Official Maine Caucus Results thread

[jolynna]

"Remember The Maine" is a terrible rallying cry. The incident of the Maine blowing up was a pretense for declaring war on Spain and was our first war of imperialism. The Phillippine 'Insurrection' following the US's annexation of the islands was particularly bloody and estimates of Filipino dead range up to over a million.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The number of Filipino casualties was at the time, and still is, intensely debated and politicized.[citation needed] It is estimated that some 34,000 Filipino soldiers lost their lives and that as many as 200,000 civilians may have died directly or indirectly as a result of the war, most due to a major cholera epidemic that broke out near its end.[84]

In 1908 Manuel Arellano Remondo, in General Geography of the Philippine Islands, wrote: “The population decreased due to the wars, in the five-year period from 1895 to 1900, since, at the start of the first insurrection, the population was estimated at 9,000,000, and at present (1908), the inhabitants of the Archipelago do not exceed 8,000,000 in number.”[85] In light of the massive casualties suffered by the civilian population, Filipino historian E. San Juan, Jr., alleges that the death of 1.4 million Filipinos constitutes an act of genocide on the part of the United States.[86]

Atrocities were committed on both sides.[87] United States attacks into the countryside often included scorched earth campaigns[71] in which entire villages were burned and destroyed, the use of torture (water cure[88]) and the concentration of civilians into "protected zones".[89] In November 1901, the Manila correspondent of the Philadelphia Ledger reported:"The present war is no bloodless, opera bouffe engagement; our men have been relentless, have killed to exterminate men, women, children, prisoners and captives, active insurgents and suspected people from lads of ten up, the idea prevailing that the Filipino as such was little better than a dog...."[90]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine–American_War

about the Maine....

A minor revolt in Cuba against the Spanish colonial government provided a colorful topic. For months now the papers had been painting in lurid detail the horrors of Cuban life under oppressive Spanish rule. The Spanish had confined many Cubans to concentration camps. The press called them "death camps." Wild stories with screaming headlines -- Spanish Cannibalism, Inhuman Torture, Amazon Warriors Fight For Rebels -- flooded the newsstands. Newspapers sent hundreds of reporters, artists, and photographers south to recount Spanish atrocities. The correspondents, including such notables as author Stephen Crane and artist Frederick Remington, found little to report on when they arrived.

"There is no war," Remington wrote to his boss. "Request to be recalled."

Remington's boss, William Randolph Hearst, sent a cable in reply: "Please remain. You furnish the pictures, I'll furnish the war." Hearst was true to his word. For weeks after the Maine disaster, the Journal devoted more than eight pages a day to the story. Not to be outdone, other papers followed Hearst's lead. Hundreds of editorials demanded that the Maine and American honor be avenged. Many Americans agreed. Soon a rallying cry could be heard everywhere -- in the papers, on the streets, and in the halls of Congress: "Remember the Maine! To hell with Spain."

http://www.smplanet.com/imperialism/remember.html

More links....

http://www.iowanationalguard.com/Museum/IA_History/SA_War_Phil_Insurrection.htm

http://opmanong.ssc.hawaii.edu/filipino/benevolent.html

Didn't mean to go on so, but "Remember The Maine"? I don't think so.

How about "When the going gets tough, the tough get going"?

My message isn't about any particular historical event.

I don't want Dr. Paul's message to end because I believe our nation is at a tipping point.

 

[helmuth_hubener]

I'm sorry, but if you're a Mormon, you're not Christian. The two are incompatible because you are worshipping this Smith guy's super powers to translate golden plaques that nobody else saw. God warned about false prophets, and you can't claim to be a Christian and still follow the Mormon dogma.

LOL, I just shake my head and laugh. People get so blessedly worked-up in ignorant lather about things they know nothing about.

Pushing their own religious beliefs onto other people and defaming other people's religions is more important than advancing liberty, I guess

Well, actually it's because parocks proposed attacking Mormonism as an example of "taking off the gloves." Vis:

Yeah, we could rip apart Romney for his religion, and win. But we'd hurt your feelings. Oh, whatever shall we do.

