Should Ron Paul stop speaking at Colleges for large crowds that aren't voting?

[FSP-Rebel]

Sounds to me, the YFP drive or organization was poorly planned from the get go of this election. What a wasted effort.

Ya, I remember getting these YAL reports the last few years regarding sending young students to formal campaign training and how successful they were. Seems like these YAL/YFP groups should've been getting their fellow students registered to vote in the aftermath of the training programs. Specifically, after Paul became a prez candidate this should've been priority numero uno. Eh, hindsight

 

[floridasun1983]

The rallies are not resulting in huge numbers of votes, that much is not debatable. Now some people here will tell you its just massive, coordinated fraud. Is it? Maybe, maybe not. The problem I have is that they can never cite any actual proof, just a bunch of massaged numbers and opinions do not make conclusive proof. Its also realllllly hard to coordinate something like that on a massive scale and have no smoking guns. I think the more likely explanation is that these events have sizeable contingents of people who cannot vote; either they're from out of state, not registered, not registered Republican (if a closed primary), whatever the case may be. So everybody sees 4,000 people and think its going to equal 4,000 votes, and when it doesn't, they cry foul.

I think more, smaller venues would pay higher dividends. Its certainly worked for Santorum.

 

[parocks]

Sounds to me, the YFP drive or organization was poorly planned from the get go of this election. What a wasted effort.

Nobody does any real GOTV. It's all persuasion.

F it.

Money. Walking around money. GOTV money. Street money.

Push it as far as it can go, while remaining legal. Or, if not legal, secret.

We need votes. Use the money to get the votes.

I'm not inventing the terms "street money" "walking around money" or "gotv money".

Democrats spend tens of thousands of dollars on this, per city, per election. They have the same problems we do. That is, their voters need incentives. Old Republicans don't need incentives. We DO.

 

[Peace&Freedom]

The problem I have is that they can never cite any actual proof, just a bunch of massaged numbers and opinions do not make conclusive proof. Its also realllllly hard to coordinate something like that on a massive scale and have no smoking guns. I think the more likely explanation is that these events have sizeable contingents of people who cannot vote; either they're from out of state, not registered, not registered Republican (if a closed primary), whatever the case may be. So everybody sees 4,000 people and think its going to equal 4,000 votes, and when it doesn't, they cry foul.

There are multiple threads here, including a 147 screen thread on RPF that cites the proof. Fraudsters always plot their best scheme from the getaway, or 'get out of jail card' on backwards. It's realllllly EASY to engineer vote rigging, if, as a Republican leader, you 1) demand silence from local leaders in releasing 'unofficial' caucus results, and 2) control the receipt of the vote totals from the precincts and counties prior to releasing the "official" count. The rigging is made simpler precisely because so much information is ordered to remain withheld or unofficial, thus there is limited contradictory "official" data that can be cited as a smoking gun. This dynamic covers most all of the instances of fraud that have occurred. That Paul himself is gently noting the fact that fraud has occurred should be sufficient indication as to how widespread it has been.

 

[seeker4sho]

http://www.dailypaul.com/219809/ron-paul-rally-vs-rick-santorum-rally-in-kansas

reading through the comments gives a feeling that people don't think there is fraud, the large crowds are actually people who don't vote.

The answer to the OP's question is Hell No! Why would he do that? The younger generation that Ron Paul is addressing on college campuses is the future of this country. Every generation since television came into being in the early 50s have been brainwashed and controlled by the main stream media. The younger generation has not been brainwashed because of the internet -- they can do their own research for the truth and do not have to depend on some sad faced newsman that has an agenda for the news.

 

[parocks]

I'm not sure what you are getting at?

He's saying, probably, that it's our fault, because WE don't do what we HAVE to do to get votes.

 

[sailingaway]

The rallies are not resulting in huge numbers of votes, that much is not debatable. Now some people here will tell you its just massive, coordinated fraud. Is it? Maybe, maybe not. The problem I have is that they can never cite any actual proof, just a bunch of massaged numbers and opinions do not make conclusive proof. Its also realllllly hard to coordinate something like that on a massive scale and have no smoking guns. I think the more likely explanation is that these events have sizeable contingents of people who cannot vote; either they're from out of state, not registered, not registered Republican (if a closed primary), whatever the case may be. So everybody sees 4,000 people and think its going to equal 4,000 votes, and when it doesn't, they cry foul.

