'Turkey gave no warning' - downed Russian pilot

[Brian4Liberty]

'Turkey gave no warning' - downed Russian pilot
25 November 2015

The surviving pilot of a Russian plane shot down by Turkey on the Syrian border has said no warning was given.

Capt Konstantin Murakhtin told Russian television there was "no way" the jet could have violated Turkish airspace, as Turkey said it did.

Russia said Capt Murakhtin was rescued in a 12-hour operation involving special forces.

Turkey insists the pilots were warned 10 times before the plane was shot down.

It is not clear what happened to the body of his co-pilot, who was killed by gunfire as he parachuted from the burning plane.

Capt Murakhtin was speaking from the Hmeymim airbase, where Russia's aircraft have been based in its Syrian campaign, and where he was taken after being rescued.

He said he knew the region he had been flying in "very well" and that the jet had not been in Turkish airspace "even for a second".
...
More: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34925229

 

[luctor-et-emergo]

Turkish documents claims it was 17 seconds.

As far as I'm aware 5 minutes is longer than 17 seconds.

So either;
1) 5 minutes is shorter than 17 seconds.
2) The Turkish (airforce) warned the Russian jet minutes BEFORE entering Turkish airspace.
3) The Turkish (airforce) warned the Russian jet after it had already fired on it.
4) The Turkish (airforce) did not warn the Russian plane and shot at it as soon as it crossed into Turkish airspace.
5) The Russian plane never crossed into Turkish airspace but they shot it down anyways.

One thing is for sure, the Russian jet posed 0 threat to Turkey and Turkey itself has a history of flying in other countries' airspace. Without even considering the support for different groups in the conflict they are hypocrites based on this alone.

 

[luctor-et-emergo]

From 5 days ago:

Turkey has summoned Russia's ambassador in protest over the "intensive" bombing of Turkmen villages in northern Syria by Russian warplanes, Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu told reporters on Friday.

In the meeting with the ambassador, Andrei Karlov, Turkey called for an immediate end to the Russian military operation, which is near the Turkish border, the foreign ministry said in a statement.

"It was stressed that the Russian side's actions were not a fight against terror, but they bombed civilian Turkmen villages and this could lead to serious consequences," the foreign ministry said.

Ankara has traditionally expressed solidarity with the Syrian Turkmen, who are Syrians of Turkish descent.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015...sis-syria-turkey-russia-idUSKCN0T91MO20151120


These Turkmen are apparently the same people who shot at parachuting pilots while yelling allah-akbar.

I'm going for option 5 from my above post.

 

[fisharmor]

Apparently according to the article, in Moscow protesters are chucking rocks at the Turkish embassy, and also Putin has ordered that all future bomb runs in Syria will be escorted by fighters.
Things are just getting started.

 

[sparebulb]

It is too bad that the Armenians don't have a bunch of nukes.......

 

[sparebulb]

The surviving Russian crew member must have a great story to tell about his 12 hours in the bush.

It sounds like he did everything right.

 

[luctor-et-emergo]

The surviving Russian crew member must have a great story to tell about his 12 hours in the bush.

It sounds like he did everything right.

He was the navigator though.

 

[seapilot]

Turkey is making NATO look real bad on this. The Turks knew that bomber was not aggressive to the Turkish nation. The Turkish pilots could have flown next to the bomber and escorted them away from Turkey. Even if the Russian had bad communication eg. wrong frequency a fly by would have gotten their attention.

I agree with other posters that Turkey has an agenda. They are pissed Russian is beating the Syrian rebels into submission, they are going to lose influence in the region to Russia. After the Paris attacks, France met with Russia to form an alliance against ISIS. Probably the last straw for Turkey as they could see they would not have any say in a New Syrian government. Now they have shot down a Russian plane, NATO has to back them up, that creates a divide in France(NATO member)- Russia partnership.

 

[Carsten2012b]

I guess Putin is going to be carving up the Turkey this Thanksgiving.

All jokes aside, I'm more wondering what Turkey's motives for this were. I would have to agree with seapilot's summary on this, but I feel that part of Turkey's fear of losing regional influence might have to do with the likely possibility of carving a Kurdish state out of Turkey's southeastern territory.

 

[Danke]

He was the navigator though.

I dare you to say "navigator" to his face.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

I dare you to say "navigator" to his face.

