Stop Calling Government Money Fake

I agree we should moderate the rhetoric. The circulating currency will always be worth more than what backs it. Even if you have gold backing, this fact will cause gold to be worth more than it would be for use in industry or as jewelry. This thing about it all being in your head is true of hard currency too, the main point is that hard currency can't be manipulated by the government for political reasons.

I think we should also point out that Paul wouldn't actually force a gold standard, he'd simply change the law to allow competing currencies. This could shake out in other ways besides gold backed money. Share money is an approach I like. The problem with gold is that in a rapidly growing economy it causes people to waste resources digging up more and more gold.
 
Mastiff said:
I think we should also point out that Paul wouldn't actually force a gold standard, he'd simply change the law to allow competing currencies. This could shake out in other ways besides gold backed money. Share money is an approach I like. The problem with gold is that in a rapidly growing economy it causes people to waste resources digging up more and more gold.
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Following the Constitution wouldn't be forcing anything, considering that it MANDATES gold and silver as the only Constitutional form of currency that Congress can authorize.
 
mastiff, I agree. Thanks for the points. I was wondering, if the elites push the Amero, and the Liberty Dollar becomes Ron Paul's addition to the currency market, one could feasibly choose from 3 currencies. That would cause a huge economic boom, until one (most likely the fed notes) crashes. The holders of those notes would then cause the demand of the other notes to rise--causing an even further boom.
 
skinzterpswizfan said:
Why is does gold have value? Because people gave it value. Why does paper money have value? Because people gave it value.
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Not exactly. Gold has value for a number of reasons. One of those is that it's "relatively scarce" and/or difficult to remove from the ground. The perceived scarcity (real or imagined) is part of what makes it more desirable than, say, sand.

People have also been attracted to gold for millenia because it's...well, attractive. It's fairly malleable, hence easy to craft into jewelery and other accoutrements.

Gold also has a number of other physical properties that make it valuable in various scientific and manufacturing processes. It's ductile, reflective of visible and infrared light, conducts electricity better than almost any metal (silver is a notable exception), and is largely resistant to corrosion.

For these reasons -- and some that I likely overlooked -- gold has intrinsic value. Its intrinsic value is bolstered by its subjective value (aesthetics), and its rarity magnifies the total value.

Paper....not so much. If people begin to lose confidence in a fiat currency, and the supply of currency keeps increasing artificially via the Fed, the actual value of the currency will continue decrease when measured against things that don't tend to change much in value: a loaf of bread, a gallon of milk, etc.
 
skinzterpswizfan said:
Why is does gold have value? Because people gave it value. Why does paper money have value? Because people gave it value.
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gold and silver can be molded into implements of use... that is why they had original value. easy to mold metal.
You statement is an obvious... but i say to you trade me all your precious metals for all the paper I own. Its nice printer paper, unused. You can make lots of money with the paper.
 
margomaps said:
Not exactly. Gold has value for a number of reasons. One of those is that it's "relatively scarce" and/or difficult to remove from the ground. The perceived scarcity (real or imagined) is part of what makes it more desirable than, say, sand.

People have also been attracted to gold for millenia because it's...well, attractive. It's fairly malleable, hence easy to craft into jewelery and other accoutrements.

Gold also has a number of other physical properties that make it valuable in various scientific and manufacturing processes. It's ductile, reflective of visible and infrared light, conducts electricity better than almost any metal (silver is a notable exception), and is largely resistant to corrosion.

For these reasons -- and some that I likely overlooked -- gold has intrinsic value. Its intrinsic value is bolstered by its subjective value (aesthetics), and its rarity magnifies the total value.

Paper....not so much. If people begin to lose confidence in a fiat currency, and the supply of currency keeps increasing artificially via the Fed, the actual value of the currency will continue decrease when measured against things that don't tend to change much in value: a loaf of bread, a gallon of milk, etc.
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No arguments from me. Just playing devil's advocate.

For the record I'd much prefer gold in my hand's than paper money.
 
It's not fake, it's as real to the degree that you can convince somebody else it's real. It's only when other people stop believing hard enough that your left holding a bunch of worthless pieces of paper.
 
It's fake to me, and by your definition...if i see it as fake. then its fake to me. Don't give me your funny money.

So, why suppose that you have the right to tell someone what they can call government money. If its fake to my eyes, it is only honesty to call it fake. To say otherwise would be lying and compromising my self to appease your idea of a perfect world where you govern everyone's actions to your liking.
 
Facebook money, money backed by shares of facebook!!! let's make the Us economy, facebook

lol, sorry, just thinking about the purchase of 5% by microsoft and what facebook essentially is worth now.
 
Federal Reserve money is NOT government money. "Government" money is made by the U.S. treasury, under the control of Congress.
 
While the US Dollar isn't fake... the US Dollar is no longer backed by anything of tangible value... meaning, if everyone looses confidence in the US Dollar, the currency could move into a virtual free-fall as it is no longer anchored by anything of tangible value.

Prior to approx. 1970, the Dollar was actually backed by a guaranteed amount of physical Silver & Gold... so, no matter what happened, the Dollar was always has a correpsonding convertible value to Gold or Silver.

history.gif
 
I think "loses" may very well be the most misspelled word on the Internet.
 
ron_paul_silver_dollars said:
While the US Dollar isn't fake... the US Dollar is no longer backed by anything of tangible value... meaning, if everyone looses confidence in the US Dollar, the currency could move into a virtual free-fall as it is no longer anchored by anything of tangible value.

Prior to approx. 1970, the Dollar was actually backed by a guaranteed amount of physical Silver & Gold... so, no matter what happened, the Dollar was always has a correpsonding convertible value to Gold or Silver.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think if we had gold backed currency and people lost faith in it and went to an alternate currency, the gold backing would be minimal protection because the dollar would revert to the corresponding value of gold for commercial use (industry/jewelry). The owner of the currency would still lose big time because the premium on the value due to it dominance as circulating currency would be lost.
 
Mastiff said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think if we had gold backed currency and people lost faith in it and went to an alternate currency, the gold backing would be minimal protection because the dollar would revert to the corresponding value of gold for commercial use (industry/jewelry). The owner of the currency would still lose big time because the premium on the value due to it dominance as circulating currency would be lost.
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that assumes there is a premium, gold could simply be circulated at intrinsic value.
 
torchbearer said:
that assumes there is a premium, gold could simply be circulated at intrinsic value.
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There will always be a premium. A hunk of gold that can be jewelry or a circuit board or a medium of exchange is worth more than gold that can only be jewelry or a circuit board. I don't think there's any disagreement that using gold as currency will cause more resources to be spent mining gold. If you believe that, then the premium follows (actually the premium is the reason).
 
AlexMerced said:
Facebook money, money backed by shares of facebook!!! let's make the Us economy, facebook

lol, sorry, just thinking about the purchase of 5% by microsoft and what facebook essentially is worth now.
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Well you could exchange your FRNs (I call them ferns) with Lindens on Second Life.
 
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