I think more, smaller venues would pay higher dividends. Its certainly worked for Santorum.

NOTHING worked for Santorum except being the vessel for the part of the evangelical vote that wants laws against gay marraige. It was looking where to settle in Iowa and when that fake GOP only CNN poll came out implying a surge, those voters supporting Perry and Bachmann and (at the time ) Gingrich went to Santa. They then rolled to Gingrich when the tack changed and the deck heaved. Then back. It isn't Santa's campaigning, but the media/evangelical leadership pushing that vote.

 

[parocks]

Ya, I remember getting these YAL reports the last few years regarding sending young students to formal campaign training and how successful they were. Seems like these YAL/YFP groups should've been getting their fellow students registered to vote in the aftermath of the training programs. Specifically, after Paul became a prez candidate this should've been priority numero uno. Eh, hindsight

Yeah, you call it "hindsight". Or failure to listen to the people who were saying to do that.

We don't ENJOY these things. So we don't do them. We HAVE TO, but we don't. We ENJOY telling people about Ron Paul. And registering someone to vote isn't talking about Ron Paul. So, forget that.

We could go back over the forum, going back months and months, even now, and you'll see most of what we do is a pointless waste of time.

Ron Paul and the official campaign is what makes people LIKE Ron Paul. Hard work from numerous people, the grassroots, volunteers, etc, is what turns Ron Paul "supporters" into Ron Paul "voters". But we don't enjoy those things.

I'm shocked that there were 1600 YFP at U Kansas and 173 actual votes for Ron Paul in the whole county.

And then I hear what a great job UK YFP did to get everyone to the rally. So what. All you have to do is get people to vote.

Getting people to actually VOTE is what we should/ve done. GOTV.

 

[NoOneButPaul]

Yes he should.

I just saw he's going to Champaign at U of I here in Illinois. That's a huge mistake... I doubt he'll have a lot of solid support there as it's an incredibly liberal school...

He should have gone to a smaller college (you get more rural residents there, thus more conservative) or gone to Chicago where a large base of people like myself are waiting.

 

[parocks]

NOTHING worked for Santorum except being the vessel for the part of the evangelical vote that wants laws against gay marraige. It was looking where to settle in Iowa and when that fake GOP only CNN poll came out implying a surge, those voters supporting Perry and Bachmann and (at the time ) Gingrich went to Santa. They then rolled to Gingrich when the tack changed and the deck heaved. Then back. It isn't Santa's campaigning, but the media/evangelical leadership pushing that vote.

Yeah, pretty much. What the takeaway is there are a lot of Republicans who want laws against gay marriage. A LOT. The majority. And Santorums position here is the one that most Republicans like. And Santorum walks the walk on socon issues. Ron Paul walks the walk on limited constitutional government, Santorum walks the walk on socon issues. Tea Party didn't exist 5 years ago. But Socon did, as has been a large part of the Republican base for about 30 years now. And Santorum is getting socon votes.

 

[seawolf]

The rallies at college campus's are not the problem. The Campaign needs to stop sending Paul into a State in the last two or three days to Campaign expecting a strong finish and being disappointed time and time again.

Instead John Tate and Jesse Benton need to decide on one State having a primary/caucus in the next three weeks they think that they can win and keep Ron there day after day after day after day.

That is how Santorum became a top tier candidate with limited funds. They picked a State and stayed, think Iowa, Colorado, Minnesota etc.

What would picking one State in March to really fight for and Campaign hard in really hurt at this point anyway?

 

[parocks]

A few passionate but un-registered RP supporting college students could use the voter walk list to select weak voters (who only show up at POTUS elections, etc.), AND THEN GO DOOR TO DOOR and sincerely plead their case, pointing out there own inability to vote themselves because they became aware too late (issues, war deaths, MSM bias and lies, etc.) to save the country from this madness (determine voter's hot-button issue and offer RP solution to that ONE area. e.g., "saving Social Security while bringing our troops home to protect America" should work on some older voters).

Bring along several high resolution photos of crowds at recent, high attendance rallies. A slip of paper with a "Media lies about RP" themed URL might work on a younger voter. I like the irony of the MSM providing us positive RP promotion tools by using their own lies! I'm finding this is turning a lot of heads to give RP a look, "try listening to the only guy who's making any sense" and ignore the MSM propagandists.

