The Official BREXIT Thread

[Wilf]

[FONT=&quot]

If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]How?[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten … the list grew and grew.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over – Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession … broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was “never”. When Michael Gove went on and on about “informal negotiations” … why? why not the formal ones straight away? … he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign.

Is it possible that their is more under Brexit that we might not know?[/FONT]

 

[Wilf]

Britain's opposition leader Jeremy Corbyn is facing a crisis within his Labour Party following the EU referendum, having sacked one shadow cabinet minister for attempting a coup, and as another member resigned, citing ineffective leadership.

In the early hours of Sunday, Corbyn sacked shadow foreign secretary Hilary Benn as deep divisions emerged in the Labour Party following the UK's vote to leave the European Union.
Corbyn, facing pressure to step aside after Thursday's referendum, dismissed Benn after reports that he was preparing to lead a coup against the Labour leader.
Hours later, Heidi Alexander, the shadow health secretary, resigned.
In a letter posted to Corbyn, published on her Twitter page, she said: "As much as I respect you as a man of principle, I do not believe you have the capacity to shape the answers our country is demanding and I believe if we are to form the next Government, a change of leadership is essential."
Corbyn has been criticised by some Labour MPs who say he did not campaign hard enough in support of EU membership, and had failed to convince millions of voters in the party's heartlands to back "Remain".


"It is understood that Benn had called fellow MPs over the weekend to suggest that he would ask Corbyn to stand down if there was significant support for a move against him,"The Observer newspaper said.
"He had also asked shadow cabinet colleagues to join him in resigning if Corbyn ignored that request."
In a statement, Benn said he was sacked after telling Corbyn in a phone call that he had lost confidence in his leadership.
"It has now become clear that there is widespread concern among Labour MPs and in the shadow cabinet about Jeremy Corbyn's leadership of our party. In particular, there is no confidence in our ability to win the next general election, which may come sooner than expected, if Jeremy continues as leader," Benn said.
"At this critical time for our country, following the result of the EU referendum, we need strong and effective leadership of the Labour Party that is capable of winning public support so that we can stand up for the people of Britain.
"In a phone call to Jeremy, I told him that for these reasons I had lost confidence in his ability to lead the party and he then dismissed me from the shadow cabinet."
[h=2]Brexit effect[/h]Benn, the son of former Labour politician Tony Benn, also publicly disagreed with Corbyn in September over air strikes on Syria.
Soon after the 52 to 48 percent vote in favour of Brexit, or a British exit, which triggered the resignation of Prime Minister David Cameron, two Labour MPs - Margaret Hodge and Ann Coffey - submitted a motion of no-confidence in Corbyn. Others have also called for his resignation.
But in his first speech since the vote, Corbyn on Saturday emphasised the large mandate given to him by party activists at a leadership contest last year, in which he swept to victory on a wave of support for his left-wing political agenda.
Asked whether he would stand for re-election in any leadership contest, he said: "Yes, I'm here.
"There are some people in the Labour Party ... who would want probably somebody else to be the leader of the Labour Party, they've made that abundantly clear," Corbyn added.
"What I'm totally amazed by is that in the past 24 hours 140,000 people have said they do not want the Labour Party to spend the next two months debating the leadership," he said, citing an online petition calling for him to continue leading the party.
[h=2]'Immigration debate needed'[/h]Around one third of Labour voters are estimated to have backed a British exit from the EU on Thursday, with many of those coming from traditional working class areas where high immigration tops the list of public concerns.
Responding to criticism from Labour colleagues that he had failed to address those concerns, Corbyn said there needed to be a national dialogue on immigration to reach a new settlement.
READ MORE: After Brexit, what happens next?
"We can't duck the issue of immigration, clearly it was a factor," he said. "We need to start an open and honest debate."
Corbyn said the vote showed a backlash against the EU principle of free movement. But he added that if Britain wanted to retain access to the European single market - one of many issues cast into doubt by the vote - he believed it would have to accept free movement as a condition of that deal.
"If we were part of the single market in future, then clearly that would be accompanied by the continuing free movement of people," he said.

A coup is comming

 

[GunnyFreedom]

When people copypasta without stripping the text of formatting...

 

[susano]

[FONT="]

Is it possible that their is more under Brexit that we might not know?[/FONT]

What do you mean by more?

A few pages back I said I was unsure about Boris (don't know much about him other than he was mayor of London) because of him saying (post referendum) there was "no hurry". I also said I thought Cameron was trying to stall things with his refusal to being negotiations. I have no doubt that many will try to sabotage this. OTOH...

Legislation will be introduced to curtail the powers of the European Court of Justice, which ministers say will make it easier to kick out foreign criminals and terrorists.

A senior Vote Leave insider said: “If a Leave supporter wins the race to become the next prime minister then legislation will be brought forward before the end of the year that will start to free Britain from the control of Brussels.”

It had been thought that the process of Britain freeing itself from the control of Brussels would take years but Leave campaigner Michael Gove has said previously that it should begin immediately with a series of interim emergency laws.

