Please rank the top 10 states in which to live.

[daviddee]

...

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

Tax Foundation's listing on all sorts of costs... per State, Counties, Cities...

http://taxfoundation.org/tax-topics/state-tax-and-spending-policy

The Tax Foundation, a tax research group in Washington, DC, provides these numbers for the 20 Lowest State Property tax Rates on Owner-occupied Housing in the USA in 2008:

1. .14% Louisiana
2. .32% Alabama
3. .43% Delaware
4. .43% Washington DC
5. .47% Mississpippi
6. .48% West Virgina
7. .49% South Carolina
8. .51% Arkansas
9. .51% New Mexico
10. .54% Wyoming
11. .56% Utah
12. .57% Arizona
13. .58% Colorado
14. .61% California
15. .63% Nevada
16. .66% Idaho
17. .67% Tennessee
18. .69% Virgina
19. .70% Kentucky
20. .72% Oklahoma

 

[daviddee]

...

 

[cjm]

In all those charts they show Michigan as one state,,which is misleading.

Detroit and Lansing (high population areas) skew the result(and screw the state). The UP is not the Lower Peninsula.

Yeah,mild is relative.Not as hot and humid as points south,not as gosh darn cold as States to the north,but still with four seasons which I would like,especially with all the hardwoods.No earthquakes or hurricanes,very few tornados and fewer blizzards.

It is hurricane season here in southeast Virginia and I sweat through every one.I have 2 acres of swampland that sits about 5 feet above mean low water and I can hit standing saltwater with a rock at low tide from my back porch.
Underhanded.

I agree with both posts. Locally, western Virginia has more in common with West Virginia and eastern Kentucky than it has with coastal Virginia. It's probably good to look at geographic regions in addition to political boundaries. The densely populated NoVA and tidewater regions skew the results for western Virginia as well.

 

[PierzStyx]

1. California (Pros - legal, available medicinal herb, great climate, variety of places and cultures to choose to live in, lots of coastline. Cons - expensive, high taxes, regulations, gun laws)

2. Oregon

3. Washington

4. Colorado

5. New Hampshire

6. Maine

7. Montana

8. Wyoming

8. Idaho

9. Utah

10. New Mexico

California is the worst state to live in. . It is the most anti-freedom state in the nation. You are more of a slave in CA than in anywhere else in the Union. Well it ties with New York

 

[PierzStyx]

This is easily do-able. I give you the Freedom in The 50 States project http://freedominthe50states.org/ which ranks all the states according to their personal and economic freedoms.

 

[eduardo89]

California is the worst state to live in. . It is the most anti-freedom state in the nation. You are more of a slave in CA than in anywhere else in the Union. Well it ties with New York

I'd say New York, New Jersey, California, and Cook County are the worst places you can live.

 

[invisible]

Ok, having lived in several states, I can't resist this one. I'll start with the bottom of the barrel: PA, MD, and IA. MD has vehicle inspections and lots of regulation at every level of government. Property taxes are somewhat low if you buy in a (previously, this has probably changed over the last 10 years with the housing bubble) undervalued neighborhood. PA is worse than MD, has even more regulation and property taxes are double. The hoops to jump through to register a car in PA are awful, and inspection requirements are even worse than MD. DE is similar, roughly about the same as MD, but with PA level property taxes to offset the lack of a sales tax. Utilities are astronomical. The cities are crawling with all sort of inspectors, out to write violations for anything possible to make up for their budget shortfalls. But at least in these states, cops in most areas have better things to do than to mess with average people. In IA, property taxes vary depending on location. No vehicle inspections here either, making it cheap to buy a car and get it on the road. However, IA is quite socially intolerant except for the more populated areas and college towns. The worst thing about IA is that they have probably more cops per capita than any other state. Tons and tons of bored cops everywhere, with very little real crime, and nothing to do but mess with people. I've been hassled more by cops in IA than anywhere else.

