Sikh man pulled off Greyhound bus and detained for 30hrs for being brown

[pcosmar]

Makes us weak and very vulnerable.

If we are fighting each other TPTB are safe.

 

[Ender]

If we are fighting each other TPTB are safe.

Exactly.

 

[LibertyEagle]

And how are you going to identify said Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17 and 40? Ask them?

"Are you a terrorist?"
"No."
"Excellent! Welcome to America!"

One thought might be for the State Department to stop importing people from countries who have espoused hatred for our own. Of course, that would require logic and common sense.

 

[pcosmar]

people from countries who have espoused hatred for our own.

Countries espouse nothing.

 

[Henry Rogue]

nm

 

[LibertyEagle]

Countries espouse nothing.

I was referring to their governments, but fair enough. Countries who contain people who have espoused hatred for our own.

 

[tod evans]

I was referring to their governments, but fair enough. Countries who contain people who have espoused hatred for our own.

Pick a race color or religion and I'll bet I can throw a rock and hit somebody in this country who has "espoused hatred" toward them...

And that's out here in bum-fuck..........

 

[pcosmar]

Of course, that would require logic and common sense.

try it.

Pakistan was/is an "ally". A nuclear power, and has been friendly with the US.

How exactly are Pakistani immigrants imported from a country that hates us..

oh,, and BTW

the whole effin' world hates the US because we are the preeminent a$$holes in the world.

and we earn that.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Pick a race color or religion and I'll bet I can throw a rock and hit somebody in this country who has "espoused hatred" toward them...

And that's out here in bum-$#@!..........

And they have that right if they are Americans. But, if foreigners do it, it's rather dumb as dirt to import them into the country, don't you think?

 

[LibertyEagle]

try it.

Pakistan was/is an "ally". A nuclear power, and has been friendly with the US.

How exactly are Pakistani immigrants imported from a country that hates us..

oh,, and BTW

the whole effin' world hates the US because we are the preeminent a$$holes in the world.

and we earn that.

May be. But, that doesn't change the fact that it's stupid as all hell to import people who hate our guts.

 

[pcosmar]

May be. But, that doesn't change the fact that it's stupid as all hell to import people who hate our guts.

Import..?

Most immigrants come on their own.. with some exceptions.
Operation Paperclip was one importation example. and I am sure both criminals and victims were imported behind Vietnam.

I look at track record.. I'll take the folks that get here on their own.

 

[tod evans]

And they have that right if they are Americans. But, if foreigners do it, it's rather dumb as dirt to import them into the country, don't you think?

I think it's dumb to import people period.

As far as I'm concerned any government agent complicit in people importation, and that includes facilitating importing people for businesses, should be subject to execution on the spot by any member of the public not affiliated with government.

This is another area government and her employees have overstepped their bounds.

 

[Mani]

Back to the Sikh man, he's from India, not a country that hates US. I've been to India a dozen times, and in general USA is considered a major ally. Most Indian loves American, and they all have some family in USA. Many go for summer vacation, work, or to visit family.



This story seems to me "Hey, that brown turban guy aint speaking english. If he aint speakin English, he must be speakin terrorist."



There was a time a story like this 99% of RPF's would be outraged that someone could be pulled off a bus, and detained and held for 30hours for not really doing anything. I'm not sure what happened to this forum.

 

[helmuth_hubener]

Mani, Wearing a Middle-Eastern costume and looking Middle-Eastern is, indeed, a pretty good heuristic identifying you as approximately 10,000 times more likely to be a terrorist than a person not fitting that description. To complain that it is not a perfect heuristic would be to be ignorant of the meaning and usefulness of the concept of a heuristic.

Speaking in a highly suspicious way with another Middle-Eastern man increases your heuristic match level as a likely terrorist by another 100 times or so.

So this man was, and this is again an approximation, one million times more likely to be a terrorist than the average level.

Now Mani, perhaps you do not think terrorism is any problem at all. I will go out on a limb and say that almost certainly you don't! Along with pcosmar, you think we should be worrying about bathtubs before terrorists. We should just forget about terrorism as wildly unlikely and just not a threat. OK! Fair enough! That's your point of view!

