U.S. Homicide Rate Hits 51-year Low as Gun Ownership Increased 141%

I'm very pro second amendment, but I always thought that the statistics on guns mostly favor the liberals, with stuff like comparing our gun deaths to other countries'. But the libertarian argument about what would happen to America in 50, 100, or 200 years if we got rid of guns overpowers all of the statistics. A lot of people only care about what happens to America in their lifetime though, and aren't willing to think about the country our grandchildren will live in. Mainstream conservatives, especially those in the mainstream media, seem to have this "I'm not a conspiracy theorist" pride, where they dig themselves into an inescapable hole by acting like only the statistics matter, and they just keep throwing stats around instead of using the libertarians' conspiracy argument. It's almost as if "conservatives" in the media are intentionally not using good arguments for the 2nd Amendment so that they can lose and have a gun ban.
 
I'd love to see the statistics on media coverage of guns and gun related shootings that are non-police, non-military events.
 
The problem that I see, is that uninformed and uneducated people assume if you get your hands on a gun, you will find a way to use it on someone else or yourself.

I once told my mother she would be safer if she bought a gun and was armed and her response: "the next thing you know, I'm going to go kill my neighbor, I don't want to do that!" This is the problem we are currently facing in this country and something that will have to be overcome through education.

Until then, media sensationalism will rule the day.
 
Don't tell that to the "Safe space" Utopian fascists. Their sensitive totalitarian brains might not be able to handle it.
 
TheCount said:
I'm not talking about the random folks with large stockpiles. Anecdotally, my friends and family who do have guns have increased the number of guns that they have since 2007-ish. I don't know anyone who owns between 1 and 5 guns. It's 0 or 6+
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...er-now-owns-8-guns-double-what-it-used-to-be/

The average gun owner now owns 8 guns — double what it used to be

There are nearly twice as many guns in the average gun-owning household today as there were 20 years ago, according to new Wonkblog estimates based data from surveys and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. In 2013, there were an estimated 8.1 firearms in the typical gun-owning household, according to these data. In 1994, the average gun-owning household owned 4.2 guns.


These numbers comport with what survey research has shown for several years now: the share of gun-owning households has been declining over the past 20 years and possibly more, according to numbers from Gallup and the General Social Survey. On the other hand, domestic firearm production and imports of firearms have risen sharply, particularly in recent years. If those numbers are correct, it follows that increasing gun purchases are being driven primarily by existing owners stocking up rather than first-time buyers.

Plenty has been written about the decline in overall gun ownership rates. Many of these stories are based on the General Social Survey's data, which shows household ownership rates falling from over 50 percent in the 1970s to around 32 percent today. Some gun rights advocates dispute these numbers, preferring to use Gallup's household ownership rates instead, which have remained essentially flat over the same period.

But even Gallup's numbers show a decline in gun ownership since the early 1990s, from 54 percent of households in late 1993 to 43 percent as of this fall. And regardless of whether overall ownership rates are flat or falling, one thing that's largely been overlooked is how more guns and fewer gun owners means that firearms are being concentrated in fewer hands than ever before.
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imrs.php
 
Disticnt NICs checks are much better metric, and those are at record highs.
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In the latest NIC check data, most background checks were not for first time gun buyers or even existing gun buyers getting more guns but existing gun owners wanting permits to carry. Existing gun owners wanting a new weapon also undergo checks so you can't use the number of background checks to show more new people becoming first time gun owners. They don't tell us if it is a persons' first gun or eighth gun. http://www.guns.com/2016/06/07/dip-in-nics-checks-suggest-few-gun-sales-in-may/

Dip in NICS checks suggest fewer gun sales in May
6/07/16 | by Daniel Terrill

Background checks for May are still highest on record but a deeper reading of the data suggests fewer gun sales for the month, according to figures released by the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

A flat 1.87 million checks were processed by the National Instant Criminal Background Check System in May 2016, but more than half the total checks were identified as permits, leaving 937,833 checks as likely gun sales.

The adjusted figure is on par with last year’s 918,707, a difference of 19,126 checks. Although NICS checks do not directly translate into gun sales, the industry uses the system as a barometer for transactions.
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You and everyone else knows your argument is totally irrelevant. According to the "gun grabbers" people who "stockpile guns" are more likely to become mass shooters. So whether there are more people buying guns or more gun owners stockpiling guns there should be an corresponding increase in gun homicides. Instead there's been a decrease.

Zippyjuan said:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...er-now-owns-8-guns-double-what-it-used-to-be/



imrs.php
Click to expand...

Zippyjuan said:
In the latest NIC check, most background checks were not for first time gun buyers or even existing guy buyers getting more guns but existing guy buyers wanting permits to carry. Existing gun buyers wanting a new weapon also undergo checks so you can't use the number of background checks to show more new people becoming first time gun owners. They don't tell us if it is a persons' first gun or eight gun. http://www.guns.com/2016/06/07/dip-in-nics-checks-suggest-few-gun-sales-in-may/
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A flat 1.87 million checks were processed by the National Instant Criminal Background Check System in May 2016, but more than half the total checks were identified as permits, leaving 937,833 checks as likely gun sales.

The adjusted figure is on par with last year’s 918,707, a difference of 19,126 checks. Although NICS checks do not directly translate into gun sales, the industry uses the system as a barometer for transactions.
Click to expand...

Right, and we've already been through this before, that is a record number of sales checks for May.
 
Which still does not refute the claim that fewer people own weapons than say 20 years ago. Half of the record number background checks were for permits not new gun purchases. If I buy my third gun I get a background check. It does not translate to all the background checks being first time buyers.

NRA tried to refute the numbers in the gun ownership poll but at the end conceded: https://www.nrablog.com/articles/20...-not-showing-in-national-gun-ownership-polls/

What are the actual numbers of individual gun owners in the United States? The number is unknown, and is likely to stay unknown. Given the results from above, it is between one third and one half of the population, or between 100 and 160 million people. Legal gun owners are potential voters. They are not felons. It is not surprising that legislation concerning guns, gun ownership, and gun use, is a potent political issue.
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One third to one half is a decline from what it once was.
 
Makes Interesting Points said:
stuff like comparing our gun deaths to other countries'.
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"Murder rates in "gun controlled" areas, such as Mexico and South Africa, are more than twice as high as those in the United States. Conversely, countries such as Switzerland, New Zealand, and Israel, which have household gun ownership rates comparable to those in the United States, have much lower rates of crime and violence." - Comment: Gun Control and Economic Discrimination: The Melting Point Case-in Point, 85 J. Crim. L. 764, 770 (1995).
 
Zippyjuan said:
Which still does not refute the claim that fewer people own weapons than say 20 years ago. Half of the record number background checks were for permits not new gun purchases. If I buy my third gun I get a background check. It does not translate to all the background checks being first time buyers.

NRA tried to refute the numbers in the gun ownership poll but at the end conceded: https://www.nrablog.com/articles/20...-not-showing-in-national-gun-ownership-polls/

One third to one half is a decline from what it once was.
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If it is unknown, then how can a decline be noted?

Again, all this is based on the Gallup poll, which is horseshit.

Look at the number of new CCW permits for a better number.
 
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Are NICS application statistics even included in CCW applications? Or just gun purchases?
 
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