Pat Buchanan calls for intervention in Nigeria

[dillo]

I am very non interventionalist, for some reason I wouldnt mind sending in the seals to smash some fundamentalist muslim heads in. Maybe im a closeted neo-con, but what is happening to those girls is just the epitome of evil.

 

[dillo]

I've always honored what Dr. Ron Paul has said about non-intervention because it's based on the "Golden Rule": We need to look at this subject from the perspective of what we would do if foreign nations were doing it to us. Let's take abortion, for example. Every year, we slaughter millions of unborn female babies, under the guise of "choice." We have institutionalized genocide going on right here in America. Now, what if some nation decided that they felt injustice for those unborn female babies being killed in their mother's wombs, and that nation decided to launch a military campaign to save those babies by bombing abortion clinics on U.S. soil? Would the U.S. government allow such a thing to take place without repercussions? Of course not!

Yet, when it comes to other nations and the treatment of their children, the U.S. government behaves just as the example above towards them. And Pat Buchanan, who should know better, has allowed the global emotionalism surrounding the kidnapped girls in Nigeria (as tragic as that is) to undermine his very principles on non-intervention. He says that "we [U.S. government] can do something about it," but that doesn't mean that we ought to do something about it. If that's the case, why stop at Nigeria? There are other nations in which we "can" help with their domestic affairs, too.

abortion and kidnapping 12 year old girls aren't even close to the same thing, like do you actually believe that?

 

[juleswin]

I am very non interventionalist, for some reason I wouldnt mind sending in the seals to smash some fundamentalist muslim heads in. Maybe im a closeted neo-con, but what is happening to those girls is just the epitome of evil.

I think there is a difference between being invited be it seal team or drone team unit and declaring war uninvited and injecting yourself into a conflict. The way i see it is this, say for e.g. there is a very dangerous virus infecting a bunch of people in Nigeria and the Nigerian govt asks the CDC to come in an investigate and help them solve the mystery. The country sends out invitation, pays the US govt for their services and when the job is done or host country decides they have been helped enough, the guest country leaves with their team.

This way, its more like cooperating than invasion. What makes this different from say the Somali govt calling for US help during their civil war(whole black hawk down incident) is that there is really nobody on the other side, this is not a civil war of any kind. There are no factions publicly supporting them. There are a few issues where the whole country with all the religious and tribes agree with and eliminating Boko Haram is one of em.

 

[Occam's Banana]

Man, this whole situation is just a major bummer ...
I really used to like Boko Haram - A Whiter Shade of Pale is a great song.
What the hell happened to those guys? Why are they pulling this crap?

 

[devil21]

This story is such bullshit.

 

[juleswin]

Breaking: Nigeria Army 'Knows Where Boko Haram Are Holding Girls'

Source: BBC News

@AP: BREAKING: Nigerian defense chief says military has located abducted girls but cannot go in with force.

@BreakingNews: Nigerian military say they know where schoolgirls kidnapped by Boko Haram in April are but cannot make it public - @BBCBreaking, @AP

Nigeria army 'knows where Boko Haram are holding girls'

8 minutes ago

The Nigerian military say they know where the girls kidnapped by Boko Haram are but they will not attempt a rescue.

Nigeria's Chief of Defence Staff said it was "good news for the parents," although he admitted the military would not risk "going there with force."

- snip -

Earlier, the BBC learned that a deal to release some of the girls was close but was called off by the government.

The BBC's Will Ross in Abuja says an intermediary met leaders of the Islamist group and visited the place where they were being held.


http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-27582873#TWEET1139617

 

[RandallFan]

Pat Buchanan didn't stop the Syria intervention and I dont think the people in power will listen to Buchanan.

I think he means because it is non urban; physically they can go in and kill every adult male in the camp.

It was the public that rose up.

 

[amy31416]

Man, this whole situation is just a major bummer ...
I really used to like Boko Haram - A Whiter Shade of Pale is a great song.
What the hell happened to those guys? Why are they pulling this crap?

I feel the need to respond to this, yet feel unequipped, comedically.

 

[LibertyEagle]

abortion and kidnapping 12 year old girls aren't even close to the same thing, like do you actually believe that?

I agree, they're different. With abortion, the child is murdered. The 12 year old girls are still alive.

Was that your point?

 

[Christian Liberty]

I am very non interventionalist, for some reason I wouldnt mind sending in the seals to smash some fundamentalist muslim heads in. Maybe im a closeted neo-con, but what is happening to those girls is just the epitome of evil.

