Problems With Deflation

Zippyjuan

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http://www.brookings.edu/research/opinions/2014/10/16-reasons-worry-about-deflation-wessel

Falling prices sounds nice. But deflation also means falling wages and higher unemployment.

1. Deflation is a generalized decline in prices and, sometimes, wages. Sure, if you’re lucky enough to get a raise, your paycheck goes further–but those whose wages decline or who are laid off or work fewer hours are not going to enjoy a falling price index.

2. It can be hard (though, as we’ve seen, not impossible) for employers to cut nominal wages when conditions warrant; it’s easier to give raises that are less than the inflation rate, which is what economists call a real wage cut. And if wages are, as economists say, marked by “downward nominal rigidity,” then employers will hire fewer people.

As Paul Krugman put it in 2010: “in a deflationary economy, wages as well as prices often have to fall–and it’s a fact of life that it’s very hard to cut nominal wages. … What this means is that in general economies don’t manage to have falling wages unless they also have mass unemployment, so that workers are desperate enough to accept those wage declines. See Estonia and Latvia, cases of.”

3. As economic textbooks teach, the prospect that things will cost less tomorrow than they do today encourages people to put off buying. If enough people do that, then businesses are less likely to hire and invest, and that makes everything worse.

4. Deflation is terrible for debtors. Prices and wages fall, but the value of your debt does not. So you’re forced to cut spending. This applies to consumers and to governments, and it is one of the biggest issues in Europe right now. As Yale University economist Irving Fisher wrote decades ago, debtors are likely to cut spending more than creditors increase it, and this can turn into a really bad downward spiral. (The experience of Japan, though, proves that an economy can have a prolonged period of moderate deflation without falling into that downward spiral.)
 
Last week's financial misinformation by CNBC pump monkey Steve Lies-man, BOSTON FED president Eric Rosenberg stated,
"We're in a very different inflation erxperience, we're in a situation, where LOW INFLATION CONTINUES TO BE ACTUALLY A PROBLEM in a number of the major developed economies."

Afterwards CME Group TV regular, Jim The Commodities gabbier,
"When oil goes to say in the high 40s, THE PUPPETEERS that were kinda controlling this... maybe they're letting go of control, I might start to get a little worried."

Inflation is the con game to enrich those running the debt based FIAT system... deflation is more of a problem for manufacturing nations, like China, not the rigged central planning US Banksta's economic shell game.
 
*shrugs*

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Bubbles gotta pop.
 
If prices continue to fall, you aren't going to buy anything unless you need it. Why buy today if you can get it cheaper tomorrow? That means that companies have lower sales and need fewer people to produce fewer products. Higher unemployment.

For a company to be able to maintain lowering prices, they need to be able to keep lowering their costs. Labor is their basic cost. If their workers won't accept lower wages (and they don't), then they must reduce the number of workers they have. Higher unemployment. Only when they are hungry enough will they accept lower wages.

People losing jobs don't have money to spend on buying things- demand falls farther and companies need more cuts.
 
You are right. It is most optimal to have both closer to zero if you can.

So, the Federal Reserve has kept inflating our currency for many years and maybe now we reap the consequences. It's sad, but sometimes countries have to learn the hard way, I suppose. We can only rely on ourselves.
 
Zippyjuan said:
If prices continue to fall, you aren't going to buy anything unless you need it. Why buy today if you can get it cheaper tomorrow? That means that companies have lower sales and need fewer people to produce fewer products. Higher unemployment.
If prices continue to RISE, you aren't going to SELL anything unless you need THE MONETY. Why SELL today if you can get MORE MONEY tomorrow? That means that companies have lower sales and need fewer people to produce fewer products. Higher unemployment.
 
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I also reject the idea that falling prices necessitates a falling wage. If the price decline is due to an increase in the supply then the wage can remain the same and the cost per unit will still be less. If the price decline is caused by something other then an increase in supply then the consequence will depend on the cause.. I feel that economic analysis that calls price increases/decreases good/bad in and of them selves are worthless. Prices are signals. Dig deeper.
 
