SPOILERS -- The Force Awakens Discussion -- SPOILERS

[fisharmor]

Even without the light saber effect, this IMO one of the best sword fights in a film.

I'd put it under Princess Bride (because nothing even comes close to that) and above other classics like Crouching Tiger.

The pacing of this fight is so different from Force Awakens.

If anything the Rob Roy fight has an Episode 4 Vader/ Kenobi vibe to it: someone isn't coming out of it alive.

 

[VIDEODROME]

Ok, just saw it. I really did like the movie but it is deja-vu all over again for sure. It's like the writers wanted to have a "history repeats itself" theme or maybe they were just too lazy to think up something new. It was good, just not great but really, who would expect the 7th in a series to invoke the feelings of the first experience??

I wonder if the title The Force Awakens just implies that the Force is emerging as a bigger influence. Or The Force including Luke is the convenient Deus ex machina. Luke was seemingly absent, but we don't know how powerful he is now or why he is on this particular planet. Maybe Luke was nudging "Force Sensitives" in a certain direction.

After all, why did R2-D2 wake up suddenly at the appropriate moment? Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[fisharmor]

It was good, just not great but really, who would expect the 7th in a series to invoke the feelings of the first experience??

I came out of Guardians of the Galaxy feeling like I was a kid and I just saw Star Wars. It's possible to make films like that. You just have to... I dunno... try.

 

[devil21]

Didn't see it. A lot of fans of the original Star Wars have said it's the same story repackaged with more effects and definitely more political undertones. No thanks.

 

[VIDEODROME]

Didn't see it. A lot of fans of the original Star Wars have said it's the same story repackaged with more effects and definitely more political undertones. No thanks.

I didn't think it was that political, unless you count Finn which I think was a positive actually.

 

[specsaregood]

Didn't see it. A lot of fans of the original Star Wars have said it's the same story repackaged with more effects and definitely more political undertones. No thanks.

Some people get off on trying to find things to be upset about. It was a darn good movie if you aren't one of those people.

 

[specsaregood]

Yes, I understand that, but my point still stands. Had Anakin not betrayed Mace, Mace would have killed Palpatine. So, that situation isn't really analogous to this one.

See, I don't agree with that. you have no idea what would have happened if Anakin had not chosen the dark side. I have no doubt that palpatine had a backup plan that would have saved him. Sith lords don't expose themselves without a solid backup plan.

 

[VIDEODROME]

See, I don't agree with that. you have no idea what would have happened if Anakin had not chosen the dark side. I have no doubt that palpatine had a backup plan that would have saved him. Sith lords don't expose themselves without a solid backup plan.

 

[devil21]

Some people get off on trying to find things to be upset about. It was a darn good movie if you aren't one of those people.

Glad you enjoyed it. Not many films get a positive response anymore. Feature film is a dying industry.

 

[misterx]

I didn't think it was that political, unless you count Finn which I think was a positive actually.

Why is that a positive? If he was chosen because he was the best for the role, then it should be neither a positive or a negative. If he was chosen because of his race, that's a giant FU to all other races, and a huge negative.

 

[misterx]

Some people get off on trying to find things to be upset about. It was a darn good movie if you aren't one of those people.

Not true at all. I tried so hard to like this film. It's just felt like such a copy and paste mess, it was hard not to be let down. If it wasn't Star Wars, this movie would've been universally panned.

People are starting to come back down to reality on this film. Rotten tomatoes audience score is down to 91% now from 97 I think. I remember when Revenge of the Sith came out it was rated up there with the original trilogy. It took years for that score to come down to reality.

Just some food for thought here; there were a bunch of 5 star reviews for TFA before the movie was even screened. Generally people are like sheep. If you tell them something is good they think it's good. Throw up some fake audience reviews, pay some reviewers to say your movie is the best ever, and then you have a public that will overwhelmingly think your movie is great.

 

[Cabal]

I came out of Guardians of the Galaxy feeling like I was a kid and I just saw Star Wars. It's possible to make films like that. You just have to... I dunno... try.

I found GotG to be incredibly overrated, personally. I still don't understand much of the praise for that film.

 

[VIDEODROME]

Why is that a positive? If he was chosen because he was the best for the role, then it should be neither a positive or a negative. If he was chosen because of his race, that's a giant FU to all other races, and a huge negative.

Uhh.... aside from race, I just liked that his character turned away from being a Stormtrooper goon and had the courage to try and escape.

 

[VIDEODROME]

I found GotG to be incredibly overrated, personally. I still don't understand much of the praise for that film.

I might be guilty of giving it a little more praise than it deserves because I was excited to see a Space Adventure movie that was not another Star Trek or Star Wars.

 

[VIDEODROME]

Honestly, though when they finally found Luke, who just wanted him to pull that hood back and be revealed as Cock-Knocker? Then go unleash epic ball busting on the First Order.

 

[fisharmor]

I found GotG to be incredibly overrated, personally. I still don't understand much of the praise for that film.

