Rand to introduce pro israel legislation

[ronaldo23]

Cuts aid to the new Palestinian unity Hamas-fatah government until they recognize Israels "right to exist" and does nothing to Israeli aid. Not a fan of any legislation that supports and perpetuates the illegal occupation of the West Bank but I understand rand must pander on this issue. Just hope he isn't trying to say the Palestinian side is to blame for the failure of the two state solution. Cutting aid ONLY to the Palestinians is really saying that the USA supports apartheid since it is USAs unilateral support for all Israeli actions that is the biggest obstacle to peace.

This is one conflict where America needs to end all aid to achieve peace, but I think to fan the flames by only cutting Palestinian aid is really sending a message that validates Israeli illegal actions

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...cdc664-ce83-11e3-a6b1-45c4dffb85a6_story.html

 

[Petar]

AIPEC is too strong.

It is not currently possible to challenge them and get anywhere...

 

[Carlybee]

AIPEC is too strong.

It is not currently possible to challenge them and get anywhere...

So they own every politician then?

 

[TaftFan]

This is smart, as with Cruz's bill, it could get passed into law.

 

[AuH20]

So they own every politician then?

But they can make life miserable for you considering their near limitless resources. I think only AARP may be the stronger lobby group in Washington.

 

[dillo]

another disheartening move by Rand on foreign policy, I guess thats politics though.

 

[TheGrinch]

Rand has acknowledged this before. He wants to tackle the low-hanging fruit (countries who hate us) before demanding Israel do the same, though he has said he ultimately wants this as well.

He realizes that you have to start somewhere to reverse things like this. Trying to do it all at once just means backlash and failure. You have to keep challenging it and take gains where you can.

 

[TaftFan]

AIPEC is too strong.

It is not currently possible to challenge them and get anywhere...

Rand is likely going around AIPAC with this bill, even if they support it they are probably not pleased they didn't write it.

 

[Anti Federalist]

another disheartening move by Rand on foreign policy, I guess thats politics though.

Yeah, it is, but hardly even worth commenting on.

It's clear he's serious about running for president, and in today's AmeriKa, you are not allowed to be president unless you kiss Israel's ass first.

 

[tsai3904]

another disheartening move by Rand on foreign policy, I guess thats politics though.

Isn't ending foreign aid to any country for any reason a good thing? More likely than not, the Palestinian government won't meet those demands so their aid would be cut. Also, AIPAC opposed Rand's attempt to end aid to Egypt because it would destabilize the region. They might have the same opinion in this situation.

 

[Okaloosa]

Isn't ending foreign aid to any country for any reason a good thing? More likely than not, the Palestinian government won't meet those demands so their aid would be cut. Also, AIPAC opposed Rand's attempt to end aid to Egypt because it would destabilize the region. They might have the same opinion in this situation.

It is, but the unrealistic demands on Rand by dogmatic Libertarians and the hardcore right wing Republicans are absurd. Just because he is not supporting a bill to end aid to Israel in which he would be the only vote in the Senate doesn't mean he is doing something wrong. In this day in age you need to take what you can get.

 

[ronaldo23]

It is, but the unrealistic demands on Rand by dogmatic Libertarians and the hardcore right wing Republicans are absurd. Just because he is not supporting a bill to end aid to Israel in which he would be the only vote in the Senate doesn't mean he is doing something wrong. In this day in age you need to take what you can get.

In general I agree with this, but in this conflict it is a little more complicated. Ending aid for ONLY Palestine signals to israel that it should continue to violate international law and build settlements aggressively, while having full US support for these actions. It's advancing tyranny and further creating anti American sentiment all over the Middle East.

So it's not really about purists saying rand needs to end Israeli aid immediately, it's about saying that getting involved in a conflict like this and only coming down hard on Palestine is arguably making things worse off than before, and creating further blowback and resentment towards America in the Middle East.