You may not be "neocon" but this is definitely an anti-libertarian POV.

abortion and kidnapping 12 year old girls aren't even close to the same thing, like do you actually believe that?

I agree, they're different. With abortion, the child is murdered. The 12 year old girls are still alive.

Was that your point?

Agreed. + rep.

 

[devil21]

I agree, they're different. With abortion, the child is murdered. The 12 year old girls are still alive.

Was that your point?

Have you looked at the pictures purported to be these "girls"? They're covered head to toe in those black muslim robes and the few faces that have been shown are clearly not 12 year olds, nor are even close to 200-300 shown. This is a completely fabricated storyline to justify publicly inserting US military (and likely additional CIA types) into Nigeria and neighboring countries for infrastructure upgrades on your dime and resource theft. Maybe Boko Haram will soon steal some yellowcake just in case your emotions weren't sufficiently manipulated by the "kidnapped girls". They know people fall for that sort of bullshit too (see: Iraq).

 

[dillo]

I agree, they're different. With abortion, the child is murdered. The 12 year old girls are still alive.

Was that your point?

1st death is probably better than being a sex slave for the rest of your life

2nd when exactly is it a child?

 

[Peace&Freedom]

1st death is probably better than being a sex slave for the rest of your life

2nd when exactly is it a child?

And you 'probably' know death is better than sex slavery how? Do you have first hand knowledge of either?

Both are human, and both are not adults. So they are both children for exactly as long as they have both existed.

BTW, the Nigerian story is mostly manufactured. The Nigerian government stated all but a few of the children are accounted for, then was pressured to retract that statement by the US. That's a clear sign the emotional issue is being used to put the Empire's interventionist foot in the door of Nigeria, due to it becoming more populous, prosperous and resource rich than even South Africa in that region.

 

[Warlord]

bump

 

[Occam's Banana]

I feel the need to respond to this, yet feel unequipped, comedically.

My work here is done.

 

[ProIndividual]

1. I don't care who you trade with; that's just a bullshit strawman you are tossing out. That has nothing whatsoever to do with illegal immigration.



2. You say that like you don't believe that some powerful individuals want world government. If that is what you are saying, then I would suggest opening a book or listening to a speech. It is openly promoted.



3. lol. Tell it to Ron Paul. Because he doesn't agree with you, either. If at some future point in time, you can get rid of the welfare state and create perfect individuals, then we can talk. Until then, to have no borders would end what little liberty we have left. You don't seem to get that do you? Not everyone in the world wants to live in the same way. The best that can be done, until you create perfect individuals, is for those who want to live with a certain set of guidelines, to cut out a part of the world and live there. Others can do same. That is what borders are.

1. Trading labor is still trade. It has everything to do with immigration.

2. Who cares if people want NWO...that has nothing to do with my stances, and you started off with your "one-worlder" ad hominem, like you do every time we discuss this.

3. Ron Paul isn't a god. He can be wrong...and he is on immigration if he opposed open immigration (a free labor market). I don't agree with people on a lot of issues, even if I agree with them more than I disagree. I don't get my ethics and economic preferences from cults of personality or individual people...I get them from logic, reason, and evidence. Where Ron opposed (if he did) open immigration as I described it above, he opposed a free labor market. You can't have a free market economy where some markets are intervened with by the state. Think about that logically.


And borders are just lines drawn on maps by states. Defense of them for the populace's safety has NOTHING to do with immigration policy (that is an economic or xenophobic, or both, policy). Open immigration has background checks for violent crime, fraud, etc...and it has medical exams for pandemic diseases (like a Black Plague, for example). What open immigration doesn't have is interference into the free market (it only stops direct and measurable harm, fraud, or imminent endangerment)...and any quotas or other authoritarian bullshit requirements of the state ARE, inarguably, interventions into the labor market. Don't equate that to existentially important to borders just being there and functional. Their function is for defense, not to placate your xenophobia or to act as a protectionist scheme in labor markets.

I really wonder sometimes how many people here are REALLY for free markets, and how many think "free markets" means all this protectionist shit is allowed and just peachy. The latter are hypocrites, ignorant, and/or just flat wrong.

You cannot be for any immigration policy except open border policy unless you forsake, logically, property rights, free trade, free markets, and freedom of movement. It's not debatable (although that never stops you guys). Just learn to admit you're wrong and change your faults...it's easier than doing mental backflips to call your idea of immigration policy "libertarian".