What do you think Danke, did the Turkish pilots radio a warning? Did the Russian pilot hear a warning? Are they always on the same frequency? What language would they be speaking in?

 

[Danke]

What do you think Danke, did the Turkish pilots radio a warning? Did the Russian pilot hear a warning? Are they always on the same frequency? What language would they be speaking in?

Cold War, no, Eastern Block aircraft would not monitor "guard."

I don't know if they do now, but certianly the Russian ground command would and could relay that to the pilots. English is the international language, but Turkey may have Translators broadcasting in other languages too.

Edit: just FYI. I flew along the northern Syrian border from Adana, Turkey to get to norther Iraq for over 100 combat missions. We were allowed to engage any threat north of the 36th parallel be it surface or air.

 

[wizardwatson]

I guess Putin is going to be carving up the Turkey this Thanksgiving.

All jokes aside, I'm more wondering what Turkey's motives for this were. I would have to agree with seapilot's summary on this, but I feel that part of Turkey's fear of losing regional influence might have to do with the likely possibility of carving a Kurdish state out of Turkey's southeastern territory.

Judging by how we make allies in that part of the world it was probably something like:

"Shoot it down if you want to keep receiving cash, hookers, and blow. Don't shoot it down and we show your families all these awesome photos at the very least."

 

[Jan2017]

The surviving Russian crew member must have a great story to tell about his 12 hours in the bush.

. . .

I thought it was within a shorter time that he was found and evacuated - same as with the downed helicopter crew.

Turkish video has the audio - in a Turkish accent English - to turn south you are entering Turkish airspace - turn south !

Does the Russian Su-24 pilot speak English (?) and would he risk missing his target or worse
turn into enemy/rebel/Turkmen anti-aircraft fire as they are coming around a second time for a lower bombing run (?)
Seems like Putin expected no air combat at all over Syria (?)

NW Syria : TOW missle sighting (red dots) and Russian bombing sites

.

 

[AngryCanadian]

I thought it was within a shorter time that he was found and evacuated - same as with the downed helicopter crew.

Turkish video has the audio - in a Turkish accent English - to turn south you are entering Turkish airspace - turn south !

Does the Russian Su-24 pilot speak English (?) and would he risk missing his target or worse
turn into enemy/rebel/Turkmen anti-aircraft fire as they are coming around a second time for a lower bombing run (?)
Seems like Putin expected no air combat at all over Syria (?)

NW Syria : TOW missle sighting (red dots) and Russian bombing sites

.

Turkish video has the audio - in a Turkish accent English - to turn south you are entering Turkish airspace - turn south !

Which is why the audio and recording is questionable.

 

[jkob]

Turkey should not be apart of NATO

 

[wizardwatson]

Turkey should not be apart of NATO

NATO shouldn't be part of NATO.

What have they done after coming out of hibernation when the cold war ended?

Bosnia
Kosovo
Libya
Giving missile defense system to Turkey.

They are nothing but a convenient extension of American foreign policy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_Operations

 

[jkob]

NATO shouldn't be part of NATO.

What have they done after coming out of hibernation when the cold war ended?

Bosnia
Kosovo
Libya
Giving missile defense system to Turkey.

They are nothing but a convenient extension of American foreign policy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_Operations

Agree, the whole point of NATO now is the continued American hegemony and dominance over Europe. It is a fundamentally anti-Russian alliance that is completely understandable for Russia to oppose setting up shop on their doorstep. When the Soviets put nuclear weapons in Cuba we almost started WWIII because of it, how can we be so stupid to not see how putting missiles in eastern Europe would offend Russia? Our government lies so much, they tried to say the "missile shield" wasn't directed at Russia but you sure could of fooled me with their locations. Perhaps Greece is interested in some S-400s to make the Turks live by their own standards, they violated their airspace 2244 times in 2014. The Kurds and Armenians could use some new equipment too. Turkey deserves whatever response it gets for its support of IS.

I wish I was confident in saying that our government wasn't complicit in this but I can't put it past them either

 

[vita3]

Remember child molester & ex Illinois GOP speaker of House, Denny Hastert was a richly paid $$ Turkey lobbyist.

Shady business goes deep both ways, more than most folks realize

Agree, that talking openly about kicking Turks out of NATO is all good