The War on Religion

The point is in support of the person you replied to about both parents having to work. It isn't just an excuse but a reality to many.

And I think it is a matter of being creative and exploring options in most cases. It is easier to complain and justify than it is to do what is necessary to provide an environment that suppports the values the parents want instilled in their children.
 
Christmas was started during pagan holidays so that the Christians of the day could celebrate without getting crucified. There is nothing wrong with the celebration of Christmas- it is what is in your heart that counts.

I didn't know that.

And homeschooling or good private schools are certainly the best option- nevertheless to ignore the fact that the economy has been set up so that most families must have at least 2 incomes is unwise. This is the perfect way to keep the masses in slavery w/o the options of real learning. I know many who struggle to keep the mother at home and to homeschool- the sacrifices are unbelievable and most people are so truly uneducated (in the real sense) themselves that they see no other options than public school.

Yes it is and that is why it has been done.
 
No it isn't.

Plenty of people make the sacrifices and yeah it is that simple. The choices and the sacrifices are hard, but rare is the person that cannot get their children out of public school if that is what they truly want to do. I was a single mom with a dead beat dad, working minimum wage and had no support from family, and my children were on scholarships to a local private school. Don't tell me it can't be done...
 
I've known too many outstanding people, educated in the public school system, who have gone on to marry and have children, attend private schools, give back to their community, etc., to say that the system is a complete failure.
 
Last time I checked, in this country you are allowed to be with any religion except Muslim, that's banned. Christians have nothing to complain about.

Also, athiests may have a complaint as well. If you are going into politics you are almost forced to be a part of a religion.
 
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I've known too many outstanding people, educated in the public school system, who have gone on to marry and have children, attend private schools, give back to their community, etc., to say that the system is a complete failure.

Fortunately,, sometimes the system fails.
 
And I think it is a matter of being creative and exploring options in most cases. It is easier to complain and justify than it is to do what is necessary to provide an environment that suppports the values the parents want instilled in their children.

It is also easier to judge others than to understand personal real life situations.

That said- I was homeschooled and I believe the public school system should be abolished and schooling should be left to families and/or local communities and private schools.
 
Its funny because.

The War on Religion is simply BLOWBACK.

Atheists have been persecuted for thousands of years and are overreacting now that modern communications has allowed us to come together.
 
Its funny because.

The War on Religion is simply BLOWBACK.

Atheists have been persecuted for thousands of years and are overreacting now that modern communications has allowed us to come together.

Perhaps there is some truth in what you say. But I think it goes deeper than that. Atheists are being manipulated by those in charge and the laws used to silence the religious will be used to silence you as well.
 
Its funny because.

The War on Religion is simply BLOWBACK.

Atheists have been persecuted for thousands of years and are overreacting now that modern communications has allowed us to come together.
Perhaps there is some truth in what you say. But I think it goes deeper than that. Atheists are being manipulated by those in charge and the laws used to silence the religious will be used to silence you as well.

Both excellent points, thnx. :)
 
Christmas was started during pagan holidays so that the Christians of the day could celebrate without getting crucified. There is nothing wrong with the celebration of Christmas- it is what is in your heart that counts.

Many popular customs associated with Christmas developed independently of the commemoration of Jesus' birth, with certain elements having origins in pre-Christian festivals that were celebrated around the winter solstice by pagan populations who were later converted to Christianity. These elements, including the Yule log from Yule and gift giving from Saturnalia, became syncretized into Christmas over the centuries. The prevailing atmosphere of Christmas has also continually evolved since the holiday's inception, ranging from a sometimes raucous, drunken, carnival-like state in the Middle Ages, to a tamer family-oriented and children-centered theme introduced in a 19th-century reformation. Additionally, the celebration of Christmas was banned on more than one occasion within Protestant Christendom due to concerns that it was too pagan or unbiblical.

A winter festival was the most popular festival of the year in many cultures. Reasons included the fact that less agricultural work needs to be done during the winter, as well as an expectation of better weather as spring approached. Modern Christmas customs include: gift-giving and merrymaking from Roman Saturnalia; greenery, lights, and charity from the Roman New Year; and Yule logs and various foods from Germanic feasts.

Pagan Scandinavia celebrated a winter festival called Yule, held in the late December to early January period. As Northern Europe was the last part to Christianize, its pagan traditions had a major influence on Christmas, especially Koleda, which was incorporated into the Christmas carol. Scandinavians still call Christmas Jul. In English, the word Yule is synonymous with Christmas, a usage first recorded in 900.