The immediate powers being demanded include freeing intelligence agencies from European law, allowing foreign criminals and terrorists to be deported without hindrance and freeing the Armed Forces from Brussels’ diktats.

Tory MP Andrew Bridgen, who led the Leave campaign in the East Midlands, said: “The public have spoken and now deserve action. They took the bold decision to leave the EU and I salute them for that.

“Leave campaigners are keen to reward the public for showing such faith in them by introducing some immediate changes that will start to put Britain back in control.”

Justice Secretary Mr Gove set out his blueprint for independence last month.

He said the Government would have to instantly enact new laws to stop the influence of “rogue” European courts and allow the immediate deportation of terrorists.

“We’ve stressed throughout that the day after we vote to leave, nothing fundamental changes and we still have the same trading arrangements and we start a process of informal talks and negotiations with our European partners,” Mr Gove said.

“But there are some things that we can change relatively quickly. And one of the things we can do is that we can deal with the European Court of Justice, which has become a rogue court.”

Former Defence Secretary Liam Fox said a new unit needed to be set up to oversee the negotiations.

But he said it must be independent of the Treasury and Foreign Office.

“It is very important that a negotiating unit is set up to disentangle us from Europe and in my view it needs to be set up outside the Treasury or the Foreign Office because both the Chancellor and the Foreign Secretary are committed Remainers so we have to have a unit that can act independently,” Mr Fox said.

Vote Leave is expected to meet tomorrow afternoon when they will draw up detailed plans.

The meeting will consider whether and when they intend to invoke Article 50, or whether to simply repeal the 1972 Act which makes EU law supreme in this country.

The latter option could see the introduction of a short Brexit or Restoration of Sovereignty Act, which supporters think would amount to a “unilateral divorce” and would undermine efforts by Brussels to railroad Britain into potentially punitive negotiations and a deal with remaining EU nations on their terms.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...-back-powers-Euro-courts-within-months-Brexit

Note those weasel words I bolded.

I expect there will be some huge fights as some try to drag their feet and others demand real action to get 'er done.

The founding member countries of the EU are meeting either Sunday or Monday and they've talking a fast divorce but I think that's tough talk to scare the Brits. I think all of the talk of some catastrophe for Britain (or England and Wales, if comes to that) is absurd. Yes, there will problems in the short run but they'll recover and excel in the long run.

 

[susano]

A coup is comming

In the Labour Party or the government?

Like US leftists, the British left is full of neoliberals and they abandoned their traditional base (blue collar workers) in favor of cosmopolitan hipsters and well to do establishment players. I suppose that's why Corbyn was tepid in his support for Remain. Labour also has a serious problem when it comes to discussing immigration because they are neoliberal globalists but that working class base they need to win back are the ones most harmed by immigration and globalization. They're going to have to come up with something better than "racist!" and "xenophobe!".

This is going to be really interesting to see this all play out.

 

[susano]

A petition calling for Sadiq Khan to declare London an independent state after the UK voted to quit the EU has been signed by thousands of people.

The petition's organiser James O'Malley, said the capital was "a world city" which should "remain at the heart of Europe".

The petition, which suggests the mayor could become "President Sadiq", has already been signed by more than 27,000 people.

One person who commented on the page said he felt "morally, culturally and historically closer to Paris, Brussels and Rome than I do to Sunderland".

Another wrote: "We need to break free of the dead weight."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36620401


See, there's your hipsters, affluent lefties and professionals for ya. It's like how the east and west coast liberals refer to the rest of the US as "fly-over country". There is outright contempt for smaller town and rural people and an attitude that they should have no say about anything.

I'm actually all for local rule but they want to be a city-state ruled by Brussels so that's not really local rule. If they want go indy, they should have to buy London. Every London resident could get an assessment to be paid to the rest of the English outside of London. I suspect they couldn't afford it, lol.

Sheesh. It's gonna get really ugly.

 

[RandallFan]

 

[tod evans]

Meh... not interesting.



OK, but I've driven better.



OK, now this is over the line. Twinnings Earl Grey is some of the most flavorless swill on the planet. Doesn't even qualify as tea.

If you want a good Earl Grey, try Capital Tea's French Lavender Earl Grey. capitalteas.com

There are others but this is a good place to start.

Really Tod... I'm surprised.

I've never had opportunity to drive either of those, and I grabbed the first tea image I found....:o

Those rides are out of my reach, and I'm glad to have Lipton to make sweet-tea with....Can't remember ever having tried Earl Grey let alone having knowledge of the different types...

 

[tod evans]

Godfrey Bloom

 

[dannno]

Can't remember ever having tried Earl Grey let alone having knowledge of the different types...

 

[tod evans]

/

Never have watched the "new and improved" Star Wars......

To me Star Wars started out on a black-n-white TV and became realistic when our family could afford a color set....

 

[Natural Citizen]

Here is a rather accurate assessment by the Daily Bell of all places. It's important to pay attention to Germany during all of this stuff.