I also reject the idea that falling prices necessitates a falling wage. If the price decline is due to an increase in the supply then the wage can remain the same and the cost per unit will still be less. If the price decline is caused by something other then an increase in supply then the consequence will depend on the cause.. I feel that economic analysis that calls price increases/decreases good/bad in and of them selves are worthless. Prices are signals. Dig deeper.

It is terrible that workers would be able to share in the benefit of their increase in productivity.
 
Deflating the Deflation Myth

https://mises.org/library/deflating-deflation-myth


Deflation and Liberty

This monograph addresses a critically important issue: the prevailing view that deflation is a catastrophe that must be stopped.


https://fb.mises.org/library/deflation-and-liberty-2/0

From the first article:

... the only episode in which we find evidence of a link between deflation and depression is the Great Depression (1929-34). We find virtually no evidence of such a link in any other period. ... What is striking is that nearly 90% of the episodes with deflation did not have depression. In a broad historical context, beyond the Great Depression, the notion that deflation and depression are linked virtually disappears.3

Every deflation since 1913 is associated with a recession. And even if they did not fall enough to achieve deflation, all recessions also featured lower inflation rates (1974 being an exception- that was an inflationary recession).

Inflation_and_recession_small.jpg


http://inflationdata.com/inflation/Inflation_Articles/Inflation_and_Recession.asp

But that can be a symptom- not a cause. Prices falling because demand has fallen during the recession.
 
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the problem with deflation is that everything is cheaper and everybody cries poor.
 
Falling prices sounds nice. But deflation also means falling wages and higher unemployment.

Falling wages and unemployment are a concern? Really? Since when? Talk about a pathetic load of crap. People who pushed for increased immigration don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to wage deflation. Wage deflation has been the stated goal of the crony establishment for decades, and immigration was the way to achieve that. Alan Greenspan admitted as much long ago. It's the number one priority of the US Chamber of Crony Commerce and billionaires from Wall St. to Seattle.

They have no problem with falling wages for the mundanes. It's been going on for decades. They just don't want their pyramid scam to end. Redistribute that wealth, keep that Ponzi scheme going. It's for the children!
 
It is terrible that workers would be able to share in the benefit of their increase in productivity.

Your productivity belongs to the Plutocracy. Back to the coal mine, mundane! Your rulers need money for golf, cocaine and hookers!
 
Deflation is a catastrophe for anyone who is highly leveraged.

If we experience system-wide deflation, it will almost certainly be the result of design, particularly in the wake of all this "money" the Fed has loosed upon the world. If it happens, the vast and overwhelming majority of American will be utterly ruined, and I mean this very literally. A great plurality of Americans are leveraged to their eyeballs. A 25% reduction in income would put them under in just a few months.

Ask yourself this: how would the American landscape appear in the wake of such an event? Given the likely answer, why would the bankers allow such a thing to happen, much less induce it to occur?

My discomfort arises from the suspicion that if/when the nation undergoes a real, honest-to-God economic crash with, say, 50-65 millions of households going under, the occupants about to experience the joys of foreclosure, the "government" will step in... with money, of course, in exchange for something. Can anyone guess what it is they will ask in return for not losing your home?
 
Your productivity belongs to the Plutocracy. Back to the coal mine, mundane! Your rulers need money for golf, cocaine and hookers!

This exactly. The real economy is naturally deflating. When the money supply is fixed, in the long run, there is a natural decline in prices. This is caused by increase productivity and innovation. Even though this is happening CONSTANTLY, we get obfuscated by the fact that there is massive inflation in the supply in money/credit. The only reason are standard of living gets massive downward pressure is because the government and federal reserve is stealing our wealth via money printing and borrowing. In absence of these parasites, my guess is that an average joe with a high school education could achieve millionaire status within less than 15 years of hard work and saving. This could be the norm, but no the bankers and the government need to steal our wealth.
 
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