The great college hoax

heavenlyboy34

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http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2009/0202/060.html?partner=email


[h1]The Great College Hoax[/h1]
Kathy Kristof, 01.14.09, 06:00 PM EST
Forbes Magazine dated February 02, 2009 Higher education can be a financial disaster. Especially with the return on degrees down and student loan sharks on the prowl.



As steadily as ivy creeps up the walls of its well-groomed campuses, the education industrial complex has cultivated the image of college as a sure-fire path to a life of social and economic privilege.
Joel Kellum says he's living proof that the claim is a lie. A 40-year-old Los Angeles resident, Kellum did everything he was supposed to do to get ahead in life. He worked hard as a high schooler, got into the University of Virginia and graduated with a bachelor's degree in history.


Accepted into the California Western School of Law, a private San Diego institution, Kellum couldn't swing the $36,000 in annual tuition with financial aid and part-time work. So he did what friends and professors said was the smart move and took out $60,000 in student loans.
Kellum's law school sweetheart, Jennifer Coultas, did much the same. By the time they graduated in 1995, the couple was $194,000 in debt. They eventually married and each landed a six-figure job. Yet even with Kellum moonlighting, they had to scrounge to come up with $145,000 in loan payments. With interest accruing at up to 12% a year, that whittled away only $21,000 in principal. Their remaining bill: $173,000 and counting.
Kellum and Coultas divorced last year. Each cites their struggle with law school debt as a major source of stress on their marriage. "Two people with this much debt just shouldn't be together," Kellum says.
The two disillusioned attorneys were victims of an unfolding education hoax on the middle class that's just as insidious, and nearly as sweeping, as the housing debacle. The ingredients are strikingly similar, too: Misguided easy-money policies that are encouraging the masses to go into debt; a self-serving establishment trading in half-truths that exaggerate the value of its product; plus a Wall Street money machine dabbling in outright fraud as it foists unaffordable debt on the most vulnerable marks.
College graduates will earn $1 million more than those with only a high school diploma, brags Mercy College radio ads running in the New York area. The $1 million shibboleth is a favorite of college barkers.


Like many good cons, this one contains a kernel of truth. Census figures show that college grads earn an average of $57,500 a year, which is 82% more than the $31,600 high school alumni make. Multiply the $25,900 difference by the 40 years the average person works and, sure enough, it comes to a tad over $1 million.



But anybody who has gotten a passing grade in statistics knows what's wrong with this line of argument. A correlation between B.A.s and incomes is not proof of cause and effect. It may reflect nothing more than the fact that the economy rewards smart people and smart people are likely to go to college. To cite the extreme and obvious example: Bill Gates is rich because he knows how to run a business, not because he matriculated at Harvard. Finishing his degree wouldn't have increased his income.
All the while students have been lulled into thinking of the extra $1 million that will be theirs, they have been forced to disgorge an ever larger fraction of it in pursuit of the degree. While the premium that college grads earn over high schoolers has remained relatively constant over the past five years, the cost of acquiring a degree has risen at twice the rate of inflation, dramatically undermining any value a sheepskin adds.
Offsetting that million-dollar income discrepancy is the $46,700 four-year cost of tuition, fees, books, room and board at a public school and $99,900 at a private one--even after financial aid, scholarships and grants. Add all this to the equation and college grads don't pull even with high school grads in lifetime income until age 33 on average, the College Board says. Even that doesn't include the $125,000 in pay students forgo over four years.
"I call it the million-dollar misunderstanding," says Mark Schneider, vice president of the American Institutes for Research, of the prevailing propaganda.
Not only are college numbers spun. Some are patently spurious, says Richard Sander, a law professor at UCLA. Law schools lure in minority students to improve diversity rankings without disclosing that less than half of African-Americans who enter these programs ever pass the bar. Schools goose employment statistics by temporarily hiring new grads and spotlighting kids who land top-paying jobs, while glossing over far-lower average incomes. The one certainty: The average law grad owes $100,000 in student debt.
"There are a lot of aspects of selling education that are tinged with consumer fraud," Sander says. "There is a definite conspiracy to lead students down a primrose path."
Warped as the numbers are, they don't begin to account for the hidden cost of higher education: financing it. Borrowing has doubled over the past decade, to roughly $85 billion in new student loans in the 2007--08 academic year, bringing total student debt owed to well over half a trillion dollars. The average borrower went $19,200 into debt for a diploma in 2004, a 58% increase after inflation since 1993, according to the Project on Student Debt.
 
I think most college grads lose their "dream" because the colleges spoonfeed to them all their "options" (aka worthless degree programs)

Bring colleges back to the basics when it comes to degree offerings (which wouldnt include business degrees) and only offer things like education, law, medicine and engineering. Who gives a crap about ecnomists, art majors etc
 
I think most college grads lose their "dream" because the colleges spoonfeed to them all their "options" (aka worthless degree programs)

Bring colleges back to the basics when it comes to degree offerings (which wouldnt include business degrees) and only offer things like education, law, medicine and engineering. Who gives a crap about ecnomists, art majors etc

If you want "job training" just go to a trade school. :rolleyes: Colleges should be about "education" for life.<IMHO> ;)
 
I think most college grads lose their "dream" because the colleges spoonfeed to them all their "options" (aka worthless degree programs)

Bring colleges back to the basics when it comes to degree offerings (which wouldnt include business degrees) and only offer things like education, law, medicine and engineering. Who gives a crap about ecnomists, art majors etc

Agreed. But, I would take out economics in your example. Real economics is a very intense quantitative subject. You can't expect them to have all the answers clearly, but it is an inexact subject with so many variables, but it is definitely rigorous.
 
