No more LP and Barr bashing.

[zahirakids]

I voted for Harry Browne. Then I voted for Buchanan on the Reform Party ticket. Then I voted for Peroutka on the Constitution Party ticket.

The LP hasn't earned my loyalty any more than the GOP has, and with Bob Barr as their nominee, it certainly seems unlikely that they will any time soon.

As another poster commented, where was the LP when we needed them to support Ron Paul during the primaries? We could have swept our state convention if the LP members in our state had temporarily switched party affiliation to vote for RP delegates. Only a handful did, and they have my respect, but the rest were too wrapped up in the LP culture of being perennial political losers to get behind a candidate who stood a good shot at winning our state-wide contest.

With their help, we could have delivered an entire state delegation for Ron Paul to the RNC, instead of just two votes. And now they want us to be good little party loyalists, hold our noses, and vote for the drug warrior Bob Barr and his neocon warmonger sidekick Wayne Allen (Kellogg, Brown and) Root?

I don't think so. Hell, they couldn't even get their shit together enough to get him on the ballot here anyway. Looks like it's another year of voting Constitution Party for me...

Like I said we were supporting Paul. The LP almost went bankrupt because all the Libertarians were donating to Paul instead of the LP.

 

[kathy88]

Looking in from another country, I see Barr as a political opportunist who is not interested in ideology. He does not speak passionately about libertarianism and he doesn't even understand that the reason Ron Paul has so much support is because what he preaches comes from his heart. That has been the case whether he was an unknown congressmen, considered to be a kook, fringe lunatic, only popular in his district OR a figure now wildly popular worldwide.

Ron Paul has earnt the trust he receives over 30+ years. On the other hand, Barr has a long record of voting as a right-wing reactionary. People do not change so easily, especially when they are adults and have ingrained personalities.

Barr's demeanor, his calculated oratory skills, his dark-framed glasses ..... these are the calling cards of a skilled politician and his tools of persuasion, not a dedicated ideologue. When Ron Paul speaks he fumbles with words, he does not attempt any form of superficial persuasion and his demeanor is that of a genuine human being that you would chat to in your neighborhood.

A further point regarding your website (which you have a link to in your signature) .... I find it quite amusing that your Vermont Libertarian Party celebrates the theory of Milton Friedman, a wall-street puppet and fake libertarian, who supports fiat currency and abuses people who support commodity standards as lunatics, people like Ron Paul. Milton Friedman is basically a counter-gang designed to wreck true libertarianism in the classic divide-and-conquer method, and guide true libertarians back into the jaws of imperialist government.

This is a well thought out, excellent post. I agree completely with your point about personality being ingrained. That is what we are up against.

 

[The_Orlonater]

That's a good idea! Keep running on the Libertarian ticket and keep loosing!
Unfortunatley, Ron Paul didn't win any primaries and didn't get the attention Fakebama and FakeCain. Do you want to just give up?

Look how much it has accomplished since 1972! Do we have more or less liberty now then in 1972?

Great, what a fucking stupid respponse. And how much media attention have we hadsince 1972? How many people took us seriously? The reason RP got us together because the government's fraud is easier to see now. Our dollar is worth nearly nothing. This war has cost us too much money.

Shit like this leads up over time.

Look at how much closer you are to having a candidate actually win!

Actually we are. The libertarian candidate is getting a lot of media attention was polling 6% nationally and double digits in some states. Since when did the libs do that? Barr may notbe perfect, but he's gotten us attention.
YES, MEDIA ATTENTION IS A GOOD THING.

My aunt was right, she said that you all would never get anywhere. She was with the Libertarian party for over two decades and finally got smart and left them!

Good for her. I don't care if you guys are defeatists.

Maybe Dr. Paul is smarter than you give him credit for. Maybe he knows it will take all that we have from every other party to actually get something done!! Maybe he is smart enough to know what it will take to WIN..!

I agree here, but he can't be voted for now.

You people may be ok with failure but I for one am not! It may be ok to you that your candidate makes a "good show of it" but I for one am ready to win this fight!

PAUL IS NOT ON THE BALLOT. The ballots where he's on are useless, because he can't win.

Go smoke your dope or crack or whatever and talk about how unfair the world is. Go kill your baby because it is "your choice and nobody can tell you what to do with your body" and then complain about all the other bad people in the world and how all the neocons children are so mean and wrong.

