Ron Paul Recants The GOP, Just Says No To Keynesians

[jmdrake]

It's true that Ron Paul would never TELL people what to do, but he did ASK us to stay in the GOP during the rally. If you don't want to do that, fine, but don't twist what he said into supporting what you wish he would have said.

He said the same thing in 2008...and then endorsed a third party candidate for president. Read between the lines. It ain't either or. And quit being dishonest. I haven't twisted anything. I gave a word for word quote of what he actually said.

You act like it is some revelation that he doesn't support what the Republican Party is doing. Of course he doesn't. He's been saying that for years on end.

I haven't "acted" an any such way. And what the Republican Party is doing is irrelevant. The point that I'm making is that Ron isn't trying to cat herd the way some are attempting to do. He told people to take over the GOP in 2008. I was at the rally in Nashville where I first heard Rand lay out that strategy. And a few months later....Ron endorsed Chuck Baldwin. Taking over the GOP and working outside of the GOP are not mutually exclusive propositions.

That will however change as we, hell I'm not politically-correct, TAKE OVER more of the leadership positions and work to change hearts and minds in our communities. Political parties are just tools and I did not hear him say anything in that video that would lead me to believe he changed his strategy. Our numbers have increased quite a bit, but if we split up and go all over the place, it will badly hurt our forward progress.

What will "split us up" is if we keep insisting on what trying to tell other people what to do. And I'm calling out the "Everybody must vote for Gary Johnson" people as well. How about just realizing that in a group made up of strident individuals there will always be a diversity of actions and just make the best of it?

 

[Matt Collins]

He said the same thing in 2008...and then endorsed a third party candidate for president.

Working within the Party infrastructure and supporting non-party liberty candidates are not the same thing.

 

[jmdrake]

Perhaps I misunderstood you. If I did, I apologize. To me, your comment sounded like a continuation of what moostracks said. Which to me was basically saying, who cares about all the inroads you have made into the GOP leadership positions. Screw all the progress that so many have made. Just split up and flitter off in a million different directions.

I heard nothing in that video that led me to believe Dr. Paul changed his strategy.

Fair enough. Let me clarify my position. I did my best to help Matt win the Davidson County GOP chair, and argued on his behalf (in vain) to help him keep the vice chair and I would do it again. On the flip side, Mark Clayton won the Democratic senate primary here in Tennessee. He's a Ron Paul supporter as well and the dems are trying to kick him out of the party. I support him as well over RINO "bailout" Bob Corker. I think Clayton made more of an impact winning the Democratic primary than he would have running against Bob Corker in the primary. He even drew the ire of Rachel Madcow. So, to me, sometimes it makes sense for some people to work outside the GOP. I wouldn't agree with abandoning positions inside the GOP we've already won. In fact, I didn't get that from what moostracks was saying, but I'll let him speak for himself.

 

[jmdrake]

Working within the Party infrastructure and supporting non-party liberty candidates are not the same thing.

Wow. That straw man factory must be working overtime. Who said that working within the party infrastructure was the same thing as supporting non-party liberty candidates? In fact......what's you're point?

Edit: And what I think you wanted to say is what I said in post #21.

Taking over the GOP and working outside of the GOP are not mutually exclusive propositions.

Since they aren't mutually exclusive, those who can't stomach the GOP should concentrate their efforts on doing what the like to do (supporting non-party liberty candidates). The biggest problem this movement has is it's trying to get people to do things instead of finding out what things people like to do which might also help liberty and facilitating them doing that.

 

[moostraks]

Perhaps I misunderstood you. If I did, I apologize. To me, your comment sounded like a continuation of what moostracks said. Which to me was basically saying, who cares about all the inroads you have made into the GOP leadership positions. Screw all the progress that so many have made. Just split up and flitter off in a million different directions.

I heard nothing in that video that led me to believe Dr. Paul changed his strategy.

LE stop telling people what they are saying and trying listening to what is being said. I really get disgusted with you. You are attempting to continue to portray everyone in this vary narrow, petty view you have of the world because you have to have a black and white view to comprehend things yet the world is shades of grey. You choose to work within the GOP because you feel the calling but others never will be capable of joining a party that doesn't represent them. The speech by the doctor can be a very effective tool for liberating people into realizing what the two party system is. Working with Dems and indies does not always mean co-opting them into the republican party where many could not in their own conscience do. It ain't about politics and parties. Learn to listen and stop trying to portray me as something I am not btw. You might not like what I have to say but I will not tolerate you misrepresenting it.

 

[moostraks]

maybe I need to be clear here...some people have been making the issue that the GOP is actually some special term for Ron Paul's party rather than it was where he choose to affiliate. Some people here are making a demand of others who came to the liberty movement that they become the GOP or they are not valuable or wanted (or specifically counter productive to the liberty movement). His statements in this video imo liberates those who have a different calling in this life. It calls for a unity outside of political labels because the labels are not valid. Both major parties equal the same result. Work like hell within the GOP if that is what you feel the need to do but stop disrespecting people who cannot and will not be able to do so as it violates their conscience. Respect individual liberties while working together on the common goal of having individual liberties respected.

