Trump tells donors he would have bombed Moscow and Beijing

[TheCount]

That is fair criticism on the supplying of weapons though you seem to have a need to downplay the actual coup itself, which was over and done in 2014 and that Trump had nothing to do with. Why you would put coup in "" is odd because that's exactly what it was.

Call it whatever you want. Call it a cheese sandwich. Trump supported that cheese sandwich for all four years of his administration.

Trump also ordered all US troops out of Syria and after Biden was installed the DoD said they lied to Trump, telling him they'd begun removing troops when they never did and there were, in fact, 900 there.

None of that is true either.

There were 500 in Syria when Trump entered office.

Would you care to guess how it came to be that more than 500 were there? Would you care to guess how they got from 500 under Obama to 2000 under Trump?


Sure, let's talk about the "withdrawal." Here's his withdrawal:

Q Does this give you any pause by your decision to withdraw the troops?


THE PRESIDENT: No, I think it’s great. Look, we don’t want to keep soldiers between Syria and Turkey for the next 200 years. They’ve been fighting for hundreds of years. We’re out. But we are leaving soldiers to secure the oil. And we may have to fight for the oil. It’s okay. Maybe somebody else wants the oil, in which case they have a hell of a fight. But there’s massive amounts of oil.


And we’re securing it for a couple of reasons. Number one, it stops ISIS, because ISIS got tremendous wealth from that oil. We have taken it. It’s secured.


Number two — and again, somebody else may claim it, but either we’ll negotiate a deal with whoever is claiming it, if we think it’s fair, or we will militarily stop them very quickly.

Does that sound like he is withdrawing all of the troops?

Here's video: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7n5wqj


He withdrew some troops from Syria, but that number was less than the number of additional troops that he had sent there between 2017 and 2019. He ordered the DoD to keep troops there to secure the oil and that ended up being more troops than there were in all of Syria when he entered office.

Donald Trump increased troop levels in every part of the world. At the end of his presidency, he then slightly reduced numbers from their new highs. His apologists in the media then used those slight reductions to convince you that he was an anti-war, anti-foreign intervention president when that was never the case.

So, you're right in that Trump often went along with things already put in motion before he arrived but you're trying to frame it as though he was the one who was responsible for creating these wars when he was not. I wholly support honest criticism and blaming Trump for any of his stupidity but that isn't what you're doing.

You have swallowed a whole bucket full of lies and you're offended that I'm disproving the bullshit that you have been told.

Maybe blame the people who lied to you instead.

 

[susano]

Call it whatever you want. Call it a cheese sandwich. Trump supported that cheese sandwich for all four years of his administration.




None of that is true either.

There were 500 in Syria when Trump entered office.

Would you care to guess how it came to be that more than 500 were there? Would you care to guess how they got from 500 under Obama to 2000 under Trump?


Sure, let's talk about the "withdrawal." Here's his withdrawal:


Does that sound like he is withdrawing all of the troops?

Here's video: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7n5wqj


He withdrew some troops from Syria, but that number was less than the number of additional troops that he had sent there between 2017 and 2019. He ordered the DoD to keep troops there to secure the oil and that ended up being more troops than there were in all of Syria when he entered office.

Donald Trump increased troop levels in every part of the world. At the end of his presidency, he then slightly reduced numbers from their new highs. His apologists in the media then used those slight reductions to convince you that he was an anti-war, anti-foreign intervention president when that was never the case.




You have swallowed a whole bucket full of lies and you're offended that I'm disproving the bull$#@! that you have been told.

Maybe blame the people who lied to you instead.

So, what is your solution? Do you have anything in mind as far voting, candidates? And, afaik, I don't recall any media supporting any kind of draw down or outright withdrawal from Syria. But, never mind that and tell me if you plan to vote, for whom or who you'd like to see that isn't running and making you decide not to vote, at all. Let's move beyond the critical theory.

 

[Swordsmyth]

I'm sorry for this, because you are probably a pretty ok person, but you have a defective moral compass that is fueled by gov-op Trump fan fiction.