Such a smart and well thought out section of your post.
Go talk about how your party might actually raise $1 million dollars this time.., yay! That will bring this country back closer to the Great Republic it once was.....

America isn't really a libertarian country.

Go gripe about how the government wont let you do whatever you want with your money and time and labor and then gripe because the neocons have used all of their money, time and labor taking control of everything...

Don't forget the neo-liberals.

If you are so stuck on one man or one "party" that you can not set aside your petty differences with other men or political parties to advance the cause of LIBERTY, then please just Go............

He's not set on one party, he campaigned for RP. Since RP is out, he campaigns for Barr.

Get it?

 

[The_Orlonater]

We all have to face the facts. Ron Paul isn't going to be president. And there will never be another Ron Paul. At least not for another 20 years or more. By then, the Republicans and Democrats will have succeeded in total corruption of our federal, state and local governments.
The Constitution will have been destroyed by the North American Union, Patriot Act, and other things they will come up with.

And all this will happen because we are all debating stupid things, calling each other names like a bunch of kids.

Stop arguing and calling names. So what if you don't trust Barr. So what if you don't want a religious guy as president. So what if you disagree with someone else's choice for who they're supporting. Does that give you the right to slander and bash them for their choice?

Any one of the third party candidates is better than Obama & McCain. Is that so hard to realize? Is it so hard to not mention your thoughts about someone else's choice?

It's funny how an "anti-barr or anti-balwin" person who thinks that barr/baldwin doesn't have a chance to win, will spend so much time debating the falacies of Bob Barr or Chuck Baldwin.

And even if Ron Paul was to endorse Baldwin or Barr, half of us would start supporting Obama or McCain just to spite Ron Paul for not agreeing with him.

CHILDISH !!!!!!!!!!!!! to say the least.

+1776

Fucking trolls on these forums.

 

[MelissaCato]

+1776

fucking trolls on these forums.

+ 1000 :d

 

[reduen]

Could some of you people possibly be missing the point any more if you tried..?

It is not all about Dr. Paul. Have any of you even been listening to the good Dr. all this time?

I can not tell you how many times I have heard Dr. Paul say that is not about him and it is not the Ron Paul Revolution!?!?

 

[tonesforjonesbones]

I do not believe this was Ron Pauls idea. I've come to the conclusion that whoever is advising Ron Paul and Bob Barr need to get lost. The issue was between the handlers of the 2 men..not the men themselves and it turned into a cluster, therefore, I have decided to step back from the LP and C4L.

I have now decided to go with Palin ...even though I hate that she's hooked into the neo con foreign policy, I have some hope she can sway them toward drilling here in the usa, limited spending...cutting taxes for Americans. Ya'll have chosen to hate Palin now, but you sure didn't hate her months ago...what happened? I love Ron Paul but he should have endorsed ONE candidate and kept the movement together. Palin is the ONLY candidate that has said good things about Ron Paul. Alaska is a very libertarian state. I consider this is the ONLY chance we have of getting one of those Libertarian / Republicans into office. I'm quite sure the democrats and the GOP are happy that Ron Paul split the movement into 4 directions. I agree with the poster who said this forum is over run with juvenilles. Now I can't question C4L without someone throwing a tin foil hat at me. Tones

 

[tonesforjonesbones]

There is no way to recapture the feelings we had during the primaries while campaigning for Ron Paul. That is time gone by. I charish those great feelings of hope and excitement. We can't get it back. There will never be another Ron Paul. Ever. I charish the memories. C4L is not Ron Paul. It's Treavor Lyman, the dude who runs the Daily Paul, Don, Jesse Benton, etc..and those folks. Not being negative, just being realistic. Tones

 

[newyearsrevolution08]

There is no way to recapture the feelings we had during the primaries while campaigning for Ron Paul. That is time gone by. I charish those great feelings of hope and excitement. We can't get it back. There will never be another Ron Paul. Ever. I charish the memories. C4L is not Ron Paul. It's Treavor Lyman, the dude who runs the Daily Paul, Don, Jesse Benton, etc..and those folks. Not being negative, just being realistic. Tones

+1

 

[silverhandorder]

Both sides are silly. Instead of trying to fight for what strategy to pursue combine them. These things are not exclusive. The more traction 3rd parties get, Ron Paul's way, the better off Libertarian party is. We also have to recognize that LP has done far more for Ron Paul then other parties and support his ideology more then any other party. In this case they should get the most support. At the same time we all must recognize there are liberty minded people who do not fully support Paul's ideology, and would not vote LP if it was up to them. Then these people should be offered other choices, that will further ALL of us along. If socialist party follows Paul's 4 points from the conference, they are a much better choice then the major 2.

