RON Paul 2016 vs. Romney (Wead)

[EBounding]

Post Paul: What now? (Doug Wead)

Wead presents some interesting options and scenarios:

If Romney wins, Senator Rand Paul’s trajectory would be on hold and in 2016, Ron Paul, the father, would be the best primary challenger to a Republican establishment president, owned by the FED and the few.

Who else would have the guts to do it? And the media, who under normal circumstance would pan him, might let him have more than 89 seconds, just to have some fun – and some ratings – in an otherwise boring re-nomination process. Another run would help educate even more and fatten the Liberty Movement for Senator Rand Paul and the future in 2020.

It's not a scenario I ever considered, but it would make sense. Ron's the only Republican that would dare challenge Romney in a primary and he's the only one with nothing to lose. I understand now why the RNC was pulling out all the stops.

Also, can writing someone in really invalidate your entire ballot?

 

[jmdrake]

 

[brandon]

His argument against voting for Obama...

The problem is that Obama’s reelection would likely bring the country to its knees as well. Even if a manipulated currency created a temporary bubble the long term damage could be catastrophic. America could go so deep into the sleep of socialism that it might never awaken. Voting for Obama to create an opening for a Liberty candidate in 2016 might make logical sense to some but it would take the courage of that Utah mountain climber who cut off his hand to get himself free. Some of us just don’t have the stomach to do it.

Well when you are like me and think that either a Romney win or an Obama win would have the same exact effect on the country, this point becomes moot. I'm still leaning towards voting for Obama.

 

[jmdrake]

His argument against voting for Obama...


Well when you are like me and think that either a Romney win or an Obama win would have the same exact effect on the country, this point becomes moot. I'm still leaning towards voting for Obama.

Do what you will. But my conscious wouldn't let me sleep at night if I voted for Romney or Obama.

 

[dbill27]

His argument against voting for Obama...


Well when you are like me and think that either a Romney win or an Obama win would have the same exact effect on the country, this point becomes moot. I'm still leaning towards voting for Obama.

If you're actually considering voting between romney or obama then that's your choice but if those are your 2 options then obama is an awful choice. Even if romney is the same it would be disgusting to validate the murder and crimes against the bill of rights that obama has committed. Plus, given the 2 choices i'd rather have the guy in office who has to worry about being re-elected. Obama will have nothing to lose, think ndaa was bad? Wait till he has nothing to worry about

 

[sailingaway]

I'm writing in Ron Paul. I think there have been a ton of threads on this topic already and people have pretty much gone through the options and benefits for them of their votes.

And if Ron runs in 2016 I will support him, but I would want some campaign changes.

 

[aclove]

If Obama wins but Republicans control Congress, you've got deadlock, and not much happens for 4 years. That in and of itself should be enough reason for someone not to vote for Romney so that Rand has an opening in 2016.

For God's sake, let Ron retire back to Texas to play with his grandchildren and spend time with his wife. Hasn't he earned that?

 

[69360]

I'm voting GJ.

Maybe Romney is slightly better than Obama on some issues, but I will not vote for either and don't think it makes a whole lot of difference who wins.

I'd be in for Ron primarying Romney 2016. I'm also in for Rand 2016.

 

[idiom]

There is very little rational to use to choose between voting Romney or Obama. If you don't vote nobody can tell the difference between you not voting and somebody who is very happy with the status quo not voting.

Vote for any random 3rd party. Vote GJ if you can, but voting for the communist party has the same effect. Get it counted.

Is a vote for the green party or a write-in more likely to be counted? Green Party, every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

If you want to vote dissent you have to vote and you have to vote in a dissent column. Neither Romney nor Obama are going to have wins or loses registered as dissent. Does anybody seriously think that a landslide Obama win will be credited to RP dissent?

 

[sailingaway]

There is very little rational to use to choose between voting Romney or Obama. If you don't vote nobody can tell the difference between you not voting and somebody who is very happy with the status quo not voting.

Vote for any random 3rd party. Vote GJ if you can, but voting for the communist party has the same effect. Get it counted.

Is a vote for the green party or a write-in more likely to be counted? Green Party, every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

If you want to vote dissent you have to vote and you have to vote in a dissent column. Neither Romney nor Obama are going to have wins or loses registered as dissent. Does anybody seriously think that a landslide Obama win will be credited to RP dissent?

Why isn't the reported number between the number voting and the number voting for President a 'count' every bit as accurate in depicting a Ron Paul vote as a vote for a candidate you don't want? It is more accurate in my case because if someone thinks I am voting because I like the third party candidates, that would also be inaccurate.

 

[supermario21]

Why isn't the reported number between the number voting and the number voting for President a 'count' every bit as accurate in depicting a Ron Paul vote as a vote for a candidate you don't want? It is more accurate in my case because if someone thinks I am voting because I like the third party candidates, that would also be inaccurate.

I would think such a count would be possible. I remember during the Ohio primary the local (Youngstown) media made a big deal about how Obama only received something like 60% of the vote when he was unopposed. Of course, I can't remember if there was an uncommitted option (was too busy voting RP in our primary) but all you would need to do is look at the total votes cast, something quite possible at the very least on state and local board of elections websites...How I feel about 2016? Ron will be enjoying retirement, maybe going around the country lecturing and preaching the movement without actively running in a race. I don't think he would sabatoge Rand's future by running an insurgent primary attack. However, if Romney frequently attacked and tried to ignore the liberty movement in the House and Senate, I wouldn't be surprised to see Rand himself launch an attack.