Now everyone knows I'm Mormon. True blue, through-and-through. But considering your proposal dispassionately, I would be fine with the Ron Paul campaign doing this. I'd still stick with them 100%. So, believe it or not, I myself would encourage them to do this -- if it would work! You see, I really would love to see Ron Paul win, and I really want liberty, really bad. But that "if" is a Big If, and it's an if that I think the answer to, ultimately, is no. Everyone that can be made to hate Romney because he's Mormon already does. They already hate Mormons, and they already know Romney is Mormon. It's not as if Mormonism has been keeping a low profile lately. There's been that Texas raid on the break-off (so-called Fundamentalist) group, a successful HBO series about break-off Mormons practicing plural marriage, the Mormon connection in the gay marriage amendment in California, and on and on. The media mentions Romney's Mormon-ness fairly often, so it's not as if Ron would be revealing to voters something they didn't already know, nor even reminding them of something they'd forgot.

Basically, I conclude it would just make Ron look classless. It wouldn't be in character for him, plus it would be a flip-flop from the earlier position he took both last cycle and this one that Romney's religion shouldn't be an issue. It would of course lose him some support among Mormons. "Small group; we can afford to lose them," you may say, but there are more Mormons than Raw Milk Afficianados. For Ron, it's all about the principle of the thing, not the clout or size of the group. Ron will never abandon Mormons, just as he will never abandon the raw milk people. He stands on principles, integrity, and truth. I'm quite sure Ron sincerely does not think Romney's religion should be a problem nor an issue, and for him to say otherwise would just be dishonest political pandering. If Ron hasn't got principles, he hasn't got anything, and all his supporters Mormon or not would turn their backs on him. That would be the bigger result of it.

So, sorry to continue the off-topic detour, but I talked about the part of it that was somewhat on-topic -- how it could help Ron Paul -- and by showing it would actually hurt him I have hopefully ended that detour.

 

[asurfaholic]

I am really encouraged by these awesome finishes. The liberty movement is growing by leaps and bounds - WITHOUT the media's help. I am really pumped!

 

[sunsense]

Call it actually what it is 'VOTER FRAUD'.

And keep repeating it with the facts, far and wide.

 

[Wolfgang Bohringer]

Wow, Ron doesn't even know what states are next??

I know his "job" is just to deliver the message... but seriously, for him to be that detached from the game plan is really quite incredible.

And now he's pumping Romney?! WTF

I had seen the results on my wife's iphone driving home and we turned the TV on just in time to see Ron respond to Blitzer as you note here.

I was flabbergasted. He doesn't know where he's going from here? And he doesn't care and leaves it all in the hands of that marketing genius he's hired who jumps on the stage after the stump speeches and yells at everybody to line up properly to get their pictures?

The good thing to take out of this however is that at least one of the candidates is reading our threads and responding to our desperate pleas for q&a townhalls and access to the candidates. I read that Romney swooped into Maine a few days ago and setup Q&A town halls at large venues and really mixed it up with the people and proved that he wasn't afraid to put his ideas to the test.

At this point I have absolutely zero hope that Ron Paul will suddenly take an interest in which state he will be visiting tomorrow or that he will all of a sudden put his ideas to the test by confronting voters at town hall q&a meetings.

I can only chalk it up to the fact that there's this trait that goes along with the nerdy libertarian gene that's kind of a combination of laziness and an extreme lack of imagination especially with regard to selling products or oneself to other people in the marketplace--just my own personal theory.

And, yes I did see the "pumping" of Romney. All I can say is: "Bizarre".

He said something like "Romney's sitting nicely up there" and then they flashed it and left it up as a quote in text "Ron Paul: Romney sitting pretty..." or something like that. Very depressing.

 

[RonPaulMyPresident]

Mitt Romney arrives with his grandsons Joe, left, and Thomas to speak at a Republican caucus in Sanford, Maine, on Saturday.



Look at the background. All Ron Paul posters. Something is not right. Thought we had Maine

 

[parocks]

BIG QUESTION...

Why is Romney and Ron continueing with this truce if Romney just screwed Ron over in Maine? Doesn't make sense. Can't Romney let Ron have one win in their little truce?

I just heard that Romney if he didn't win was in real trouble. From who? Gingrich? he got 6%. Santorum. Maybe until he's vetted. No reason for Ron Paul to be nice to Mitt Romney now. We haven't been participating enough in the "circular firing squad". Fire Away.