 

[Matt Collins]

Work like hell within the GOP if that is what you feel the need to do but stop disrespecting people who cannot and will not be able to do so as it violates their conscience. Respect individual liberties while working together on the common goal of having individual liberties respected.

It does no good if our people are diluted and unfocused. That's how THEY win! We must present a united front.

 

[tod evans]

That reporter is damn annoying.

Who would of thought.......Ron Paul not following script..

I thought she was rude too.

 

[jmdrake]

It does no good if our people are diluted and unfocused. That's how THEY win! We must present a united front.

Did you earn this merit badge as a Eagle Scout?

cat herding merit badge

Here's a suggestion Matt. I recently finished reading the 7 habits of highly effective people. I encourage you to do the same. Because trying to cajole others into what you want them to do is not the way to be effective.

 

[pcosmar]

cat herding merit badge

I herd cats often,, They go where they want,,
You have to make it worth it to them to follow you.. (cat food helps)

 

[Matt Collins]

Did you earn this merit badge as a Eagle Scout?

cat herding merit badge

LOLz that's awesome!

 

[moostraks]

It does no good if our people are diluted and unfocused. That's how THEY win! We must present a united front.

This is a re-post from a separate thread...same argument though:

Membership affiliation matters when you fund goals counter productive to your beliefs. Would you become a member of the Nazi party? What if we all agreed that we would join the Nazi party and change it to represent individual liberty? Would you further the Nazi party goals until your group was big enough to co-opt it and make it a force for good? Whether you like it or not that is what those of you who make it a conditional requirement to join the GOP or work to further the GOP are asking of some people. Walk a mile in another man's moccasins before casting judgement upon them.

 

[LibertyEagle]

LE stop telling people what they are saying and trying listening to what is being said. I really get disgusted with you. You are attempting to continue to portray everyone in this vary narrow, petty view you have of the world because you have to have a black and white view to comprehend things yet the world is shades of grey. You choose to work within the GOP because you feel the calling but others never will be capable of joining a party that doesn't represent them. The speech by the doctor can be a very effective tool for liberating people into realizing what the two party system is. Working with Dems and indies does not always mean co-opting them into the republican party where many could not in their own conscience do. It ain't about politics and parties. Learn to listen and stop trying to portray me as something I am not btw. You might not like what I have to say but I will not tolerate you misrepresenting it.

Right back atcha.

Do what you want to do. You don't need anyone's permission to do that. But, don't twist Dr. Paul's words into saying something that he did NOT say. Case in point:

Maybe just maybe this can help heal some wounds here among people who insist we focus mainly within the GOP apparatus as that was Dr.Paul's chosen party. If it isn't his party then maybe people can finally let go and realize it is they who have to decide for themselves if the GOP represents their political positions.

Nowhere did he say that.

 

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

GOP apologists are so damn annoying.

 

[Matt Collins]

GOP apologists are so damn annoying.

I don't think anyone around here is an apologist for the GOP.

 

[moostraks]

Right back atcha.

Do what you want to do. You don't need anyone's permission to do that. But, don't twist Dr. Paul's words into saying something that he did NOT say. Case in point:



Nowhere did he say that.

5:08 [The GOP] "it's not my party...I don't like politics at all...and I think both parties are keynesian economists...both parties support the positions I don't like..so the party in many ways is irrelevant" "pleased on what is working...our appeal is to independents and democrats""ideological revolution...bigger than a lot of people realize"

From this you get that we must work within the GOP?

 

[LibertyEagle]

5:08 [The GOP] "it's not my party...I don't like politics at all...and I think both parties are keynesian economists...both parties support the positions I don't like..so the party in many ways is irrelevant" "pleased on what is working...our appeal is to independents and democrats""ideological revolution...bigger than a lot of people realize"

From this you get that we must work within the GOP?

In my opinion, he was saying he didn't own the GOP. That it was not currently reflecting his ideals.

I never said people "must" do anything. What people choose to do is their own decision.

 

[jmdrake]

Right back atcha.

Do what you want to do. You don't need anyone's permission to do that. But, don't twist Dr. Paul's words into saying something that he did NOT say. Case in point:

Maybe just maybe this can help heal some wounds here among people who insist we focus mainly within the GOP apparatus as that was Dr.Paul's chosen party. If it isn't his party then maybe people can finally let go and realize it is they who have to decide for themselves if the GOP represents their political positions.

Nowhere did he say that.

Nobody said Ron Paul said what you're saying Ron Paul didn't say. There is a difference between what someone says and reasonable conclusions that can be drawn from what someone said.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Nobody said Ron Paul said what you're saying Ron Paul didn't say.

I don't agree.

There is a difference between what someone says and reasonable conclusions that can be drawn from what someone said.

Right, and you didn't draw them.

 

[Matt Collins]

Nobody said Ron Paul said what you're saying Ron Paul didn't say.

My head hurts after reading that