 

[wgadget]

Looks like Doug is leaning Gary Johnson for 2012.

 

[Bruehound]

Wead has great political intuition. I really do agree with his rationale for voting for GJ. It is to quantify our numbers in a visible way. I think Ron will be at an age that he would be dismissed plus a fourth run at it puts you at risk of making a caricature of yourself.

 

[sailingaway]

I think whatever number we pass around will be the most visible and we could as easily do that with the number who voted, but refused to vote for a named presidential candidate, as a no confidence vote, even where Ron isn't on the ballot. Voting for Gary says you like Gary, or that he is satisfactory if Ron isn't in the race, and that doesn't describe how I feel.

As to Doug Wead's intuition, he seemed really big on the mid campaign transition of focus away from Ron to me. I think he is a master of jumping ahead of a crowd and pretending to lead the parade -- but he doesn't always guess correctly where the crowd is going.

 

[TruckinMike]

...And if Ron runs in 2016 I will support him, but I would want some campaign changes.

SA: This rant is not directed at you, its simply a rant concerning the "Change" that you mentioned.

WARNING: what you are about to read is a re-hash of a sore subject, do not read if you can't stomach the truth or handle the pain.

MY RANT:

Those changes, IMO, should be to run a bottom up campaign instead of a Stalinesque top/down campaign...

***** I removed the guts of my comments for fear of alienation and possible retribution *****​

...I can't help myself, I'm still filled with a fierce vitriolic hate for the poor 'ol chap! LoL! Not to worry, its slowing waning. I'll be OK after I have another glass of milk.

TMike

 

[KingNothing]

So Ron told Mitt that if he wins and does not work to address the things that Ron cares deeply about, Ron will Primary him in 2016. In response to that threat, Mitt's team did everything they could to change the nomination and delegate rules to limit Ron's ability to challenge Mitt next cycle.

Sometimes politics is ridiculously interesting.


And, if this is the case, I'm tempted to say that Romney is better than Obama by a non-trivial amount. And that I would still NEVER -EVER- vote for Romney.

 

[KingNothing]

Voting for Gary says you like Gary, or that he is satisfactory if Ron isn't in the race, and that doesn't describe how I feel.

Boy, if the man who vetoed more pieces of legislation during his time in office than all other governors in America combined because those pieces of legislation contained things that "government should not do" is not good enough for us, no one but Paul will ever be good enough for us.

Gary isn't perfect, but if he were the Republican nominee for president, I would happily vote for him. I can't imagine that we'd ever do much better than #GoGaryJohnson. He's certainly "satisfactory" to me if Ron isn't in the race.

 

[July]

Looks like Doug is leaning Gary Johnson for 2012.

He makes a logical case for it.

I'm undecided, but considering GJ.

Also, consider what Rand has just said about the LP and CP: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...eeds-to-win-most-toss-up-states-to-beat-Obama

 

[affa]

There is very little rational to use to choose between voting Romney or Obama. If you don't vote nobody can tell the difference between you not voting and somebody who is very happy with the status quo not voting.

Vote for any random 3rd party. Vote GJ if you can, but voting for the communist party has the same effect. Get it counted.

Is a vote for the green party or a write-in more likely to be counted? Green Party, every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

If you want to vote dissent you have to vote and you have to vote in a dissent column. Neither Romney nor Obama are going to have wins or loses registered as dissent. Does anybody seriously think that a landslide Obama win will be credited to RP dissent?

TPTB barely care what the actual vote count is for the two main parties. Why do you think they care what the vote tally is for some lowly third party? The public doesn't even care, for the most part.

A vote within this corrupt two party system, even for a third party, is a vote for the system. It's a meme of the system that non-voters are apathetic, because it's meant to corral all of us into participating, which then validates the system.

Anyone with sense would already see the high ratio of non-voters is already a vote of 'no confidence' for our system.

 

[sailingaway]

Boy, if the man who vetoed more pieces of legislation during his time in office than all other governors in America combined because those pieces of legislation contained things that "government should not do" is not good enough for us, no one but Paul will ever be good enough for us.

Gary isn't perfect, but if he were the Republican nominee for president, I would happily vote for him. I can't imagine that we'd ever do much better than #GoGaryJohnson. He's certainly "satisfactory" to me if Ron isn't in the race.

Then you should vote for him. Fiscal conservatism isn't my only hot button and Gary's record is absent or wishy washy on what makes a candidate a 'liberty candidate' rather than just a fiscal conservative to me. Corporatism being part of that. Also, from your posts, I think you fall more into the 'pragmatic' camp than the 'idealistic' camp here, and I am more in the latter.

People who like Gary should vote for him. Saying people who don't like him should and it is somehow a count for Ron is what I find counterintuitive.

I do feel that in order to place a no confidence vote you do actually have to go to the polls and vote on something, so people don't spin it as contentment or laziness, though. But you could write in Ron Paul or even just leave that office blank, and it would be a vote of no confidence in the others.