 

[parocks]

LOL, I just shake my head and laugh. People get so blessedly worked-up in ignorant lather about things they know nothing about.

Well, actually it's because parocks proposed attacking Mormonism as an example of "taking off the gloves." Vis:

Now everyone knows I'm Mormon. True blue, through-and-through. But considering your proposal dispassionately, I would be fine with the Ron Paul campaign doing this. I'd still stick with them 100%. So, believe it or not, I myself would encourage them to do this -- if it would work! You see, I really would love to see Ron Paul win, and I really want liberty, really bad. But that "if" is a Big If, and it's an if that I think the answer to, ultimately, is no. Everyone that can be made to hate Romney because he's Mormon already does. They already hate Mormons, and they already know Romney is Mormon. It's not as if Mormonism has been keeping a low profile lately. There's been that Texas raid on the break-off (so-called Fundamentalist) group, a successful HBO series about break-off Mormons practicing plural marriage, the Mormon connection in the gay marriage amendment in California, and on and on. The media mentions Romney's Mormon-ness fairly often, so it's not as if Ron would be revealing to voters something they didn't already know, nor even reminding them of something they'd forgot.

Basically, I conclude it would just make Ron look classless. It wouldn't be in character for him, plus it would be a flip-flop from the earlier position he took both last cycle and this one that Romney's religion shouldn't be an issue. It would of course lose him some support among Mormons. "Small group; we can afford to lose them," you may say, but there are more Mormons than Raw Milk Afficianados. For Ron, it's all about the principle of the thing, not the clout or size of the group. Ron will never abandon Mormons, just as he will never abandon the raw milk people. He stands on principles, integrity, and truth. I'm quite sure Ron sincerely does not think Romney's religion should be a problem nor an issue, and for him to say otherwise would just be dishonest political pandering. If Ron hasn't got principles, he hasn't got anything, and all his supporters Mormon or not would turn their backs on him. That would be the bigger result of it.

So, sorry to continue the off-topic detour, but I talked about the part of it that was somewhat on-topic -- how it could help Ron Paul -- and by showing it would actually hurt him I have hopefully ended that detour.

Yeah. Winning elections. Sometimes you have to be nasty to win elections. We've been too nice. And I'm not saying that Mormonism is the most effective thing to kill Romney, but let's leave nothing off the table. Goldman Sachs is the top contributor to both Romney and Obama. Let's make Goldman Sachs the enemy, and get the populists, the Pat Buchanan types fired up. Do we like Bill Kristol and the Foreign Policy his dad brought to the Republican Party? No.

The bad guys aren't Romney, or Gingrich, or Santorum or Obama. They're Goldman Sachs and Bill Kristol. Rip them to shreds. Because, if we rip Goldman Sachs and Bill Kristol to shreds, them being ripped to shreds is a positive benefit for the world. Ripping Romney, etc to shreds only means that some other tool who isn't damaged as much'll be an adequate replaceable stand in.

 

[Babylon]

Lets just take all the delegates!

Yawn...

This delegate thing is getting old.
I'm just wondering...
When are we going to see posts about the Electoral College and how some super secret Ron Paul scheme will get them to vote him in?
I always like that stage of the mass delusion. Makes me giggle.

It ranks up there with the "boycott the MSM" stage. Ha. That one always gets me going. Nothing like a bunch of deluded souls thinking they can bend CNNFOXABCNBCCBS to their will by closing their eyes and putting fingers in their ears!

 

[helmuth_hubener]

Yeah. Winning elections. Sometimes you have to be nasty to win elections.... And I'm not saying that Mormonism is the most effective thing to kill Romney, but let's leave nothing off the table.

Agreed. Elections are, in a way, nothing but a legalized and regularized substitute for warfare.

There's a whole lot of stuff that's fair in war.

 

[Orgoonian]

Yawn...

This delegate thing is getting old.
I'm just wondering...
When are we going to see posts about the Electoral College and how some super secret Ron Paul scheme will get them to vote him in?
I always like that stage of the mass delusion. Makes me giggle.

It ranks up there with the "boycott the MSM" stage. Ha. That one always gets me going. Nothing like a bunch of deluded souls thinking they can bend CNNFOXABCNBCCBS to their will by closing their eyes and putting fingers in their ears!

