Our US Constitution is NOT a social contract.

[erowe1]

ha ha! YOU are SO funny!

and FUCKING stupid enough to suggest that a senior HVAC/R service tech does NOT know what a "state" is.

a "state" is a "phase" azzhat.

care to challenge MY definition of the word "state"?

What does being a senior HVAC/R service tech have to do with knowing what a "state" is?

 

[HVACTech]

What does being a senior HVAC/R service tech have to do with knowing what a "state" is?

think of it this way,
what is Propane before it is burned?
as the "Freon" circulates in a closed loop. it's "state" is changed. from a liquid to a gas.

both the "freon" and the Propane changed "state"
change of state is a phase change.

why do I live in a state of Arkansas?
it is a "phase" only. right?

this land was here LONG before I showed up..

what does the word "state" mean to you sir?

 

[mrsat_98]

what does the word "state" mean to you sir?

state
stāt/Submit
noun
1.
the particular condition that someone or something is in at a specific time.
"the state of the company's finances"
synonyms: condition, shape, situation, circumstances, position; More
2.
a nation or territory considered as an organized political community under one government.
"Germany, Italy, and other European states"
synonyms: country, nation, land, sovereign state, nation state, kingdom, realm, power, republic, confederation, federation
"an autonomous state"
adjective
1.
of, provided by, or concerned with the civil government of a country.
"the future of state education"
2.
used or done on ceremonial occasions; involving the ceremony associated with a head of state.
"a state visit to Hungary by Queen Elizabeth"
synonyms: ceremonial, official, formal, governmental, national, public
"a state visit to France"
verb
1.
express something definitely or clearly in speech or writing.
"the report stated that more than 51 percent of voters failed to participate"
synonyms: express, voice, utter, put into words, declare, affirm, assert, announce, make known, put across/over, communicate, air, reveal, disclose, divulge, proclaim, present, expound; More
2.
MUSIC
present or introduce (a theme or melody) in a composition.

 

[kcchiefs6465]

think of it this way,
what is Propane before it is burned?
as the "Freon" circulates in a closed loop. it's "state" is changed. from a liquid to a gas.

both the "freon" and the Propane changed "state"
change of state is a phase change.

why do I live in a state of Arkansas?
it is a "phase" only. right?

this land was here LONG before I showed up..

what does the word "state" mean to you sir?

Let's try something else.

What are the benefits of using R34a over R12?

 

[Live_Free_Or_Die]

you are trying really, REALLY hard to make this complicated and complex.
we have one of the shortest Constitutions (rule of law) in the world. in fact probably THE shortest.

That is a non-argument. The issue is simple. The burden of proof is on he who makes the claim. You are and have been claiming the Constitution does not apply to people. I find it extremely difficult to believe those individuals who participated in the convention were ignorant there was already a system of government. I find it extremely difficult to believe those individuals who participated in the convention were ignorant of the fact the purpose of the convention was to amend the AoC. I find it extremely difficult to believe those individuals who participated in the convention were ignorant to the text of the AoC and its amendment clause.

You have provided nothing to challenge the simple logic of the convention convened by the government at that time was for the purpose of amending the AoC, not supplanting it. There is nothing complex about that. A comparable analogy would be an amendment under the present constitution supplanting the entire document and ratified by less than "the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof."

The legal solution to that dilemma has been carved out by going back to the DoI. All sovereignty ultimately derives from the people. The confederation established by the AoI rested upon the authority of the people but its powers only applied to states. By ratifying the Constitution in popular conventions the people who are ultimately sovereign exercised a judicial power to replace the AoI with the Constitution. It is plainly obvious under Article 1, Section 8 some of the enumerated powers can only logically apply to individuals. For instance, counterfeiting coin. Treason can only apply to individuals. There is a reason the whole notion of jurisdiction exists. There must always be a nexus to the federal political subdivision for federal jurisdiction but sometimes that nexus only need be an individual operating in a state because all states are members of the United States. Also, any federal police powers apply to individuals.

Let us consider the following excerpt from the Institutes of Justinian:

"The will of the Emperor has also the force of law : since by the lex r€gia^, passed to define his authority, the people have granted for him and to him all their authority and power. Whatever, therefore, the Emperor has established by his letter, or decreed when sitting as judge, or enjoined by his edict, is admitted to be law; and these are styled Constitutions"

Let us define the term people as used and understood at the time just using a garden variety dictionary of the day and ignoring any wisdom contained in things like Blackstone's Commentaries or the Institutes of Justinian about laws of persons or their divisions:

PEOPLE: A nation; those who compose a community. The vulgar. The commonality; not the princes or nobles. Persons of a particular class. Men or persons in general.

Dictionary of the English Language by Samuel Johnson (1768, 3rd edition) or 1792 edition (look up People):
https://books.google.com/books?id=bXsCAAAAQAAJ&pg=PT7&hl=en#v=onepage&q&f=false

We can say that no, the Constitution does not apply to "the" <-- "the" people as in people meaning a plurality of those who compose a community because sovereignty, as the theory goes, derives from that plurality which ultimately derives from each individual member. Yet individual != sovereignty. Individual > sovereignty. Therefore sovereignty is only a part of each individual which is why we describe sovereignty as a capacity each individual can possess. Group of individuals operating as one people = sovereignty. Hence We "The" People. However I do not believe you are using the term people in that sense when you claim it does not apply to people (people vs. "the" people). We can say that people is a capacity of any individual who composes a community, member of the commonality, person of a particular class, or men or persons in general can operate in. Capacity is a potential use, in this case use of an identity.