Anthony Wile: Brexit Is Part of Internet Reformation Building Around the World





Previously...and germane to the above piece... Merkel wants Germany military budget boosted to counter ‘external threats’

Germany should substantially increase its defense spending to cope with “external threats,” Chancellor Angela Merkel has said, stressing that Berlin can’t count on the US, and the EU is incapable of defending itself.

During an economics conference in Berlin on Tuesday, Merkel said the EU can’t rely on the transatlantic partnership with the US to deal with external threats, Reuters reports.

“Sure enough this means that a country like Germany, which today spends around 1.2 percent of its gross domestic product (GDP) on defense, and the United States, which spends 3.4 percent of GDP for defense will have to converge,” Merkel said.

In June, the German government announced it was seeking to make changes to its “White Paper”, a document outlining the country’s security policy and stating it would regard Russia as a threat. Placing Moscow on the list of the 10 most serious threats to Berlin, the German Defense Ministry said Russia is no longer a “partner” but has become a “challenge."

Other “threats” mentioned in the document included international terrorism, radical nationalism, the migrant crisis and an increased risk of epidemics that might occur due to the surge in Germany’s population.

I'm pretty sure she isn't talking about Russia when she mentions external threats. Germany has too much going on with Russia for it to be Russia. Particularly energy partnerships. And most German politicians as well as Foreign Minister Steinmeier are against Russian sanctions anyway.

 

[nobody's_hero]

And yet, there is no real reason why they could not... in principle.

They would, however, be compelled to rid themselves of the Muslims. Slaughtering them would probably be the only way and that's not such fun.
.

Not necessarily. They can send them over the border to Scotland so the Scots can see first-hand just how wonderful the EU immigration policies are.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Consider this possibility: Theye have anticipated this outcome (Theye are not, after all, stupid) and have planted the Muslims with the idea that if the EU fractures, thereby greatly threatening globalist designs, they will be set loose on the native populations, rendering the continent to ash for a third time in a century.

You know, we should really pay attention to see if ISIS conveniently shows up in some of these EU nations now that I think about it. Especially the nations who may be contemplating following Britain's move. Naw?

 

[juleswin]

You know, we should really pay attention to see if ISIS conveniently shows up in some of these EU nations now that I think about it. Especially the nations who may be contemplating following Britain's move. Naw?

ISIS shows up in any country contemplating a vote and that country is gone from the EU. I know ISIS want to draw the EU in but they have to be careful how they attack cos if they do it the wrong way, the result could be those EU countries ending support for rebels and maybe sanction Turkey which would hurt them really badly.

 

[timosman]

Brexit: EU Planned to Ban Popular British Tea Kettles, Toasters

http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...ned-ban-popular-british-tea-kettles-toasters/

26 Jun 2016

Just two months before the Brexit vote, the European Union announced that it would begin banning the most popular “high powered” British tea kettles and toasters.
With British consumption of tea outstripping continental Europe’s average by a factor of six, the European Commission (EC) had quietly delayed the implementation of new “ecodesign” restrictions on small household appliances during the run-up to the Brexit referendum vote over fears that bans would be perceived as an assault on the British staples of tea and toast.

But European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker, in his weekly College of Commissioners meeting on April 20, accidentally revealed that the EU, just after would move forward with regulatory bans against eight of the best selling kettles and nine of the best selling toasters in the United Kingdom just after the Brexit vote.

The announcement set off a firestorm of ridicule regarding the arrogance of the EU nanny state. It also revived the bitter anger over 2014 regulations on supposedly “high-powered” vacuum cleaners that threatened to ban 6 out of the top 10 selling vacuum cleaners in the UK, including the wildly popular British made “Dyson Ball” and “Dyson Cordless.”

Writing an Op-ed for the London Telegraph newspaper at the time, Sir James Dyson blasted the “flawed” EU energy efficiency labeling regime as “misleading shoppers,” because the “The boffin [scientific] bureaucrats have been testing virgin vacuum cleaners in a sterile laboratory.” Dyson complained that as a result, the regulators’ performance “grades on the labels are not representative of how the vacuum will work in the real world.”

Despite the UK vote for a Brexit, the European Commission “Growth: Internal Market, Industry, Entrepreneurship, and SMEs website still claims there is such a large “world-wide demand for more efficient products to reduce energy and resource consumption” that more EU regulations are needed “to eliminate the least performing products to make way for industrial competitiveness and innovation.”

 

[Jamesiv1]

I haven't seen much response from Hillary regarding Brexit... Anything good?

 

[timosman]

 

[susano]

I haven't seen much response from Hillary regarding Brexit... Anything good?

I heard a comment her campaign released. It was about Hillary's main concern was protecting American families from any economic fallout caused by Brexit. Cuz, you, know, Hillary cares so much about the wee people.

 

[NancyM]

What do you think is going to be with property markets in the UK and the EU? I believe in the slight fall of prices in England and Spain. Spain will suffer a wane of demand for real estate from British buyers who were extremely active in this market. And in London the weak pound will play its part to attract new foreign investors (according to brokers' forecasts https://tranio.com/united-kingdom/n...ould-wobble-as-uk-votes-to-leave-the-eu_5152/) The real estate market in Britain may even benefit from heightened foreign interest.