 

[parocks]

I had seen the results on my wife's iphone driving home and we turned the TV on just in time to see Ron respond to Blitzer as you note here.

I was flabbergasted. He doesn't know where he's going from here? And he doesn't care and leaves it all in the hands of that marketing genius he's hired who jumps on the stage after the stump speeches and yells at everybody to line up properly to get their pictures?

The good thing to take out of this however is that at least one of the candidates is reading our threads and responding to our desperate pleas for q&a townhalls and access to the candidates. I read that Romney swooped into Maine a few days ago and setup Q&A town halls at large venues and really mixed it up with the people and proved that he wasn't afraid to put his ideas to the test.

At this point I have absolutely zero hope that Ron Paul will suddenly take an interest in which state he will be visiting tomorrow or that he will all of a sudden put his ideas to the test by confronting voters at town hall q&a meetings.

I can only chalk it up to the fact that there's this trait that goes along with the nerdy libertarian gene that's kind of a combination of laziness and an extreme lack of imagination especially with regard to selling products or oneself to other people in the marketplace--just my own personal theory.

And, yes I did see the "pumping" of Romney. All I can say is: "Bizarre".

He said something like "Romney's sitting nicely up there" and then they flashed it and left it up as a quote in text "Ron Paul: Romney sitting pretty..." or something like that. Very depressing.

I wouldn't know how to proceed at that moment if I was Ron Paul. Wolf asked a question about how great a shape Romney was in. Ron answered honestly. Who cares? We got fucked and I'd like to know what happened. How could we be flipping the results all over the place in Romneyland today and lose?

We were screwed delegate-wise in Portland, we had first hand explanations of that.

 

[happyphilter]

March on the convention! We can all carry our state flags flying under the Ron Paul banner symbolizing we are all united in one cause!

Seriously. I have no idea what the hell we are going to do. But I'm not going to quit or be grumps because of Maine. We just have to keep trying harder and harder at the grassroots level, the campaign is struggling and needs us more than ever.

 

[helmuth_hubener]

Nothing like a bunch of deluded souls thinking they can bend CNNFOXABCNBCCBS to their will by closing their eyes and putting fingers in their ears!

No need to bend CNNFOXABCNBCCBS. Just Fox. That's all Republican voters care about.

In the spirit of warfare and leaving nothing off the table (and since we don't have enough money to buy a 700 million dollar per year profit company): what can we do to harrass, disrupt, and destroy the operations of Fox News? Any ideas?

Some off the top of my head:

Old fashioned sabotage. Get big wire cutters and slice the power. Slice their tires. Make it generally impossible for them to function.
Technological hijinks. Hijack the feed to the satellite and cable providers. Do it only occasionally and subtlely and it may even take a long time for anyone to notice.
Get dirt on and blackmail one of the big personalities like O-Reilly, Hannity, Cavuto, etc. Perhaps we could hire a prostitute to do this?

Some of the more extreme ideas I'm having I won't mention.

 

[jolynna]

I don't care if Romney is Mormon or believes in Wicca or if he is an atheist.

The country is bankrupt.

Military expansion and a growing older population, plus looting our "trusts" for decades, along with borrowing and printing money out of thin air have us to the point of implosion.

Both the GOP and the Democratic parties are corrupt to the core (imo) and are owned by Wall Street bankers, corporate interests and a military industrial complex who will ALWAYS use, abuse and manipulate the populace to benefit themselves.

AS Ron Paul said in his speech today, WHAT Romney, Obama, Newt and Rick represent is the ANTITHESIS to EVERY belief and message he has been trying to get across to us for decades. NONE of THEM...not a one of them...according to Dr. Paul is not a polar opposite to him on every belief. The ONLY thing Dr. Paul said they MIGHT not be as bad about as Obama, might be taxes...and Dr. Paul said THAT in a very NOT heartfelt and feeble voice. He knows DARN WELL, that Republicans, Nixon (who started E.P.A., OSHA, Water environmental protection act & ending Brett Woods), Reagan, Bush 1 and Bush 2 were as into foolish government spending and growing the size of government as the Democratic. He (Ron Paul) even in an embarrassed voice added that Republicans and Democrats hadn't actually BEEN very different AFTER his choked-out attempt to say something good about his GOP competitors. They ARE all the SAME. Romney, Newt and Rick are probably NOT better than OBAMA. There is no way to know any one of them wouldn't be worse. Because of their stances on the issues, NOT their religious beliefs or LACK of them...imo.

