Pagan Elements in Christianity

eduardo89 said:
Came across this on FB just now :D

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I'm sorry that reported episode has just never passed the sniff test with me. It just seems so contrived, inconsistent, and out of character for Jesus.
I suspect TPTB fabricated it to build a case against a perceived threat, problem and troublemaker. If Jesus had wanted to get himself arrested, he was surely more than smart enough to figure out some nonviolent way to do it.
 
erowe1 said:
Because Jesus commanded them to do that.
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I seem to recall that Jesus commanded a whole lot of stuff that just doesn't seem to manage to get done. Global missionaries doesn't seem likely to be a top priority in the full scheme of things.
 
Ronin Truth said:
I'm sorry that reported episode has just never passed the sniff test with me. It just seems so contrived, inconsistent, and out of character for Jesus.
I suspect TPTB fabricated it to build a case against a perceived threat, problem and troublemaker. If Jesus had wanted to get himself arrested, he was surely more than smart enough to figure out some nonviolent way to do it.
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Read Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Just about every other episode ends with something along the lines of "as the people reached for stones to kill him, Jesus slipped away." The truth was chased from many villages.

The chasing of the money changers from the temple is one of the many reasons TPTB hates Jesus.
 
Ronin Truth said:
It just seems so contrived, inconsistent, and out of character for Jesus.
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Not to me is doesn't.
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.
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You will get to see that mood again.
 
RJB said:
Read Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Just about every other episode ends with something along the lines of "as the people reached for stones to kill him, Jesus slipped away." The truth was chased from many villages.

The chasing of the money changers from the temple is one of the many reasons TPTB hates Jesus.
Click to expand...
I figure the money changers in the temple was pretty much a common fixture and daily occurrence of temple life. So why the upset on that particular day in that particular way? Something just doesn't add up for me.
 
In January 2008, Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola and George Barna rocked the Christian world. Yet it was only the first half of the argument. It was never meant to be a stand-alone book. In August 2008, Reimagining Church by Frank Viola was released. It's the second half of the argument. Both books can be likened unto a puzzle.

Pagan Christianity demonstrates that the picture on the box has been wrong, and that's why the pieces haven't been fitting together. Reimagining Church presents a fresh vision of the picture on the box that's rooted in the teachings of Jesus and the apostles. Pagan Christianity is the deconstructive side of the argument; Reimagining Church is the constructive side. Both books go together, forming a compelling and insightful vision of the church after God's own heart.

Pagan Christianity leads readers on a fascinating tour through church history, revealing this startling and unsettling truth: Many cherished church traditions embraced today originated not out of the New Testament, but out of pagan (Greco-Roman) practices. This fact removes these cherished practices from the sacred and untouchable. But more than that, the book demonstrates that many of these cherished church traditions violate the teachings of Jesus and the apostles.

Over the years, many people have tried to discount the message of Pagan Christianity by misrepresenting it with straw-man arguments. But the arguments in the book, substantiated by over 1,000 footnotes, still stand. They have yet to be successfully refuted. Frank Viola's ReChurch Library presents a thorough treatment of the biblical teaching concerning the church.
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http://www.paganchristianity.org/

http://www.amazon.com/Pagan-Christianity-Exploring-Church-Practices/dp/1414364555

FWIW
 
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Jamesiv1 said:
Sure it was (official religion of Rome) - starting in 380 AD with the Edict of Thessalonica

I'm not saying it was written later, just made official later. In 393 AD the New Testament was canonized at the Synod of Hippo. And then Jerome produced the latin Vulgate just seven years later.

300+ years and several translations removed from whoever first put Jesus' words to paper. We're lucky we have any of his actual teachings....
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I can easily show you positive proof that the Gospel of Matthew was widely revered as holy scripture as early as the beginning of the 2nd century AD or earlier. I can also easily show you positive proof that the verses I quoted have always been part of the book, and are present in numerous witnesses to the text of Matthew from considerably earlier than the 300's AD.
 
Ronin Truth said:
http://www.paganchristianity.org/

http://www.amazon.com/Pagan-Christianity-Exploring-Church-Practices/dp/1414364555

FWIW
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Notice the thesis of that book:
most of what Christians do in present-day churches is rooted, not in the New Testament, but in pagan culture and rituals developed long after the death of the apostles.
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In other words, they are not talking about Christianity as it is attested in the New Testament itself. They're not talking about the belief in the virgin birth, baptism, the turning of water into wine, the death and resurrection of Jesus, or any other essentials of the Christian faith. They are only talking about later traditions that may be commonly practiced, but that many people, even if they practice them, wouldn't consider essentials of the faith.
 
erowe1 said:
Notice the thesis of that book:


In other words, they are not talking about Christianity as it is attested in the New Testament itself. They're not talking about the belief in the virgin birth, baptism, the turning of water into wine, the death and resurrection of Jesus, or any other essentials of the Christian faith. They are only talking about later traditions that may be commonly practiced, but that many people, even if they practice them, wouldn't consider essentials of the faith.
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Like me they are probably talking about the pagan Roman Empire hijack of Christianity. I just found the books link this morning and thought it sounded interesting.
 
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