But, if we are going to try to combat terrorism, what happened on this bus is about as close to an effective method as we can get. These passengers successfully identified someone one million times above the average risk level and got the threat neutralized. They were not perfect. They couldn't tell a Muslim turban from a Sikh turban. No surprise: there is no difference! They're both turbans! But nothing is ever going to be perfect. There will always be false positives. A grassroots, passenger-driven approach like this is a million times better than a TSA-style approach where everyone is automatically assumed to be guilty and 100% of everyone is inconvenienced and it doesn't work at all. Your fellow American passengers may not be perfect, but perfect isn't an option. They made the right choice here. These passengers successfully identified someone one million times above the average risk level and got the threat neutralized. One million times higher-than-average risk is, to say the least, a reasonably high threshold for suspicion!

The only way to have "perfection," to avoid any false positives, is to not make any attempt to fight terrorism at all. I am sure that's your preferred approach (or lack of an approach), and I certainly understand and sympathize with it, but not many others share that view.

 

[Mani]

Mani, Wearing a Middle-Eastern costume and looking Middle-Eastern is, indeed, a pretty good heuristic identifying you as approximately 10,000 times more likely to be a terrorist than a person not fitting that description. To complain that it is not a perfect heuristic would be to be ignorant of the meaning and usefulness of the concept of a heuristic.

Speaking in a highly suspicious way with another Middle-Eastern man increases your heuristic match level as a likely terrorist by another 100 times or so.

So this man was, and this is again an approximation, one million times more likely to be a terrorist than the average level.

Now Mani, perhaps you do not think terrorism is any problem at all. I will go out on a limb and say that almost certainly you don't! Along with pcosmar, you think we should be worrying about bathtubs before terrorists. We should just forget about terrorism as wildly unlikely and just not a threat. OK! Fair enough! That's your point of view!

But, if we are going to try to combat terrorism, what happened on this bus is about as close to an effective method as we can get. These passengers successfully identified someone one million times above the average risk level and got the threat neutralized. They were not perfect. They couldn't tell a Muslim turban from a Sikh turban. No surprise: there is no difference! They're both turbans! But nothing is ever going to be perfect. There will always be false positives. A grassroots, passenger-driven approach like this is a million times better than a TSA-style approach where everyone is automatically assumed to be guilty and 100% of everyone is inconvenienced and it doesn't work at all. Your fellow American passengers may not be perfect, but perfect isn't an option. They made the right choice here. These passengers successfully identified someone one million times above the average risk level and got the threat neutralized. One million times higher-than-average risk is, to say the least, a reasonably high threshold for suspicion!

The only way to have "perfection," to avoid any false positives, is to not make any attempt to fight terrorism at all. I am sure that's your preferred approach (or lack of an approach), and I certainly understand and sympathize with it, but not many others share that view.

Indians are not middle eastern. How about people get a god damn education before calling every brown foreigner a likely terrorist.

Punjabi and Hindi NEITHER language sounds ANYTHING like Arabic.

If people want to fight terrorism how about they learn more about terrorists instead of accusing anyone that looks foreign.

I have a problem with people's ignorance. To claim people are fighting against terrorism is one thing, but to be fucking ignorant and attacking everyone that looks foreign because they are TOO lazy or too ignorant to know any better is another. And ANY REAL PERSON INTERESTED IN FIGHTING TERRORISM if they honestly did 5 minutes of research would rule out a Sikh almost immediately. But idiot populace who see something/say something will grab sikhs and beat the shit out of them coz.....fighting terrorism.

So I'm sorry but if you were HONESTLY concerned about terrorism and wanted to do something about it you would educate yourself and realize the idiocy of the people on that bus.

 

[Danke]

Indians are not middle eastern. How about people get a god damn education before calling every brown foreigner a likely terrorist.

Punjabi and Hindi NEITHER language sounds ANYTHING like Arabic.

If people want to fight terrorism how about they learn more about terrorists instead of accusing anyone that looks foreign.

