Rand Paul just got hammered on Glenn Beck (12/16/14)

specsaregood said:
I think Randal's red dot says it all about where he stands:
silver-datalab-jeb-1.png
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Based on what are Rand Paul's public issue statements less conservative than the average congressional Republican's?
 
jllundqu said:
They stated Rand takes a stand on easy issues to oppose like Drones, but won't take a stand on others issues because it's too politically fraught with danger. They all concluded that they would vote for Rand over hillary, but reluctantly. They said they wanted Rand to be bolder and more principled, like his father....

...Rand has in image problem that needs to be addressed.
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Rand has no image problem. Right wing pundits like Beck are worried that Rand Paul is a serious candidate and smart politically, and not a neocon. Because he's not black and white and pure libertarian like Ron Paul, they want to try to say he is unprincipled, even though he's more principled than any of the other candidates. If Rand Paul took a consistent libertarian line on every issue like Ron Paul, they would say he is doctrinaire and unelectable. It's obvious gamesmanship, and we can all see through it.
 
MaxPower said:
Based on what are Rand Paul's public issue statements less conservative than the average congressional Republican's?
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I'll take a wild guess ...


  • criminal justice
  • non-interventionism
  • privacy


You could have added immigration reform before charges of "amnesty" drove him off his own position. And speaking of being driven off his own position, what's the over/under on how long before he goes hardline on Cuba?
 
specsaregood said:
I think Randal's red dot says it all about where he stands:
silver-datalab-jeb-1.png
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Although I think even this is a little misleading, what is a "conservative statement?" Depending on how the chartmaker defined "conservative" that blue dot could be a lot further to the right.
 
Ron's dots would be exactly on top of each other, Rand's have the most spread in the game. That chart is beautiful. It highlights the issue the tactics are causing perfectly.

I especially love Santorum's inverted dots. What a scumbag.
 
Santorum's public statements actually line up with those of a madman, but I guess that's "modern" conservative policy.
 
MaxPower said:
Based on what are Rand Paul's public issue statements less conservative than the average congressional Republican's?
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See http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/marco-rubio-the-electable-conservative/

There are several statistical methods that seek to rate candidates’ ideology on a left-right scale. FiveThirtyEight uses three of these methods in evaluating the ideology of Senate candidates as part of our technique for forecasting those races. The same methods can be applied to presidential candidates.

The first of these systems, DW-Nominate, is based upon a candidate’s voting record in the Congress. The second method, developed by Adam Bonica, a Stanford University political scientist, makes inferences about a candidate’s ideology based on the groups and individuals who have contributed to his campaign. The third method, from the Web site OnTheIssues.org, works by indexing public statements made by the candidate on a variety of major policy issues.

... the methods sometimes disagree. The libertarian-leaning Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky is rated as being extremely conservative by DW-Nominate and by Mr. Bonica’s method, which tend to give more emphasis to a candidate’s record on economic issues. But he is rated as fairly moderate by OnTheIssues.org, which also evaluates his stances on social policy.
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And then, of course, there is the whole matter of the question of "What constitutes a conservative / liberal position on any given issue?" and the fact that a one axis scale is inevitably going to be simplistic.
 
Brian4Liberty said:
Thanks! It always good to actually hear it.

As I suspected, it's Beck's neoconservative plant (Pat?) who spews most of the negative stuff about Rand. Beck lets Pat do the dirty work, and Pat has probably always been the initiator and source of the anti-Paul bias. Beck does join in the negativity, but it's not like the hatred from Pat. Beck is more of the "Rand's playing the game and I don't like that" type.

And what was left out in the OP was that they came right out and said that Rubio is their favorite. The biggest and most open neoconservative in the race (potentially) is who they support.
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Let me emphasize:

Rubio is the Beck team's favorite candidate.

So, their favorite potential candidate is the guy who ran as "Tea Party" with Tea Party support, and then immediately after election said screw the Tea Party, I'm a moderate and a neoconservative, and I'm jumping into bed with Lindsey Graham to push amnesty. Obviously, the Beck Team's concern about candidates being open, transparent and "standing on principle" is disingenuous bullshit.

Rubio is one of the most neoconservative (neo-Trot moderate) members of Congress next to Graham and McCain. That's who Beck's sidekicks support.
 
MaxPower said:
Based on what are Rand Paul's public issue statements less conservative than the average congressional Republican's?
Click to expand...

YesI'mALiberal said:
I'll take a wild guess ...


  • criminal justice
  • non-interventionism
  • privacy


You could have added immigration reform before charges of "amnesty" drove him off his own position. And speaking of being driven off his own position, what's the over/under on how long before he goes hardline on Cuba?
Click to expand...

If that's the criteria than Ron has the same chart. The truth is that considering how screwed up both parties are on those issues, it's hard to even get a chance to vote correctly. When's the last time there was a vote on an AUMF let alone an actual formal declaration of war? That said, Rand wins high marks on his criminal justice proposal.

http://www.msnbc.com/melissa-harris...ollow-rand-paul-on-black-voters--312791619970
 
fisharmor said:
It seems like every post of yours I read has some sort of insult in it. So let me return the favor.

Congratulations on figuring out your opening chess move. Maybe some day you'll get to the point of thinking about your middle game.

I doubt you'll ever recognize that some of us have moved on to Go.
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Sadly, many probably think this is a reference to Monopoly ...
 
specsaregood said:
And some of us realize that neither chess nor go are good metaphors since they are games of perfect information while politics and life is not.
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Oh, yeah?

Well, some of us realize that one of the consequences of politics and life not being games of perfect information is the inevitable use of necessarily imperfect metaphors involving games of perfect information.

So there! :p
 
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