If we were at war, there would be a declaration of such followed by a full mobilization.

There is none on either side.

This is empire doing what empire does in its dying days with actors who don't play ball.

You don't really seem to be familiar with some of the concepts Ron Paul has been conveying for years.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this topic.

Utter nonsense.
There is a war, they brag about it.
A declaration is not required, we were at war with Japan as soon as the first bomb fell on Pearl Harbor.

I support withdrawing our troops from all over the world, and Trump was making progress on doing just that.
But until they are withdrawn it is a moral duty to defend them from 3rd parties who attempt to kill them, doubly so for our diplomats and embassy staff who have every right to be there as long as the Iraqi government wants them there.

You have a defective moral compass that says America doing some wrong things gives a moral right to anyone to kill Americans.
A common leftist aberration.

 

[Swordsmyth]

So, what is your solution? Do you have anything in mind as far voting, candidates? And, afaik, I don't recall any media supporting any kind of draw down or outright withdrawal from Syria. But, never mind that and tell me if you plan to vote, for whom or who you'd like to see that isn't running and making you decide not to vote, at all. Let's move beyond the critical theory.

He's lying about the troop levels.
I proved him wrong in a thread years ago, but he just keeps repeating the lie because that's what trolls do.
They count on most people forgetting when their lies are proved false and just accepting the oft repeated assertion later on.

 

[spudea]

On Syria, are you forgetting that he personally ordered a few hundred tomahawk missiles launched at Syrian government targets?

It was 59 missiles, not a "few hundred". The syrians were warned ahead of time and abandoned the airbase and no one was killed or injured, and there hasn't been a chemical weapon attack since then. Thank you Trump! I also remember Sec Def Mattis wanted full scale war in syria and to overthrow the government. Trump said NO. Thank you Trump!

 

[spudea]

So, what is your solution? Do you have anything in mind as far voting, candidates? And, afaik, I don't recall any media supporting any kind of draw down or outright withdrawal from Syria. But, never mind that and tell me if you plan to vote, for whom or who you'd like to see that isn't running and making you decide not to vote, at all. Let's move beyond the critical theory.

TheCount was here in 2016 promoting the butcher of Libya, his favorite candidate, Hillary Clinton. Pay him no mind. That's another big W for Trump. Imagine if HRC was president during that time and what would happen in Syria and the world. Holy bejeezus... Thank you Trump!

 

[TheCount]

It was 59 missiles, not a "few hundred". The syrians were warned ahead of time and abandoned the airbase and no one was killed or injured, and there hasn't been a chemical weapon attack since then. Thank you Trump!

Mhmm yes very interesting, wonderful, thank you Trump indeed.

I don't suppose that you might be conveniently forgetting that a year after that attack there was another attack? With twice as many missiles? For the same reasons? And that people were killed and injured?

 

[TheCount]

So, what is your solution? Do you have anything in mind as far voting, candidates?

My solution is to stop believing bullshit and/or lying. Don't vote for Trump because he's anti-war, because he's not. Also don't vote for Trump because he'll shrink the government, because he won't. Or because he'll reduce the debt, because he won't.... and so on.

In 2015 you could pretend that all of these mythical imaginary Trumps existed, that he was going to shrink government, expand liberty, eliminate departments, end wars, bring troops home, blah blah blah. None of it. Precisely 0% of it.

If you still have reasons to vote for Trump that are none of those things, if liberty, peace, etc. mean nothing to you, then just own that and move on with your life.

And, afaik, I don't recall any media supporting any kind of draw down or outright withdrawal from Syria.

If your point is that Trump is precisely as good as the media then we're in violent agreement.

 

[TheCount]

He's lying about the troop levels.
I proved him wrong in a thread years ago, but he just keeps repeating the lie because that's what trolls do.
They count on most people forgetting when their lies are proved false and just accepting the oft repeated assertion later on.

Projection

 

[spudea]

Mhmm yes very interesting, wonderful, thank you Trump indeed.

