presence
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The case for and against Jesse Benton's professional campaign involvement
- Thread starter Bryan
- Start date
Yes, except then Jesse went back after that was released and said that what he did in the conversation was just to appease a hardcore Ron Paul supporter, and that he really does believe in Mitch McConnell:
For those just joining this thread and not reading the first 6 pages, here's my list of some reasons why Jesse Benton shouldn't be near Rand in 2016:
(mod edit)
I don't suggest to cry over Ron Paul's loss or spilled milk, as said (mod edit) but there are plenty of reasons that Jesse Benton should not be involved in any fashion with Rand in 2016, and those are just some of them.
(mod edit)
I don't suggest to cry over Ron Paul's loss or spilled milk, as said (mod edit) but there are plenty of reasons that Jesse Benton should not be involved in any fashion with Rand in 2016, and those are just some of them.
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jmdrake
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/thread
Seriously trying to turn this into a criticism of Tom Woods is stupid. Jesse Benton has become a liability. In 2016 if Tom Woods is working with the campaign nobody will notice. If Jesse Benton is, it will be a news story and not in a good way. Chris Hightower got thrown under the bus. The overeager volunteer who stepped on a protesters neck at a Rand Paul rally got thrown under the bus. The Southern Avenger threw himself under the bus. Really, it's simple. Jesse Benton being involved in any visible way will hurt the campaign. If he can be involved in a way that nobody knows he's involved than I guess that's okay...as long as he not in a position to colossally screw things up like he or someone did with the whole "Let's pay a Michelle Bachmann aide to switch sides" fiasco. Seriously nobody involved in that should be directly involved with the campaign. If Ron himself was facing a federal indictment over slimy politics then he would need to be at arms length at least until that was cleared up as well. Really, why should everyone be expected to sacrifice except Jesse Benton? Benton may be a great guy and the best political strategist on the planet, but he's a liability at this point. Period.
presence
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...which is why I suggested that we reverse the chain of command from the top down to a bottom up here:
The present curriculum...
It would do us right to work some stuff out in Roberts Rules... turn this place into a
Parlimentary Action Liberty Bootcamp
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acptulsa
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The Harding/Coolidge era did change things. And people enjoyed the liberty they got in the Roaring Twenties. In fact, it wasn't until the kids from that era got to be ninety or so that they could get away with accelerating the rate of tyrannization.
If we could get everyone a little more experience with liberty that way, they'd once again know what we're fighting for, and they'd help us do it.
Anti Federalist
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I do not think that will ever be permitted again, at least not by the post WWII ruling junta in DC
NewRightLibertarian
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Woods deserves props for standing up for the grassroots against Ron Paul Inc. and their slimy corrupt coattail-riding goons like Jesse Benton. The revisionists want to paint the picture that the Ron Paul 2012 campaign was managed so well and Benton was responsible for that. Nothing could be further from the truth. I don't know if they're trying to fool themselves, or just whore themselves out for a paycheck. Either way, it's sickening.
specsaregood
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I think that really sums it up. Given Randals past history with other employees that became a problem I would be surprised if Benton was involved at all publically or officially.
I could come up with some reasons/excuses for why he might be involved in some capacity (especially initially) but can't come up with any for why he SHOULD be involved.
helmuth_hubener
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Reasons to Not Publicly Hire Jesse Benton for the Rand Paul 2012 Campaign
1) He's Facing Federal Election Fraud Charges
2) Born in 1977, Benton's political career began in 2000 when he worked with the Republican National Committee.
3) He has essentially gone straight from college into politics with very little experience, and paychecks in the 100K range from family members' campaign funds.
4) Jesse aired grievances about Tom Woods and treated him poorly.
5) Rand Paul dropped Chris Hightower in 2009 for less.
6) Jesse's definition of winning and what one must do to 'win' is exactly opposite of what the grassroots' definition of 'winning' is and what one must do to 'win', according to some.
7) Jesse is seen as seeking to co-opt grassroots' power and attempted to use it to further his own ends.