Now to the fun part. After wanting to get the hell out of MD and PA, I moved to NH and lived there for a while. I hate to say it, but I was unimpressed. Actually, to be honest, I thought it sucked. Yes, you absolutely DO have a small handful of freedoms there that you do not have anywhere else, but this is cancelled out by being an overall lousy place for the average person to live. Cost of living is extremely high, even higher than the mid-atlantic states have become. Move to NH, and just from what it costs for housing, your standard of living WILL be lowered unless you come from NYC, CA, or HI. So what if you don't pay sales or income tax? You end up paying MORE overall in what it costs to live there! The fact that apartments and rooms are rented by the WEEK to make the price seem lower is saying a lot, I've never seen that anywhere else except for the most low end of low end rentals. Unless you're all set to buy a house, even finding a place to live at any price is a huge hassle unless you know someone who is willing / able to give you an inside track. You call a number seen on a "for rent" sign or on craigslist, and it's virtually impossible to get a landlord to call you back. You have to practically beg someone to rent you even the most shoddy and overpriced room or apartment (I've never run into this problem anywhere else I've ever lived). As difficult as it already is, it becomes virtually impossible if you happen to have a dog. Sure, NH has "low unemployment". But good luck actually finding work that pays significantly more than the minimum wage, unless you're a software or aerospace engineer. For the average working-class person, the job market in NH sucks, and in this respect, you're better off in the mid-atlantic states that have the same or slightly lower cost of living. Self-employment was FAR more difficult (more like impossible) in NH than any other place I've ever lived. Like MD and PA, vehicle inspections make it very expensive to buy a car and get it on the road. Property taxes are absolutely awful. Best things about NH: Not having to wear a seatbelt (I absolutely HATE seatbelt laws), open carry is allowed everywhere as a matter of course, socially tolerant environment, and even though there is very little real crime, cops seem to hassle people less here than anywhere else I've ever been. After living in NH for over a year, having my standard of living reduced to rock bottom (try cramming the contents of a 2600 square foot house into the only single room you can afford and are able to rent), and being all but unable to make a living, it was past due to get the hell out of there. Sorry, but I don't call freedom not being able to actually keep any of the little money you're able to make, and having to pay it all out just to attempt to cram everything you own into the tiniest space that you had to beg someone to rent to you. That simply isn't worth not having to wear a seatbelt, being able to walk around on the street with a gun, and being able to say that you pay "low" taxes.

So, I decided to start over yet again in another state, but this time, I started from a different perspective. Through additional research, I discovered a "housing affordability index" map (unfortunately, I can't seem to find it again quickly to post here for reference). This nifty little map measured states by the hours needed to work at minimum wage, to be able to afford to rent an "average" (taken as a statewide average over what was advertised on craigslist for whatever period of time they measured) 2 bedroom apartment. Needless to say, NH scored very close to the bottom, and the mid-atlantic states weren't very far behind. However, the eye-popping revelation here was that there seemed to be a handful of states in the south that were virtually unaffected by the housing bubble, and that it appeared that there really were places still existing where one could start over in life (after having your friendly local government steal your paid-for house through eminent domain - yes, this actually happened to me, I literally lost the result of my entire life's work), and actually be able to retain a halfway decent standard of living. Next was the issue of where to find freedom in these places, and could it be done on a scale comparable to NH? After undertaking further research and comparing the laws in this handful of southern states, the answer was a resounding YES!