//
 
A short essay by Dr. Ron Paul from lewrockwell.com I post it here instead of the Religion section because I think we need to remember that the forces we are fighting against are attacking ALL sources of morality outside of them.

"As we celebrate another Yuletide season, it's hard not to notice that Christmas in America simply doesn't feel the same anymore. Although an overwhelming majority of Americans celebrate Christmas, and those who don't celebrate it overwhelmingly accept and respect our nation's Christmas traditions, a certain shared public sentiment slowly has disappeared. The Christmas spirit, marked by a wonderful feeling of goodwill among men, is in danger of being lost in the ongoing war against religion.

Through perverse court decisions and years of cultural indoctrination, the elitist, secular Left has managed to convince many in our nation that religion must be driven from public view. The justification is always that someone, somewhere, might possibly be offended or feel uncomfortable living in the midst of a largely Christian society, so all must yield to the fragile sensibilities of the few. The ultimate goal of the anti-religious elites is to transform America into a completely secular nation, a nation that is legally and culturally biased against Christianity.

This growing bias explains why many of our wonderful Christmas traditions have been lost. Christmas pageants and plays, including Handel's Messiah, have been banned from schools and community halls. Nativity scenes have been ordered removed from town squares, and even criticized as offensive when placed on private church lawns. Office Christmas parties have become taboo, replaced by colorless seasonal parties to ensure no employees feel threatened by a “hostile environment.” Even wholly non-religious decorations featuring Santa Claus, snowmen, and the like have been called into question as Christmas symbols that might cause discomfort. Earlier this month, firemen near Chicago reluctantly removed Christmas decorations from their firehouse after a complaint by some embittered busybody. Most noticeably, however, the once commonplace refrain of “Merry Christmas” has been replaced by the vague, ubiquitous “Happy Holidays.” But what holiday? Is Christmas some kind of secret, a word that cannot be uttered in public? Why have we allowed the secularists to intimidate us into downplaying our most cherished and meaningful Christian celebration?

The notion of a rigid separation between church and state has no basis in either the text of the Constitution or the writings of our Founding Fathers. On the contrary, our Founders' political views were strongly informed by their religious beliefs. Certainly the drafters of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, both replete with references to God, would be aghast at the federal government's hostility to religion. The establishment clause of the First Amendment was simply intended to forbid the creation of an official state church like the Church of England, not to drive religion out of public life.

The Founding Fathers envisioned a robustly Christian yet religiously tolerant America, with churches serving as vital institutions that would eclipse the state in importance. Throughout our nation's history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people's allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation's Christian heritage. Christmas itself may soon be a casualty of that war.

December 30, 2003

Dr. Ron Paul is a Republican member of Congress from Texas. "

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul148.html

Ah ha! Take that you church/state separationists.
 
christian here...we didnt ALWAYS celebrate this
and i dont because of the pagan influence in it
Christ said to celebrate his death ( & rebirth) NOT HIS BIRTH

Same here. Christmas is a Pagan holiday originally, so the article lacked a solid foundation other than what, to me, is a meaningless erosion of the meaning of a meaningless Pagan holiday, but rest assured, the points about religion are still good and there are way more examples to back that up than just Christmas.
 
I think you are missing the point to argue a specific doctrinal issue of your choosing.

Most of what is followed in Christianity would find some similarity with a pagan culture somewhere. God always has been and always will be, humans just can't always understand what he is saying and muck the message up.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. He was correct in pointing out the pagan roots of Christmas. It's an important distinction that needs to be made if you really care about where your faith lies. Similarities between Christianity and Pagan culture are an unfortunate phenomenon, and despite the fact that it is true that they have intermixed a bit, it shouldn't be like that. Christian doctrine is incompatible with Pagan culture.
 
Last time I checked, in this country you are allowed to be with any religion except Muslim, that's banned. Christians have nothing to complain about.

Also, athiests may have a complaint as well. If you are going into politics you are almost forced to be a part of a religion.

Pffft. Puh-lease. Just because nobody's tried being atheist and running for office yet, doesn't mean it can't be done. Besides, I really doubt you are suffering that much from not being able to run for office. Christians face a lot of persecution, ridicule, and hostility these days, especially those that dare make their beliefs sound reasonable. My impression among the liberty-oriented people around here and in the liberty community in general, is that libertarian Christians will generally be tolerant of others and try to explain their positions while they are facing a barrage of anti-Christian rhetoric including being called a bigot and having other ad hominem attacks on their sanity, mental capacity, and other insults hurled at them from the staunch secular libertarians who can't seem to understand that anyone would rather have a solid moral foundation to follow than just have arbitrary moral standards attached to social norms that change with the wind.