8) Bryan, owner of RandPaulForums.com, does not think his text message to Peter Schiff regarding Paul Fest was appropriate.
9) According to Kent Snyder, the campaign chairman for Ron Paul in his 2008 campaign (who tragically died of pneumonia), Mr. Benton was never a part of any campaign until he hooked up with Ron Paul's granddaughter, and he had no knowledge of Ron Paul -- he was hired because he was unemployed and affordable.
10) If you want to pit Tom Woods' integrity and transparency against Jesse Benton, most RPF forum members will probably take Tom Woods 100 times out of 100.
11) Many supporters see Mr. Benton as having undermined the Ron Paul 2012 campaign.
12) Rand bringing on Jesse Benton to his campaign team will demonstrate cronyism, nepotism and a lack of quality judgment.
13) Jesse Benton's management got Ron Paul fewer votes than Rick Santorum in 2012.
14) Jesse Benton's management got Ron Paul fewer votes than Newt Gingrich in 2012.
15) Jesse Benton showed in 2012 that he didn't know how to tailor a political message to help his candidate win, according to jjdoyle (and other forum members).
16) Mr. Benton didn't know how to guide the energy of the grassroots -- to the contrary, he alienated the vast majority of them who were aware of him.
17) He was perceived by many as being "busy spraying Roundup everywhere trying to kill the grassroots."
18) Supporters saw his actions as wasting millions of their dollars and wasting months and years of their lives.
19) Under Jesse Benton's direction, RonPaul2012.com was used to defend a Mitt Romney endorsement.
20) There was a lack of transparency in Mr. Benton's actions. The lack of transparency in and of itself is an indication of something, according to some.
21) Can we say that Rand won't have to defend him in some regard? Can we say that Rand won't have to cut ties in an embarrassing kerfuffle? No, it is likely that Rand would have to defend Mr. Benton, and would eventually have to part paths with him in an embarrassing way.
22) Benton's learning curve leeway is all used up and some supporters are having a hard time figuring out what, if anything, he has learned.
23) Under Mr. Benton, despite having raised more money than the campaigns of Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich, Ron Paul's campaign still couldn't win a single state's popular vote.
24) Many of Mr. Benton's decisions were and still are seen as having been made in order to help Mitt Romney win the nomination, a goal not shared by most of the supporters of Ron Paul in 2012.
25) His apparent political opportunism raises the concern that he would turn on a dime and change loyalties if it was politically expedient in the future.
26) According to angelatc, who was involved in the Ron Paul 2012 campaign and had personal experience with Mr. Benton, and also was in close contact with Tom Woods, a victim of Mr. Benton's wrath: Jesse Benton is a mealy mouthed little self important worm who hasn't actually won an election.
27) A good campaign manager stays out of the spotlight. Benton has not, so he fails in that regard. Furthermore, most of his spotlight is negative.
28) Jesse Benton had to resign from the Mitch McConnell 2014 campaign.
29) Based on the Sorensen issue alone, many RPF members think he should be kept far, far, away.
30) Allegations of shady dealings is a red flag because the competition will use every negative thing out there to try and smear Rand.
31) There are rumors of Mr. Benton having been seen wandering around the Washington D.C. area with a young female who is not his wife, possibly an intern.
32) The one RonPaulForums member on this thread who is an actual successful campaign manager, mosquitobites, gives a negative assessment of Jesse Benton as a campaign manager. According to mosquitobites: "Most of [Jesse Benton's] spotlight is negative." Mosquitobites believes he has "failed on that front." This unfavorable assessment from an experienced, successful campaign manager should carry a lot of weight.
33) People of known good character, people whom we trust, such as Tom Woods, have voiced serious concerns -- indeed, have issued a call of no confidence -- regarding the character of Jesse Benton.
That last one is why a certain user keeps trying to bring the conversation around to Tom Woods. If he could just discredit and smear Tom Woods, drag his name through the mud, then Mr. Woods' criticisms of Mr. Benton would have less weight and credibility. Unfortunately for this user, the character of Tom Woods is stellar, and his reputation gleams stainless.