So, where did I end up? My vote for the top state: OKLAHOMA! By a WIDE margin! Cost of living is FAR lower than MT, ID, and WY, going by advertised rents and home prices on craigslist and the MLS. NO vehicle inspections, meaning that you can buy and car and get it on the road for dirt cheap. For LESS than what I paid for a ROOM in NH, I now have a 2 bedroom HOUSE with a garage and a large yard. Utilities here are dirt cheap, a fraction of what they cost in the northeast. My landlord actually went out of my way to get my business and retain it, he actually asked me to rent his place instead of the other way around. Finding work here is easy, plenty of it to go around, and "help wanted" signs everywhere for all sorts of positions. Two months after I moved here, work started coming to me, and I now have more work than I can keep up with. Plenty of vacant houses here available for cheap, so I hope to get back into real estate soon and buy another house for cash or on contract (I don't do business with banks). Plenty of property available cheaply (almost a tenth of the cost of the cheapest land available anywhere in NH), and if you buy outside of town limits, there are NO zoning laws, building inspections, or permits needed (this situation only exists in very few places in NH, very rural and out of the way places). I'll eventually build my own off-grid house, and if anyone else wants one, I'll be glad to build them one and will eventually post on this in the marketplace part of the forums, now that I've spilled the beans here. OK has about the most lax homeschooling laws in the country, and is strong on guns rights. No helmet laws, and fireworks are legal, just as in NH. Property taxes are dirt cheap, and more than offset having a sales and income tax (those taxes are largely avoidable anyways, whereas a property tax is impossible to avoid!) for an average person's income level. Just as in NH, both obombacare and real id are nullified. Unlike NH, a music and art scene actually exists without having to drive to another state (it helps that a bar can just be a bar without having to derive at least 50% of their income from restaurant sales, as in NH). The only hassle cops seem to give anyone is speeding tickets on the highways. There is a vibrant and active group of dedicated activists here that are quite welcoming to newcomers. Remember the parking lot rump convention? Overall, OK is everything that I had hoped NH would be, and then some! Anyone care to join me? I'd be glad to help anyone else who would like to move to a place that is at least the equal of NH as far as freedom goes, if not better. Perhaps NH would be better for you. It wasn't for me, and I have no doubt whatsoever that OK is THE place, life is good here, as good if not better than I've ever had it before.

No doubt I'll get my share of detractors who will flame me for daring to say anything negative about NH, and to suggest that someplace else is actually better for the average type of person. To them, I'll simply smile and nod. I've lived in both places, I like it far better here, and I'm entitled to have that opinion, just as they may have theirs.

Edit: Although this report is newer and measures the "housing affordability index" slightly differently than what I had seen before, the map contained here shows the same thing:
http://nlihc.org/oor/2012
Compare the states where housing is the most affordable. OK is one of the absolute lowest, NH is one of the highest. Of all the states where the cost of housing is highest, NH has the most freedom by far. Of all the states where the cost of housing is the lowest, OK has the most amount of freedom by far. And all things considered, OK is at least equal with regards to freedom as NH, if not better.

Edit #2: Being used to the states mentioned above, OK was a bit of culture shock for me. People actually do walk around here in 10 gallon hats, string ties, and cowboy boots, you are very much so in the south here. You meet someone, and one of the first questions they ask is what church you go to (my answer: I avoid it religiously). You walk into a business, and instead of "smoking prohibited by law", the sign on the door says "no firearms".

 

[enoch150]

Anyways, here are my thoughts.

-----Best States-----

1. Idaho
Pros: Boise is One of the Country's Best Cities (Clean, Low Crime, Increasing High-Tech Presence, Strong Economy), Decent Tax and Gun Laws, Gorgeous Forests in
the Panhandle, Excellent Retreat Sites, Coeur D'Alene, Surprisingly Warm Climate Due to Maritime Influence
Cons: Average Soil, Winters are Bad Near Yellowstone and the Canadian Boarder

2. Wyoming
Pros: No Major Population Centers, Frontier Spirit in Much of State, Good Tax and Firearms Laws
Cons: No Major Population Centers, Harsh Climate, Food Would Be Hard to Come By in a Collapse Scenario, Gave Us Dick Cheney

3. Utah
Pros: Nice People, Beautiful Landscape, Excellent Retreat Sites, Decent Population Centers
Cons: Most Land is Federally Owned, Isolated, Climate Can Be Harsh, Poor Soil, Majority LDS Population (if that isn't your thing)

