... ...price fixing.

Furthermore, a free market purist would have to be all in favor of bringing in immigrants for cheaper labor, if a union were to make the wage prices too high, but once again, this is un-stomachable for many of the so called "lovers of liberty" here.

Indeed, it was angelaTC's solution, immigration controls (using force to stop people from crossing imaginary lines on the ground to stop them from undercutting wages) and tariffs (taxing people for not being born on the same side of the line as others).

So the real ignorance is how a free market really works, and how if there was truly a free market, many of the wishes and popular laws of people here would disappear. In a truly free market, Mexicans would be able to flood America with cheap labor, after all, who is the US government to tell Mexicans they can't work in a South Carolina auto factory or a North Carolina Soap factory?


And tarriffs give no value to anyone but shareholders anyway. Whenever there is a tarrif on in imported product, the domestic producer realizes they can just raise their prices to match the tariff price, and everyone loses.

So really, it is AngelaTC that is for more central control of the economy, not me. She is the liberal, she is who she hates.

 

[krugminator]

It's fine if Wal-Mart want to unionize. It should also be fine if Wal-Mart wants to immediately fire anyone who tries.

 

[UWDude]

It's fine if Wal-Mart want to unionize. It should also be fine if Wal-Mart wants to immediately fire anyone who tries.

The magic of unions is they can kung-fu this, and "fire themselves collectively" periodically, proving to employers that collectively, workers can have power. Many of the assumptions of people here is that there is an unlimited supply of Wal-Mart laboreres. They forget, that Wal-Mart's strategy is to go into small towns, use their power and leverage to get tax breaks and push out competition. This creates not only bad blood, (people who will refuse to work for Wal Mart) but also, small towns often do not have large labor pools to begin with.

 

[krugminator]

The magic of unions is they can kung-fu this, and "fire themselves collectively" periodically, proving to employers that collectively, workers can have power. Many of the assumptions of people here is that there is an unlimited supply of Wal-Mart laboreres. They forget, that Wal-Mart's strategy is to go into small towns, use their power and leverage to get tax breaks and push out competition. This creates not only bad blood, (people who will refuse to work for Wal Mart) but also, small towns often do not have large labor pools to begin with.

I'm not making any assumptions about the feasibility. They are more than welcome to unionize. Unions as a group are clearly bad for the country, and public employees have absolutely no moral right to unionize, but I don't think Wal-Mart employees should be stopped by any type of government coercion.