I think most college grads lose their "dream" because the colleges spoonfeed to them all their "options" (aka worthless degree programs)

Bring colleges back to the basics when it comes to degree offerings (which wouldnt include business degrees) and only offer things like education, law, medicine and engineering. Who gives a crap about ecnomists, art majors etc

Art majors, music majors, literature majors, etc. produce most the stuff you use every day-food packaging, soundtracks, books, etc.(duh!:rolleyes:) ;) I agree though-specialty schools in a free market could handle these things better than government-funded universities.:)
 
Art majors, music majors, literature majors, etc. produce most the stuff you use every day-food packaging, soundtracks, books, etc.(duh!:rolleyes:) ;) I agree though-specialty schools in a free market could handle these things better than government-funded universities.:)

I guess the point of my post was just what you said above. Specialty schools could exist to 'educate' the people that want to pursue these.

Just go through a large university's major list and you probably cant find a use for half of those majors.

Relating to funding and costs... the original article talked about large costs, especially law school etc.. It seems even the state run schools are charging a ton, let alone the private ones. These places are filled with bearucrats and red tape and if you ever get into the nuts and bolts, most institutions could give a squat about undergraduates because they have their research "prestige" or whattever....so probably in the end, college should cost less than it does now anyway

Should the government fund universities? Im mixed on that question, but if the government(s) quit taking income taxes we would all have more money to pay for things like college,

random rant I know..
 
I guess the point of my post was just what you said above. Specialty schools could exist to 'educate' the people that want to pursue these.

Just go through a large university's major list and you probably cant find a use for half of those majors.

Relating to funding and costs... the original article talked about large costs, especially law school etc.. It seems even the state run schools are charging a ton, let alone the private ones. These places are filled with bearucrats and red tape and if you ever get into the nuts and bolts, most institutions could give a squat about undergraduates because they have their research "prestige" or whattever....so probably in the end, college should cost less than it does now anyway

Should the government fund universities? Im mixed on that question, but if the government(s) quit taking income taxes we would all have more money to pay for things like college,

random rant I know..

On top of that, at least half of the required classes for any given major have little or nothing to do with the major itself. Colleges just throw extra requirements in to extort money from students. :p:mad:
 
I think most college grads lose their "dream" because the colleges spoonfeed to them all their "options" (aka worthless degree programs)

Bring colleges back to the basics when it comes to degree offerings (which wouldnt include business degrees) and only offer things like education, law, medicine and engineering. Who gives a crap about ecnomists, art majors etc

Screw you. Business degrees teach you how to make money.

Art majors wait tables.
 
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We need math majors too! ;)

LOL!! Coincidentally, my dad double majored in math and chemistry. He wound up doing what he learned in the army-electrician work. ;) LOL!! (and my mom paid for most of his tuition after they married :O )
 
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Agreed. But, I would take out economics in your example. Real economics is a very intense quantitative subject. You can't expect them to have all the answers clearly, but it is an inexact subject with so many variables, but it is definitely rigorous.

Ya, seriously. Economics is pretty important, and it is very much in demand.. when jobs are in demand, that is..
 
Screw you. Business degrees teach you how to make money.

Art majors wait tables.

Almost all of my childhood friends were art majors... one is a sketch artist for law enforcement, on studies ancient art on trips to foreign countries and teaches about the ancients arts in a local high school in conjunction with history.

Now, one is a gay waiter in Baton Rouge who uses meth.. but, thats just one..LOL.
 
The article assumes that every kid is stupid enough to pay more than $10,000 a semester for school. I pay $20 per hour, then I'll go to a University. It's much cheaper and, I would say, really does help.

I'll major in Business Administration with a concentration in Entertainment Management and a minor in Radio-Television-Film.
 
Almost all of my childhood friends were art majors... one is a sketch artist for law enforcement, on studies ancient art on trips to foreign countries and teaches about the ancients arts in a local high school in conjunction with history.

Now, one is a gay waiter in Baton Rouge who uses meth.. but, thats just one..LOL.

two out of three ain't bad!
isn't that a meatloaf song?
 
Can one factor of the equation to high price college education is that it's hard to compete against subsidized government schools?

May I ask, what else makes college so expensive.
What happened?

:confused:
 
Screw you. Business degrees teach you how to make money.

Art majors wait tables.

I'm not a huge fan of some of the art majors either, but that would still be generalizing. Wish I didn't have music appreciation though. Can play a couple instruments and listen to music already and I have to put up with this shit....why?
 
Screw you. Business degrees teach you how to make money.

Art majors wait tables.

I wouldn't disagree that business degrees teach you how to make money, or that most art majors are underemployed. But hey, I've taken classes in neither.
 
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