I have a problem with people's ignorance. To claim people are fighting against terrorism is one thing, but to be fucking ignorant and attacking everyone that looks foreign because they are TOO lazy or too ignorant to know any better is another. And ANY REAL PERSON INTERESTED IN FIGHTING TERRORISM if they honestly did 5 minutes of research would rule out a Sikh almost immediately. But idiot populace who see something/say something will grab sikhs and beat the shit out of them coz.....fighting terrorism.

So I'm sorry but if you were HONESTLY concerned about terrorism and wanted to do something about it you would educate yourself and realize the idiocy of the people on that bus.

It is sorry that those passengers didn't know any better. But of course person travelling on a bus might just be ignorant. I think most shiks hate Muslims.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Import..?

Most immigrants come on their own.. with some exceptions.
Operation Paperclip was one importation example. and I am sure both criminals and victims were imported behind Vietnam.

It's what the State Department does.

I look at track record.. I'll take the folks that get here on their own.

Does this mean you are offering to put them up at your own property and sponsor them such that they do not suck a dime from the government teat. In addition to being held responsible for any damage they do to anyone else or their property? If the answer is no, you are not taking them; you are hoisting them on the rest of us.

 

[pcosmar]

you are hoisting them on the rest of us.

I'm doing neither.

I am living here,, for as long as I am.

I would suggest cutting off the free stuff.
Stop giving the government money. they will have none to give.


I could not get hired,, for years.
Not because of immigrants,, but because of Americans. Because of Authoritarians.

NO immigrant has ever "Beat" me out of a job. very few men could.
Those that can earn it.

 

[helmuth_hubener]

Punjabi and Hindi NEITHER language sounds ANYTHING like Arabic.

Oh, yeah, right:

https://translate.google.com/#pa/ar/Ghareeb waseela aasim haqiqat galat sahih Allah ghalib

So different! But I'm so sure you'd be able to differentiate them 100% of the time with your big brain, Mani.

Indians are not middle eastern. How about people get a $%&#% $!(*&^@ education... ignorance... ignorant... TOO lazy... too ignorant... idiot populace... educate yourself... realize the idiocy of the people on that bus.

You are very right, Mani, that Indians are not Middle Eastern. Gold star. They are South Asians. As are Pakistanis (the other suspicious character involved).

You insist we "idiots" are in dire need of a new education regimen. Very interesting proposal! Along with Social Studies, Math, and English we can add Racial Awareness class. We can plaster the Racial Awareness classroom walls with the different races and ethnicities, all meticulously categorized and organized. Posters with faces, pointing out distinguishing features. The children will drill with flash cards. After going through this regimen, the children will be able to tell from a distance a black African from an Australian Aboriginal. The children will be able to spot a Jewish nose from a mile away. And telling South Asians from Arabs? Ha, our kids will be able to tell you from a mere glance not only that a man is Indian but which of their five or six castes he is from! Won't that be great?

See, I was confused. I thought from your neg-rep comment to me you were against profiling and in favor or more color-blindness. Wow, how wrong I was! It is the opposite! You are on a crusade against the supposedly "excessive" colorblindness of Americans, or as you call it: ignorance. You want to stamp out color-blindness and increase racial awareness. You want all those benighted Texans to stop using their mental capacity for things like knowing how to weld and knowing how to keep an oil well going, and instead focus on truly important things like knowing the differences between a Pakistani and an Indian, an Arab and a Turk, a Jew and a Gentile. Yep, that's the way we ought to raise our kids!

Welcome to Manitopia.

Then after your re-education at last we "ignorant" bus riders would be able to tell that it was only one of the two suspicious people who we should really be suspicious of. Because of course Indians would never be terrorists and Sikhs would never be terrorists. If only you had informed them in time of the correct and proper stereotypes to hold to. I'm so glad you cleared up your actual point of view. You aren't against racism at all, you just want it to be more finely-tuned, accurate, comprehensive racism. Fantastic.

 

[helmuth_hubener]

I would suggest cutting off the free stuff.
Stop giving the government money.

Unfortunately, that was ruled unconstitutional over 20 years ago. So, not really an option.