1) He's Facing Federal Election Fraud Charges
2) Born in 1977, Benton's political career began in 2000 when he worked with the Republican National Committee.
3) He has essentially gone straight from college into politics with very little experience, and paychecks in the 100K range from family members' campaign funds.
4) Jesse aired grievances about Tom Woods and treated him poorly.
5) Rand Paul dropped Chris Hightower in 2009 for less.
6) Jesse's definition of winning and what one must do to 'win' is exactly opposite of what the grassroots' definition of 'winning' is and what one must do to 'win', according to some.
7) Jesse is seen as seeking to co-opt grassroots' power and attempted to use it to further his own ends.
8) Bryan, owner of RandPaulForums.com, does not think his text message to Peter Schiff regarding Paul Fest was appropriate.
9) According to Kent Snyder, the campaign chairman for Ron Paul in his 2008 campaign (who tragically died of pneumonia), Mr. Benton was never a part of any campaign until he hooked up with Ron Paul's granddaughter, and he had no knowledge of Ron Paul -- he was hired because he was unemployed and affordable.
10) If you want to pit Tom Woods' integrity and transparency against Jesse Benton, most RPF forum members will probably take Tom Woods 100 times out of 100.
11) Many supporters see Mr. Benton as having undermined the Ron Paul 2012 campaign.
12) Rand bringing on Jesse Benton to his campaign team will demonstrate cronyism, nepotism and a lack of quality judgment.
13) Jesse Benton's management got Ron Paul fewer votes than Rick Santorum in 2012.
14) Jesse Benton's management got Ron Paul fewer votes than Newt Gingrich in 2012.
15) Jesse Benton showed in 2012 that he didn't know how to tailor a political message to help his candidate win, according to jjdoyle (and other forum members).
16) Mr. Benton didn't know how to guide the energy of the grassroots -- to the contrary, he alienated the vast majority of them who were aware of him.
17) He was perceived by many as being "busy spraying Roundup everywhere trying to kill the grassroots."
18) Supporters saw his actions as wasting millions of their dollars and wasting months and years of their lives.
19) Under Jesse Benton's direction, RonPaul2012.com was used to defend a Mitt Romney endorsement.
20) There was a lack of transparency in Mr. Benton's actions. The lack of transparency in and of itself is an indication of something, according to some.
21) Can we say that Rand won't have to defend him in some regard? Can we say that Rand won't have to cut ties in an embarrassing kerfuffle? No, it is likely that Rand would have to defend Mr. Benton, and would eventually have to part paths with him in an embarrassing way.
22) Benton's learning curve leeway is all used up and some supporters are having a hard time figuring out what, if anything, he has learned.
23) Under Mr. Benton, despite having raised more money than the campaigns of Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich, Ron Paul's campaign still couldn't win a single state's popular vote.
24) Many of Mr. Benton's decisions were and still are seen as having been made in order to help Mitt Romney win the nomination, a goal not shared by most of the supporters of Ron Paul in 2012.
25) His apparent political opportunism raises the concern that he would turn on a dime and change loyalties if it was politically expedient in the future.
26) According to angelatc, who was involved in the Ron Paul 2012 campaign and had personal experience with Mr. Benton, and also was in close contact with Tom Woods, a victim of Mr. Benton's wrath: Jesse Benton is a mealy mouthed little self important worm who hasn't actually won an election.
27) A good campaign manager stays out of the spotlight. Benton has not, so he fails in that regard. Furthermore, most of his spotlight is negative.
28) Jesse Benton had to resign from the Mitch McConnell 2014 campaign.
29) Based on the Sorensen issue alone, many RPF members think he should be kept far, far, away.
30) Allegations of shady dealings is a red flag because the competition will use every negative thing out there to try and smear Rand.
31) There are rumors of Mr. Benton having been seen wandering around the Washington D.C. area with a young female who is not his wife, possibly an intern.