In the following example. The bad press Ron Paul received. Press is plural. Bad is an adjective of press describing a kind of press. The denotes and refers to this particular kind of group as one thing in its sum. You wanted a simple construction based on plain language right?

 

[HVACTech]

Let's try something else.

What are the benefits of using R34a over R12?

primarily the elimination of the chlorine molecule. R134A is an HFC, not a CFC.
both are medium pressure gasses.

we do not use R134A anymore for commercial Refrigeration. most everything has gone over to R404A.

 

[kcchiefs6465]

primarily the elimination of the chlorine molecule. R134A is an HFC, not a CFC.
both are medium pressure gasses.

we do not use R134A anymore for commercial Refrigeration. most everything has gone over to R404A.

Thank you.

I feel like I've gained something from your posts now.

I was thinking about getting into automotive air conditioning. Going to have to take that EPA quiz and pay the twenty five bucks first, though.

 

[Live_Free_Or_Die]

think of it this way,
what is Propane before it is burned?
as the "Freon" circulates in a closed loop. it's "state" is changed. from a liquid to a gas.

both the "freon" and the Propane changed "state"
change of state is a phase change.

why do I live in a state of Arkansas?
it is a "phase" only. right?

this land was here LONG before I showed up..

what does the word "state" mean to you sir?

Using the narrow scope of your definition we could say the state of America changed following the American Revolution when it transitioned from a monarchy to confederation. We could say the state of America changed when the Constitution was adopted when it transitioned from a confederation to a republic.

However all types or kinds of states when used to describe any government have common traits such as monopolies on defense and justice. There is no type or kind of state absent those qualities. No advocates nor opponents of anarcho-capitalisism describe such a potential society as a state.

Therefore since all states have certain repulsive coercive attributes it is perfectly valid to oppose states no matter how you want to define them. Since all states have certain repulsive coercive attributes it is perfectly valid to advocate the absence of a state when no one considers some forms of social organization such as anarcho-capitalism as a state.

However, according to your own definition state of Arkansas != State of Arkansas. Using your definition the state of Arkansas is a republic whereas the State of Arkansas refers to a proper noun (ie. person, place, or thing) denoted by capitalization. I am pretty sure it reads We the People of the State of Arkansas. Plain language construction.

Actually that is typically one of my questions in a court. Perhaps you have an answer. As a proper noun is the State of Arkansas denoting a specific person, place, or thing? I just want a full and honest disclosure so I know what you are talking about when you say the State of Arkansas.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Thank you.

I feel like I've gained something from your posts now.

I was thinking about getting into automotive air conditioning. Going to have to take that EPA quiz and pay the twenty five bucks first, though.

134A is still common in automotive uses.

 

[HVACTech]

Using the narrow scope of your definition we could say the state of America changed following the American Revolution when it transitioned from a monarchy to confederation. We could say the state of America changed when the Constitution was adopted when it transitioned from a confederation to a republic.

However all types or kinds of states when used to describe any government have common traits such as monopolies on defense and justice. There is no type or kind of state absent those qualities. No advocates nor opponents of anarcho-capitalisism describe such a potential society as a state.

Therefore since all states have certain repulsive coercive attributes it is perfectly valid to oppose states no matter how you want to define them. Since all states have certain repulsive coercive attributes it is perfectly valid to advocate the absence of a state when no one considers some forms of social organization such as anarcho-capitalism as a state.

However, according to your own definition state of Arkansas != State of Arkansas. Using your definition the state of Arkansas is a republic whereas the State of Arkansas refers to a proper noun (ie. person, place, or thing) denoted by capitalization. I am pretty sure it reads We the People of the State of Arkansas. Plain language construction.

Actually that is typically one of my questions in a court. Perhaps you have an answer. As a proper noun is the State of Arkansas denoting a specific person, place, or thing? I just want a full and honest disclosure so I know what you are talking about when you say the State of Arkansas.

The word "Arkansas" itself is a French pronunciation ("Arcansas") of a Quapaw (a related "Kaw" tribe) word, akakaze, meaning "land of downriver people" or the Sioux word akakaze meaning "people of the south wind".

the real burning question for me is... where is the "W" in Arkansas?

 

[erowe1]

think of it this way,
what is Propane before it is burned?
as the "Freon" circulates in a closed loop. it's "state" is changed. from a liquid to a gas.

both the "freon" and the Propane changed "state"
change of state is a phase change.

why do I live in a state of Arkansas?
it is a "phase" only. right?

this land was here LONG before I showed up..

what does the word "state" mean to you sir?

You're equivocating between two totally different definitions.

In a political context, a state is a subgroup within a society that subjugates the rest using violence.

Or, to put that in other words, we can use this definition:

7. a politically unified people occupying a definite territory; nation.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/state?s=t

States of matter are a totally separate concept:

2. the condition of matter with respect to structure, form, constitution, phase, or the like:
water in a gaseous state.

 

[Live_Free_Or_Die]

the real burning question for me is... where is the "W" in Arkansas?

I like burning questions. Is "State of Arkansas" one proper noun or are "State" and "Arkansas" two proper nouns?