4. Montana
Pros: Good Tax Laws, Strong Gun Rights, Retreat Sites in Western Part of the State, Libertarian Bent in Local Politics
Cons: Harsh Climate, Increasing West Coast Presence in Goverment, Massive Nuclear Weapon Field near Great Falls, Majority of Land is Federally Owned, Little to No
Available Farmland

5. Tennessee
Pros: Favorable Tax Laws, Warm Climate, Good People, Strong Economy With Many Job Opportunities, Eastern Tennessee is a Great Retreat Site
Cons: Surrounded By Large Population Centers (Memphis, Nashville, Atlanta), Humid, Ice Storms in the Winter

6. Arizona
Pros: Solid Gun Rights, Excellent Retreat Sites in the North, Climate is Warm Year-Round
Cons: Poor Soil, Water Must Be Brought In From Other States, Proximity to U.S.-Mexican Boarder

7. New Hampshire
Pros: Tax Laws are Decent, Libertarian Representation at Local and State Level, Scenic Forests
Cons: Proximity to East Coast Population Centers, High Latitiude Climate, Massholes

8. Colorado
Pros: Beautiful Scenery, Great Retreat Sites, Were it Not For Denver, Colorado Would Be My Top Pick
Cons: Most Residents Are Either West Coast Liberals or Evangelical Christian Conservatives, Worsening Gun Rights, Increasing Tax Rates, Denver is Basically the
Washington D.C. of the West

9. Kentucky
Pros: Great Farmland, Friendly People, Eastern Kentucky is a Great Retreat Site
Cons: Environmental Regulations Have Really Hurt the State's Economy, Inferior in Almost Every Way to Its Neighbor Tennessee

10. Alaska
Pros: No Income Tax, Plenty of Open Space, Gun Laws, Strong Libertarian Bent
Cons: Punishing Climate, Wild Animals Can Be Extremely Dangerous, Isolated, Dependent On Imports For Much of the Year, At Risk of Being Occupied By Asian Powers


-----Worst States-----

10. California
Pros: Excellent Climate Along the Coastline, Near Unlimited Agricultural Potential
Cons: Terrible Gun Laws, High Taxes, Heavy Risk of Natural Disasters, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Oakland

9. New York
Pros: Adirondacks Are Beautiful, Western New York State is Alright, Fun Place to Visit
Cons: New York City, Tax Laws, Non-Existent Gun Rights, Epicenter of the Police State, Massive Risk of Social Unrest

8. Massachusetts
Pros: Northwestern Part of the State is Nice
Cons: Everything Else

7.Delaware
Pros: None
Cons: Horrific Tax Laws, Gun Rights are Non-Existent, Proximity to Urban Centers

6. Maryland
Pros: Western Part of the State Isn't Bad...
Cons: ...Everywhere Else Is, Horrible Tax Laws, No Gun Rights, Densely Populated, Massive Urban Centers, Baltimore, Huge Potential For Social Unrest

5. Florida
Pros: Warm Climate Can Be Nice in Times of Peace
Cons: 'Do Not Inhabit' Region in a Collapse Scenario, Hot, Humid, High Risk of Hurriances, Insects Can Be Overwhelming Without Pesticide, East, West, South Escape
Routes Cut-Off By Ocean, Poor Climate for Growing Most Crops

4. Connecticut
Pros: None
Cons: Highest Cost of Living, Abysmal Gun Laws, High Taxes, Densely Populated and Close to Massive Urban Centers

3. New Jersey
Pros: None
Cons: High Cost of Living, Very High Population Density, Massive Population Centers on All Sides, Terrible Laws, East and South Escape Routes Impeded by Seawater

2. Hawaii
Pros: Tropical Climate
Cons: Completely Isolated From Mainland, Impossible to Evacuate, Terrible Gun Laws, High Risk of Natural Disasters (Earthquakes, Volcanoes, Hurricanes), Likely to be
Occupied in the Future

1. Rhode Island
Pros: None
Cons: Horrible Tax Laws, Gun Rights Are Abysmal, Highest Population Density of Any State, Surrounded On All Sides By Massive Population Centers