A few thousand students all doing this WOULD have an impact on the primary/caucus results in that area because so few bother to vote in these kinds of early elections. Too much enthusiasm or drama could see nutty, but the offer to provide transportation on Election Day might line up another vote or two that would have otherwise been absent.

"Offer to provide transportation"

Do we do that? There should be an organized effort for that.

If people don't have their shit together to get themselves registered, they don't have their shit together to do anything else organized and worthwhile.

 

[parocks]

Yeah, and whose fault was that?

OURS

 

[parocks]

Hold big rallies to organize delegates.

Hold smaller rallies and smaller events at places where seniors hang out for votes. Some of the older people I talk to said that Ron always mention the youth and do college rallies and the older folks feel ignored by Ron.

In my opinion,if a strategy is not working... change it!

The college rallies waste resources apparently. The people who should be doing something to GOTV are instead hyping a rock concert (ok, a rally). If the rally can be shown to help turnout, great. But it doesn't appear to be happening.

 

[Peace&Freedom]

GOTV, done in any style, should be the priority only AFTER an early voting period effort (where possible) is focused on. Since we KNOW by now that getting youth to vote ON primary or caucus day is fruitless (they simply don't show up), the emphasis should be on getting them to vote early. Rallies during the EV period DO make sense in this regard, as it allows organized activists to get the information out to them about the process, or better, allows us to get the target supporters to go through most of the steps, or fill out the forms on the spot. The rallies that do not do this are the ones that are wasteful.

 

[dr.y.squirrel]

Maybe have someone at the rallies handing out voting registration information to everyone who enters. If the kids have the paperwork in their hands, then they may be more motivated to fill it out and end up voting.

 

[TL789]

Again, the GOTV is not the main problem. This has been said after every contest. Were just doing the same thing over again and hoping for a different result. Read my earlier post.

 

[angelatc]

I thing a big part of it is costs at this point. He is spending a lot less money. when he goes to a high school, it isn't to get the high school to vote, it is to get a cheap/free auditorium.

All he has to do is partner with a group like Americans For Prosperity. They rent the arena and sell tickets - he appears and speaks. We've sent the guy a lot more money than Santorum got. Oh wait - now's the time when we blame the media, right?

 

[Peace&Freedom]

Yeah, pretty much. What the takeaway is there are a lot of Republicans who want laws against gay marriage. A LOT. The majority. And Santorums position here is the one that most Republicans like. And Santorum walks the walk on socon issues. Ron Paul walks the walk on limited constitutional government, Santorum walks the walk on socon issues. Tea Party didn't exist 5 years ago. But Socon did, as has been a large part of the Republican base for about 30 years now. And Santorum is getting socon votes.

It's called a culture war, because two sides are fighting it. What most social conservatives, who are NOT authoritarians, actually want is relief from the social liberal authoritarians, who want government laws FOR gay marriage forced on everybody else. The socons don't want the social left to get away with codifying it into federal law like they codified legal abortion, then declare 'the debate's over' and anybody who objects to 'the settled law' is an absurd throwback, just like they did with abortion. Social conservatives are really fed up with the 30-year 'back of the bus' treatment they get for 'playing politics' on these issues by GOP leaders saying 'we have to focus on the economy,' while the social left clearly push the same issues as a priority without ever getting flack for 'playing politics' with them.

The routine of mainstream Republicans de-emphasizing socon concerns (other than providing lip service, or bringing them up as a wedge issue) has gotten long in the tooth. One conservative columnist has rightly said about this that, decade after decade, "economic and foreign policy conservatives get the policy, social conservatives get the rhetoric." This group was thus ripe for someone to tap into their outrage over getting the shaft each election cycle over their issues. Paul has had an excellent opportunity to reach out to get the non-authoritarians in this voting bloc, but never emphasized them, so they've gone somewhere else. In the early phase of his career, Paul did emphasize the pro-life cause, and if he had only reprised that, or engaged socons at the point of their frustration, he would have been much stronger this primary season.

 

[angelatc]

Maybe have someone at the rallies handing out voting registration information to everyone who enters. If the kids have the paperwork in their hands, then they may be more motivated to fill it out and end up voting.

It's never worked. Back when MTV was popular (they used to play music videos) the tried really, really hard to get the youth to vote. Didn't affect turn out one bit. Not everybody lives and breathes politics like we do, and not everybody makes it a priority to show up and vote. It really is that simple.