It was a Marvel property that some people knew about prior to the announcement that it was getting made. And we all went "They're going to make a Guardians of the Galaxy movie? Seriously? Well, lots of careers are going to end."
It was a corny 1970s idea that got resurrected seemingly to hitch on to the Marvel gravy train and for no other reason. So I went into it expecting a mind dump.

What I got out of it was something Star Wars got away from. There was a lot of storytelling in that movie that didn't rely on bludgeoning it into your head. Case in point: Nebula gets clocked with a missile. Then she's shown getting up all broken, and her joints put themselves back together and make mechanical noises in the process. Three seconds of film told about ten minutes of story there, and most of the story was told to yourself by your mind.

It didn't do this the entire time but like I said, expectations were in the toilet with that film.

Star Wars has a different problem. It's called The Empire Strikes Back. The series has one favored son, a decathelete chess master neurosurgeon philanthropist that all the rest of the kids are always going to get compared to. And also one older son that's only a golden gloves boxer lawyer. So when dad started pumping out trailer trash in 1983 of course everyone was going to make comparisons.

The series had nowhere to go but up. And given that Lucas had almost nothing to do with the favored son, and E7 was going to have absolutely nothing to do with Lucas, it was all sounding good. They didn't even have to try to bring it back up to the level of watchable. So the fact that I'm only hearing that it was a vast improvement tells me a lot.

Cabal, would you say E7 was better than GotG?

 

[Crashland]

I've never been a Star Wars fan, went to this movie hoping there might be something in there that would appeal to me. Didn't find anything. Went through the movie not really caring too much about what happens to the main characters, except perhaps for Kylo Ren. Never really felt like they established believable motivations behind what Finn was doing at any particular point. And the overall plot seemed pretty cookie-cutter for sci-fi. I guess I'll have to wait some more to see if Star Wars can do anything for me.

 

[Rad]

I think the pacing was better than the prequels. It wasn't all done on blue screen like George Lucas's atrocities were (which was a lot of the problem with those movies in my opinion). I missed Lucas's explanations of what was going on. I disliked how it was a remake/reboot of A New Hope. I was hoping for more originality than a Star Trek/Jurassic Park reboot. I enjoyed the characters. It felt like Star Wars. I wish there was more explanation of what is going on but at the same time the mystery keeps me hooked. They are really going to have to hit the next one out of the ball park. There are all these hints that Rey is Luke's daughter. Why else would Luke's lightsaber respond so strongly to her? Also if Rey could whoop Ren then what stopped Luke? Ren is hilarious. He comes off as mentally ill and immature rather than imposing. Anakin turned bad because he sought to save his wife. He committed mass murder out of fear and revenge (revenge for his mother's death). It looks like Ren is doing it because he idolizes Darth Vader. What could be his reasons? Anakin had a noble reason to be seduced by the dark side.

George Lucas came up with a serious story even if it was a kids movie. It was a shame he was lazy and surrounded by yes men and a blue screen for his prequels. His two trilogies were about fall and redemption and how a Republic becomes an Empire (the people give it away). He wrote the prequels before 9/11 and they basically explained what was happening under the George W. Bush administration. I hope that Disney does it better. There is a very serious political analysis going on in these movies. They better not run from it.

In a 2005 interview, Lucas said that Star Wars “was really about the Vietnam War, and that was the period where Nixon was trying to run for a [second] term, which got me to thinking historically about how do democracies get turned into dictatorships? Because the democracies aren’t overthrown; they’re given away.”

https://futureofstarwars.wordpress....-the-vietnam-war-or-how-not-to-offend-anyone/

 

[wizardwatson]

OK, so a movie buff friend of mine gave me some possible insight into the story. I think it's a pretty good theory considering some of the foreshadowing and plot reveals so far.

Basically, he concurs that Rae is likely a Skywalker. He thinks she's Luke's daughter. He also speculates that perhaps Obi Wan may have had a daughter on Tatooine while watching out for Luke, and that Luke fathered a child with this person.

What's more he thinks Luke trained Rae, which would certainly help explain the mega-Force powers (even moreso than heredity) but I was like, "How? She clearly thought the Force was a myth along with Luke." Then he waved his hand in front of my face and was like "Jedi mind trick". Why didn't I think of that!

We're already told Luke trained others but went into hiding. We know she had some kind of vision/memory when encountering the light saber. We know she displayed wicked Force powers. That Luke wiped her memory and deserted her for her own safety is quite plausible.

Anyway, thought I'd share. I know a lot of people had problems with Rae having such power. Surely the writers are aware we'd notice. So there must be some explanation.

 

[specsaregood]

He also speculates that perhaps Obi Wan may have had a daughter on Tatooine while watching out for Luke, and that Luke fathered a child with this person.

Speaking of which, the book Kenobi http://www.amazon.com/Kenobi-Star-Wars-Jackson-Miller/dp/0345546830
Which is about ObiWans time/arrival on Tatooine immediately after Episode 3 is really freaking good. It might be my favorite of the star wars books, its like a jedi western.