Connecticut has much more bad than good, but Every state has SOMETHING good about it. In recent years Connecticut has certainly gotten worse on taxes, guns, and eminent domain, but it has improved in other areas, like gay marriage, marijuana, and immigrant protections. Do you know there are some states that don't even allow strippers to actually strip? Shocking, I know, but Connecticut isn't one of them. The Connecticut, Massachusetts, Rhode Island area have by far the fewest deaths per capita from natural disasters out of anywhere in the country. They have very few tornadoes, earthquakes, or wildfires, hurricanes are mild, and snowstorms are mild near the shore. Saying that an entire state is densely populated can be misleading. In Connecticut, 70% of the population lives in just 3 counties (out of 8). Most of the towns outside of those counties don't even have a local police force, and still have very low crime.

It just depends on what you're looking for.

From what I've seen and read, the Kentucky, Tennessee, Virginia area might be the best option.

 

[Keith and stuff]

Tax Foundation's listing on all sorts of costs... per State, Counties, Cities...

http://taxfoundation.org/tax-topics/state-tax-and-spending-policy

The Tax Foundation, a tax research group in Washington, DC, provides these numbers for the 20 Lowest State Property tax Rates on Owner-occupied Housing in the USA in 2008:

1. .14% Louisiana
2. .32% Alabama
3. .43% Delaware
4. .43% Washington DC
5. .47% Mississpippi
6. .48% West Virgina
7. .49% South Carolina
8. .51% Arkansas
9. .51% New Mexico
10. .54% Wyoming
11. .56% Utah
12. .57% Arizona
13. .58% Colorado
14. .61% California
15. .63% Nevada
16. .66% Idaho
17. .67% Tennessee
18. .69% Virgina
19. .70% Kentucky
20. .72% Oklahoma

Those numbers are almost useless. Average property taxes paid is a far more useful number per home. Those numbers are from 2008. Property taxes is just 1 part of 4 sets of taxes that makes up state and local personal taxes. Then there is the taxes folks pay to other states to consider. Then you might want to compare this as a percentage of state per capita income.

States like CA, NJ, NY, CT and MN usually come out near the worst. States like AK, SD, TN and NH usually come out near the best. Though, since the cost of living is so incredibly high, even with very low taxes in the rural parts of AK, the overall cost of living is higher when taxes are aded in and the quality of live tends to be a lot lower than a place like MN or NH.

 

[invisible]

Those numbers are almost useless. Average property taxes paid is a far more useful number per home. Those numbers are from 2008. Property taxes is just 1 part of 4 sets of taxes that makes up state and local personal taxes. Then there is the taxes folks pay to other states to consider. Then you might want to compare this as a percentage of state per capita income.

States like CA, NJ, NY, CT and MN usually come out near the worst. States like AK, SD, TN and NH usually come out near the best. Though, since the cost of living is so incredibly high, even with very low taxes in the rural parts of AK, the overall cost of living is higher when taxes are aded in and the quality of live tends to be a lot lower than a place like MN or NH.

Bingo! This is absolutely correct. You can't just look at only one set of numbers when considering taxes. And you have to remember that some "taxes" are hidden as part of the "cost of living".
Property tax (largely regressive and completely unavoidable)
Income tax (avoidable legally to at least some degree for states having one)
Sales tax (avoidable legally to at least some degree for states having one)
Utility "tax" (most places require you to have utilities by law, really only avoidable by living off-grid)
Housing cost "tax" (an "inflation tax", via the housing bubble, for both renting and purchasing)
Regional variation "tax" in cost of food and gas
ALL of these have to be considered together to get an accurate picture of the whole, and all of them vary in different locations.

The trick is how these all balance out together, such that you are able to keep as much as possible of your earnings (which of course is one way to measure degrees of freedom). This will vary according to both your income and location, due to the nature of these different costs. But that is still not all, because quality of life / standard of living also factor in, and affect your freedom. Average income levels on a local and statewide basis DO also play a role in how all of the above balances out. It's all tied together in one way or another, and it all has to be considered in addition to the differences in actual laws between the states.