I don't suppose that you might be conveniently forgetting that a year after that attack there was another attack? With twice as many missiles? For the same reasons? And that people were killed and injured?

I did honestly forget, ty. I'm not finding any reports on people killed in that strike either unless you have a reputable source, seems like the Syrians/Russians would have highlighted any casualties. My reasoning still stands, it's another example of Trump taking the most conservative military option that did not result in further conflict/war. What would Hillary have done?

 

[TheCount]

I did honestly forget, ty. I'm not finding any reports on people killed in that strike either unless you have a reputable source, seems like the Syrians/Russians would have highlighted any casualties. My reasoning still stands, it's another example of Trump taking the most conservative military option that did not result in further conflict/war.

If you can't conceive of a more conservative military option in that scenario, that's your problem.

What would Hillary have done?

Since you're so concerned about the "butcher of Libya" I'm sure that you know that Trump used more Tomahawk missiles in Syria than Obama used in Libya.

 

[acptulsa]

What would Hillary have done?

We're going to choose who's in charge of the empire's collapse based on The Boogeyman Of Eight Years Ago..?

 

[Anti Federalist]

I sure as hell would have declared total war on Communist China, if I had been in charge.

 

[spudea]

We're going to choose who's in charge of the empire's collapse based on The Boogeyman Of Eight Years Ago..?

It is a relevant thought experiment for that time frame. If you are referring to the current election, vote 3rd party if you wish, but no Boogeyman is needed, I know 100% I was more free, more prosperous, and more at peace under Trump than I have been under Biden.

 

[Invisible Man]

It is a relevant thought experiment for that time frame. If you are referring to the current election, vote 3rd party if you wish, but no Boogeyman is needed, I know 100% I was more free, more prosperous, and more at peace under Trump than I have been under Biden.

But why? Do you deny that the loss of prosperity and freedom you have undergone since 2021 is the result of things done by Trump? Do you imagine that the consequences of Trump's actions ceased the day he left office and everything that has happened since that day is Biden's fault?

 

[acptulsa]

It is a relevant thought experiment for that time frame. If you are referring to the current election, vote 3rd party if you wish, but no Boogeyman is needed, I know 100% I was more free, more prosperous, and more at peace under Trump than I have been under Biden...

... and less so than under any president before Trump. I've been able to say that about every president since Johnson. The faces have changed but the slippery slope keeps pointing downhill.

Changing between these two teams has rarely made much temporary difference and has never made the slippery slope run uphill.

 

[susano]

He's lying about the troop levels.
I proved him wrong in a thread years ago, but he just keeps repeating the lie because that's what trolls do.
They count on most people forgetting when their lies are proved false and just accepting the oft repeated assertion later on.

Yes, I know he lies which is why I didn't further engage on that and tried, again, to get him to say who he does support, which we'll never receive an answer about. I'm fine with criticism of Trump and anyone saying they can't vote for him but, as I mentioned, critical theory is a non starter and that's all this appears to be.

 

[TheCount]

Yes, I know he lies which is why I didn't further engage on that and tried, again, to get him to say who he does support, which we'll never receive an answer about. I'm fine with criticism of Trump and anyone saying they can't vote for him but, as I mentioned, critical theory is a non starter and that's all this appears to be.

My mistake, I confused you for someone with principles.


In that case, you should write in Hillary Clinton for President because even she could make a more plausible claim to anti-war credentials than Donald Trump.

 

[Swordsmyth]

... and less so than under any president before Trump. I've been able to say that about every president since Johnson. The faces have changed but the slippery slope keeps pointing downhill.

Changing between these two teams has rarely made much temporary difference and has never made the slippery slope run uphill.

Nope, Trump was a great improvement over O'Bummer, possibly over baby shrub.
Trump was moving us in the right direction.

 

[Swordsmyth]

But why? Do you deny that the loss of prosperity and freedom you have undergone since 2021 is the result of things done by Trump? Do you imagine that the consequences of Trump's actions ceased the day he left office and everything that has happened since that day is Biden's fault?

I do so deny.