It's ingrained in our society to mock those who hold staunch Christian beliefs, while our public schools get funded for selling lies in our textbooks and pushing the evolution doctrine through every possible form of social media. Not to mention the belief that all scientific discoveries and phenomena must have a secular explanation in order to be valid. The inherently un-scientific, the complete dismissal of non-secular scientific reasonings, has now become the norm in science and has now been propagated throughout our society as the only valid science being secular science.

Science is a way of studying the natural world, while the scientific method is a way of thinking that can be expanded beyond the natural realm, although it can't actually be applied since we know very little beyond the natural world in order to study it. However, if you apply the scientific method to such questions as "Does God exist?" the default answer dictated by the scientific method would be to consider both options as equally valid before the question can be answered. However, "evidence" seems to be required to justify a belief in God even though it is just as reasonable as non-belief. Evidence should also be required to justify disbelief.

The simple truth of the matter is that no evidence that pertains to the natural world can be given, so science is not applicable and both possibilities, the existence or non-existence of God, are equally viable.

Regardless, however, I believe that, in order to attempt to answer such questions as "does God exist?", one needs to turn to philosophy. The biggest problem with the bias against religious beliefs in our society is the mis-application of science to answer questionst that it cannot possibly answer. Thus, our society, being indoctrinated to believe science is the same thing as secularism, has confused science as some sort of ultimate truth generator when, in fact, it only applies in a very limited parcel of our existence. When one considers the history of government involvement in our schooling system, it is hard to avoid the conclusion that this is not an accident. That is why those here who question the government most tend to be religious in some way. At least, that is my experience.
 
Pffft. Puh-lease. Just because nobody's tried being atheist and running for office yet, doesn't mean it can't be done. Besides, I really doubt you are suffering that much from not being able to run for office. Christians face a lot of persecution, ridicule, and hostility these days, especially those that dare make their beliefs sound reasonable. My impression among the liberty-oriented people around here and in the liberty community in general, is that libertarian Christians will generally be tolerant of others and try to explain their positions while they are facing a barrage of anti-Christian rhetoric including being called a bigot and having other ad hominem attacks on their sanity, mental capacity, and other insults hurled at them from the staunch secular libertarians who can't seem to understand that anyone would rather have a solid moral foundation to follow than just have arbitrary moral standards attached to social norms that change with the wind.

It's ingrained in our society to mock those who hold staunch Christian beliefs, while our public schools get funded for selling lies in our textbooks and pushing the evolution doctrine through every possible form of social media. Not to mention the belief that all scientific discoveries and phenomena must have a secular explanation in order to be valid. The inherently un-scientific, the complete dismissal of non-secular scientific reasonings, has now become the norm in science and has now been propagated throughout our society as the only valid science being secular science.

Science is a way of studying the natural world, while the scientific method is a way of thinking that can be expanded beyond the natural realm, although it can't actually be applied since we know very little beyond the natural world in order to study it. However, if you apply the scientific method to such questions as "Does God exist?" the default answer dictated by the scientific method would be to consider both options as equally valid before the question can be answered. However, "evidence" seems to be required to justify a belief in God even though it is just as reasonable as non-belief. Evidence should also be required to justify disbelief.

The simple truth of the matter is that no evidence that pertains to the natural world can be given, so science is not applicable and both possibilities, the existence or non-existence of God, are equally viable.

Regardless, however, I believe that, in order to attempt to answer such questions as "does God exist?", one needs to turn to philosophy. The biggest problem with the bias against religious beliefs in our society is the mis-application of science to answer questionst that it cannot possibly answer. Thus, our society, being indoctrinated to believe science is the same thing as secularism, has confused science as some sort of ultimate truth generator when, in fact, it only applies in a very limited parcel of our existence. When one considers the history of government involvement in our schooling system, it is hard to avoid the conclusion that this is not an accident. That is why those here who question the government most tend to be religious in some way. At least, that is my experience.

From what I have seen, science and religion go hand in hand. Research that is consistent with God creating the universe is accepted and funded. Research that is inconsistent with God gets ignored.

Additionally, the scientific methods used are flawed. They are constantly trying to find the smallest of details which have no chance of explaining the universe as a whole and develop tunnel vision. There have been very few realistic attempts to explain everything. The theories I have seen have no chance of explaining everything, even if they are right.
 
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