 

[fisharmor]

So, where did I end up? My vote for the top state: OKLAHOMA!

I'm glad you found somewhere you liked, and I realize that everyone's going to trade off some things to find it. Lord knows I'm trading a couple things.

But Oklahoma features way, way too often in certain stories here.
I don't give a flying crap through a rolling donut how great it is in Oklahoma or Ohio or Idaho, as long as they keep showing up in police abuse threads.

Like I said, here in Virginia, Daniel Harmon-Wright is in prison.

 

[Bastiat's The Law]

Too many tornados in Oklahoma.

 

[klamath]

Oregon would be Top 5 easily were it not for Portland. Pretty much the Illinois of the West Coast, in that regard.

Yeaw Oregon has that same problem as IL and CA. Population centers holding them down. Central and northeast Oregon has some great places.

 

[BuddyRey]

I would not recommend an Island. They are often dependent on imports, prone to occupation, and are at high risk of natural disasters. Most importantly, a boat or plane is your only method of transportation should you have to flee.

Still, you've got to admit that there probably wouldn't be much Federal law enforcement presence there in the event of a collapse, at least, relative to what there would be on the mainland. Plus, the dependence on exports could be circumvented by growing your own food.

I guess I was more curious about how they stack up legislatively, especially alongside libertarian strongholds in the mountain west, like Wyoming or Montana. Do we have any Virgin Islanders on RPF's?

 

[PaulConventionWV]

Idaho? hmmm.....why?

Because it's a cold, deserted wasteland like every other state on that list except for Texas and maybe Iowa?

But hey, liiibertyyyyy.... right?

 

[klamath]

Because it's a cold, deserted wasteland like every other state on that list except for Texas and maybe Iowa?

But hey, liiibertyyyyy.... right?

Shows how little you know.

 

[jtap]

Concealed carry laws:

Alabama is a shall issue state now (as of May 2013) and recognizes all other state CCW permits.

http://www.nraila.org/legislation/s...ns-omnibus-firearms-reform-bill-into-law.aspx

 

[James Madison]

Connecticut has much more bad than good, but Every state has SOMETHING good about it. In recent years Connecticut has certainly gotten worse on taxes, guns, and eminent domain, but it has improved in other areas, like gay marriage, marijuana, and immigrant protections. Do you know there are some states that don't even allow strippers to actually strip? Shocking, I know, but Connecticut isn't one of them. The Connecticut, Massachusetts, Rhode Island area have by far the fewest deaths per capita from natural disasters out of anywhere in the country. They have very few tornadoes, earthquakes, or wildfires, hurricanes are mild, and snowstorms are mild near the shore. Saying that an entire state is densely populated can be misleading. In Connecticut, 70% of the population lives in just 3 counties (out of 8). Most of the towns outside of those counties don't even have a local police force, and still have very low crime.

It just depends on what you're looking for.

From what I've seen and read, the Kentucky, Tennessee, Virginia area might be the best option.

My list is based on what states offer the best long-term survival options. Connecticut may be an ok place now, but in a collapse scenario its proximity to large population centers, lack of safe retreat sites, and restrictive gun laws make it difficult to recommend under any scenario.

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

That's an example... use the fucking link I provided to research the measurements, dates, costs, taxes, fees, etc. Sheesh, people are getting lazy round here.

Those numbers are almost useless. Average property taxes paid is a far more useful number per home. Those numbers are from 2008. Property taxes is just 1 part of 4 sets of taxes that makes up state and local personal taxes. Then there is the taxes folks pay to other states to consider. Then you might want to compare this as a percentage of state per capita income.

States like CA, NJ, NY, CT and MN usually come out near the worst. States like AK, SD, TN and NH usually come out near the best. Though, since the cost of living is so incredibly high, even with very low taxes in the rural parts of AK, the overall cost of living is higher when taxes are aded in and the quality of live tends to be a lot lower than a place like MN or NH.