Bottom line is the country is in serious trouble and the last thing of importance are the personal beliefs of whoever holds office.

I want to KNOW how any potential POTUS plans to handle the BIG issue.

What is HIS solution to a potential economic crisis should the contagion from Europe spread our way while we are SO VULNERABLE (from our decades of care-free spend, spend, spend & war, war, war & greedy banking corruption--which STILL hasn't been fixed--the banks are STILL doing what got them in trouble before. They just repackaged their products).

Only Ron Paul seems to have a clue about the seriousness of our situation. Only Ron Paul is NOT supporting Obama's taking away liberties that can be used to detain us should we become "rowdy" or "complain too much" about upcoming increased taxes and maybe eventually soup lines while BANKS AND CORPORATIONS get bailed out (for "our" good).

Ron Paul is OUR voice. He has been consistently spreading the message. Whatever happens, as long as he can go on, I think we should too.

 

[wgadget]

Mitt Romney arrives with his grandsons Joe, left, and Thomas to speak at a Republican caucus in Sanford, Maine, on Saturday.



Look at the background. All Ron Paul posters. Something is not right. Thought we had Maine

LOL, that is one funny pic.

 

[pauletteNV]

Walk a mile in his shoes and then complain

Sorry, I misunderstood what was quoted...removed

 

[jolynna]

Ron Paul didn't promote Romney.

He said Romney was politer to him. But he also said he disagreed with him on EVERY ISSUE. And that NONE OF HIS GOP contenders was better than the other. He said they were ALL the same. He could BARELY choke out that they might be better on taxes than Obama. And that was after some pressing from Wolf Blitzer and being cornered to come up with something NICE about one of his GOP opponents. And after reflecting on the compliment (that all 3 "might" be better on taxes than Obama) Dr. Paul TOOK EVEN that back in the next two sentences and said GOP and Democrats were actually the same and that THAT might not be true.

The sum of Ron Paul's opinion was that NONE of them, not Newt, not Rick, NOT the (politer to his face) Romney WAS ANY BETTER AT ANYTHING than Obama. He said all of THEM are war-mongers, spenders, government growers, deficit ignorers, guilty of approval of civil liberty assault and human rights violations, and that NONE was better than Obama about healthcare.

You'd expect a two-facer like Romney who almost has a split personality on issues (except about war, Romney has been consistent about being big on building up the military more, increasing military spending and adding more active duty troops and NOT being such a sissy as Obama in the middle east), to be polite to everybody's face. Everyone probably thinks they are Romney's friend. Two faced people, that can do 180 degree turns on vital issues at the blink of an eye, always smile when they betray you and stab you in the back.

 

[JWRIDDLER]

The results are somewhat disappointing but its still a long way too go to Tampa...Either way I will vote Ron Paul. I refuse to surrender my principals. Ron Paul or die!!

 

[Babylon]

No need to bend CNNFOXABCNBCCBS. Just Fox. That's all Republican voters care about.

In the spirit of warfare and leaving nothing off the table (and since we don't have enough money to buy a 700 million dollar per year profit company): what can we do to harrass, disrupt, and destroy the operations of Fox News? Any ideas?

Some off the top of my head:

Old fashioned sabotage. Get big wire cutters and slice the power. Slice their tires. Make it generally impossible for them to function.
Technological hijinks. Hijack the feed to the satellite and cable providers. Do it only occasionally and subtlely and it may even take a long time for anyone to notice.
Get dirt on and blackmail one of the big personalities like O-Reilly, Hannity, Cavuto, etc. Perhaps we could hire a prostitute to do this?

Some of the more extreme ideas I'm having I won't mention.

uh... Yeah...
I think that pretty much fits the definition of terrorism. Even the definition in use before the Patriot Act.
You might want to edit that post.
And chill out

Ron Paul will lose. Obviously.
So what?
Politics, liberty, the Constituion and all that are pretty trivial in the grand scheme of things.
As long as you can get laid now and again, life's pretty decent regardless of who is in office.