 

[jtstellar]

conflation?

weird so you're injecting your own view on this and saying rand's proposal is somehow out of line? that's strange. if you say on principle all foreign aid should be cut i can agree on that ultimate goal, but if cutting palestinian aide first would 'send a wrong message', meaning the end is more important than the means to you ie. foreign aide cutting is not as important as the message it would send, then aren't you injecting your own dose of subjectivity here? if so why should i or anyone value your subjectivity over rand's? this is what i don't get about rand skeptics at times, it's not so much the ultimate goal on rand's part they disagree with so much as the 'gesture' by rand and the constant worry that it 'sends the wrong message'. i don't know what your subjectivity or anything has to do with principles. are you saying rand won't fulfill his promise after palestinian aide cut or what, that's an entirely different argument. to start with the palelstinian side is certainly easier politically at this point, after which it would be easier to do the same to the other side. are you saying stopping aide first to isreal before palestinian is sending the right message? or is that stopping aide to both would be more achievable? that would just reiterate the notion that he is somehow an isolationist, rather than stopping one first then the other, and people are just now beginning to warm up to rand.

what are you saying here, some people are so worried about the message it would send to the libertarian choir and missing the larger picture of people who aren't entirely on board with us, and get this, it's year 2014 and some people still don't believe rand is real, hence they constantly worry about 'gestures' and whether rand is kissing up to libertarians, give me a break guys. i don't even believe in this good cop bad cop thing anymore, some people are just retarded and need to be gone for good from this political movement. this is fucking another smart move, just do you guys have something against things that are smart?

 

[compromise]

Ending aid for ONLY Palestine signals to israel that it should continue to violate international law

I thought you guys didn't support "international law". Or maybe you only support it when it suits your agenda? You would be in uproar if the US was enforcing "international law" against an Islamic country with human rights violations.

It's becoming increasing clear that the people who are pissed off by this do not care for the cause of cutting foreign aid. They only care about the destruction of Israel.

 

[FriedChicken]

I can see how this move is open to interpretation. Maybe he is hoping everyone will interpret it in the most positive way for them individually?

Israel first crowd: This is great, its 'pro-Israel'!
Fiscal conservative crowd: This is great, it reduces spending!
Libertarianish crowd: This is a start, it reduces at least some foreign aid.

But each group could also find negative things to say about it.

It DOES, on the surface, look like Rand is getting in the middle of a foreign conflict which isn't going to gain applause from hardly anyone here. But this is Rand's signature foreign policy move ... he comes up with a bill that does a good thing (reducing foreign aid is a net positive, regardless of which nation) and packages it in a way that takes advantage of a current political mood.

When he was trying to end aid for 'Nations who shout "death to America" and burn our flag' he gained tons of support from all over the political spectrum meanwhile making all the pro-aid groups and lobbies look like fools.
Heck even Israel's prime minister, on Sean Hannity's radio show, said that he supports the US giving aid to all of their enemies. (you could tell Sean nearly fell out of his chair and couldn't make any sense of his position but he IMMEDIATELY changed the subject so he didn't say it again on the air and look more ridiculous).

I think many neocons will be in the same position again and be forced, by this bill, to defend foreign aid to Israel's enemies ... and they hate doing that, because they try to disguise everything they do as being pro-Israel. Exposing the lying hypocrites while defunding foreign aid? Priceless.

But there was a time when I would have seen this bill as a bad thing because it advocates ending aid for one country and not the other. Now I view the bill as a good thing because, at the end of the day, if it succeeds there will be less foreign aid than there was before.

The rhetoric used to push the bill is going to be hard for some people to listen to and I expect many will lose sight of what the bill actually accomplishes.

 

[Brett85]

Brilliant. Much better than the moves he's been making recently.

 

[Brett85]

Yeah, it is, but hardly even worth commenting on.

It's clear he's serious about running for president, and in today's AmeriKa, you are not allowed to be president unless you kiss Israel's ass first.

Yeah, and the great thing about it is that this bill will help Rand politically and will also further the cause of fiscal responsibility and non interventionism.

 

[Carlybee]

I thought you guys didn't support "international law". Or maybe you only support it when it suits your agenda? You would be in uproar if the US was enforcing "international law" against an Islamic country with human rights violations.

It's becoming increasing clear that the people who are pissed off by this do not care for the cause of cutting foreign aid. They only care about the destruction of Israel.

I don't want the destruction of Israel but I am against the continued destruction of the U.S.

 

[Brett85]

I don't want the destruction of Israel but I am against the continued destruction of the U.S.

Then doesn't cutting foreign aid make it less likely that the United States will be "destroyed?"

 

[KingNothing]

Yeah, and the great thing about it is that this bill will help Rand politically and will also further the cause of fiscal responsibility and non interventionism.

Exactly.

There is absolutely no way to oppose this bill and not look foolish. Rand figured out an easy way to save us some money. Good for him. A few dozen more bills like this, and we are getting somewhere --- and if Rand has shown us anything, it's that he's definitely willing to do the work to pick off this low-hanging fruit.