32) The one RonPaulForums member on this thread who is an actual successful campaign manager, mosquitobites, gives a negative assessment of Jesse Benton as a campaign manager. According to mosquitobites: "Most of [Jesse Benton's] spotlight is negative." Mosquitobites believes he has "failed on that front." This unfavorable assessment from an experienced, successful campaign manager should carry a lot of weight.
33) People of known good character, people whom we trust, such as Tom Woods, have voiced serious concerns -- indeed, have issued a call of no confidence -- regarding the character of Jesse Benton.
That last one is why a certain user keeps trying to bring the conversation around to Tom Woods. If he could just discredit and smear Tom Woods, drag his name through the mud, then Mr. Woods' criticisms of Mr. Benton would have less weight and credibility. Unfortunately for this user, the character of Tom Woods is stellar, and his reputation gleams stainless.
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helmuth_hubener
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Perhaps next the thread will take a turn toward trying to find, dishonestly exaggerate, and repeatedly hammer over and over and over any flaws or mistakes that Mosquitobite may have made in the past (real or imaginary) in a similar attempt to decrease her credibility.
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cajuncocoa
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I have a question for Matt (should this be its own topic?)
You've described yourself as the "netroots coordinator". I don't know what that means, but since RPF is on the Internet, it sounds like it might have something to do with us (and maybe Facebook and stuff like that). RPF is mostly made up of grassroots supporters....at least, that's what I've always thought. With that in mind, here's the situation and my question:
It's fair to say that you're going to be involved on the inside of Rand's campaign. Probably along with Jesse Benton.
Let’s say the GOP establishment promised Rand’s campaign something that would be hard to refuse — it’s a plum deal that should secure the nomination for Rand. But, it would mean he would have to take a stand on something that would really piss off his Dad’s supporters…something that might make his endorsement of Romney look like child’s play. Hannity, Beck, and Limbaugh would be singing Rand’s praises to the rooftops, but any of Ron Paul supporters still in Rand’s camp would walk away in droves.
There are risks involved. Even though the GOP establishment has promised pie in the sky, we’re still about 13-14 months away from the first caucus/primaries. A lot can happen that could make that “secure nomination” they promised something a lot less secure.
If the decision were yours to make, and the establishment came to you, Matt Collins, with that deal…would you do it?
If we posed the same question to Jesse Benton, would he do it?
You've described yourself as the "netroots coordinator". I don't know what that means, but since RPF is on the Internet, it sounds like it might have something to do with us (and maybe Facebook and stuff like that). RPF is mostly made up of grassroots supporters....at least, that's what I've always thought. With that in mind, here's the situation and my question:
It's fair to say that you're going to be involved on the inside of Rand's campaign. Probably along with Jesse Benton.
Let’s say the GOP establishment promised Rand’s campaign something that would be hard to refuse — it’s a plum deal that should secure the nomination for Rand. But, it would mean he would have to take a stand on something that would really piss off his Dad’s supporters…something that might make his endorsement of Romney look like child’s play. Hannity, Beck, and Limbaugh would be singing Rand’s praises to the rooftops, but any of Ron Paul supporters still in Rand’s camp would walk away in droves.
There are risks involved. Even though the GOP establishment has promised pie in the sky, we’re still about 13-14 months away from the first caucus/primaries. A lot can happen that could make that “secure nomination” they promised something a lot less secure.
If the decision were yours to make, and the establishment came to you, Matt Collins, with that deal…would you do it?
If we posed the same question to Jesse Benton, would he do it?
Anti Federalist
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I think we both know the answer to that...
Matt Collins
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Oh they would trot out Tom's involvement with the League of the South back in the day.
Matt Collins
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Possible, but one never knows until it happens.
I don't (currently) speak for anyone other than myself, but it is very difficult if not impossible to answer hypotheticals like this. I will say that I am not as pragmatic as some might be, so I would be inclined not to compromise, but then again I am not a politician nor am I seeking office. Again, the devil is in the details.
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