Bitching at each other either way is worse then sucking it up and acting like grown ups.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

Methinks thou art a neocon trying to subvert us! Naughty!

Barr has shown himself to be no true friend of the libertarian movement. If he goes back to a Paulian philosophy for at least 20 years, I'll reconsider my stance.

That's a good idea! Keep running on the Libertarian ticket and keep loosing!

Look how much it has accomplished since 1972! Do we have more or less liberty now then in 1972?

Look at how much closer you are to having a candidate actually win!

My aunt was right, she said that you all would never get anywhere. She was with the Libertarian party for over two decades and finally got smart and left them!

Maybe Dr. Paul is smarter than you give him credit for. Maybe he knows it will take all that we have from every other party to actually get something done!! Maybe he is smart enough to know what it will take to WIN..!

You people may be ok with failure but I for one am not! It may be ok to you that your candidate makes a "good show of it" but I for one am ready to win this fight!

Go smoke your dope or crack or whatever and talk about how unfair the world is. Go kill your baby because it is "your choice and nobody can tell you what to do with your body" and then complain about all the other bad people in the world and how all the neocons children are so mean and wrong.

Go talk about how your party might actually raise $1 million dollars this time.., yay! That will bring this country back closer to the Great Republic it once was.....

Go gripe about how the government wont let you do whatever you want with your money and time and labor and then gripe because the neocons have used all of their money, time and labor taking control of everything...

If you are so stuck on one man or one "party" that you can not set aside your petty differences with other men or political parties to advance the cause of LIBERTY, then please just Go............

 

[puppetmaster]

It is about the person, not the party. I supported Browne now I don't support Barr. I will support the ones I believe will support my values. So this year I am screwed

 

[MelissaCato]

Either way .. the CFR Media screwed us and Ron Paul from the beginning. They are the fault and that my friends will never be forgotten.

The Revolution continues ....................

 

[Yom]

i think my last post will probably be coming soon as well. It seems like this place and the daily paul have both been taken over by juvenile delinquents who are only becoming more and more of an embarassment to this movement. They have no substantive discussions to offer. All they can do is flame people with their immature responses. It's like holding a debate in a nursery. It's really a shame, too. There used to be true libertarian spirit of "live and let live" here. Sadly, this campaign for liberty is eroding into the "campaign to nowhere".

+1776.

 

[JosephTheLibertarian]

It is about the person, not the party. I supported Browne now I don't support Barr. I will support the ones I believe will support my values. So this year I am screwed

Do you support statism?

 

[Kludge]

Do you support statism?

Do you support the purchase of waffles from the International Waffle House?

 

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Do you support the purchase of waffles from the International Waffle House?

Yup. I like ihop

or is that a different establishment?

 

[ACUTS]

Bob Barr is a plant

by the Neo Cons...

you have been duped, the guy is an ex CIA, anti civil liberties, war mongering, baby killing(pays for his exes abortion and leaves her), psuedo moralist(Bill Clinton Impeachment), opportunist who is known to have a giant ego and be very close to the hawks in the GOP.

Go ask his staffers on capitol hill or anyone other staffers. I have, they know the guy, he is a sad sad pathetic individual.


The guy is a joke and should be kicked off the LP ballot and out of the party forever.

 

[ARealConservative]

by the Neo Cons...

you have been duped, the guy is an ex CIA, anti civil liberties, war mongering, baby killing(pays for his exes abortion and leaves her), psuedo moralist(Bill Clinton Impeachment), opportunist who is known to have a giant ego and be very close to the hawks in the GOP.

Go ask his staffers on capitol hill or anyone other staffers. I have, they know the guy, he is a sad sad pathetic individual.


The guy is a joke and should be kicked off the LP ballot and out of the party forever.

so Ron Paul is a fool as well?

 

[RP4EVER]

The topic of this post is Ironic......its ok for some to bash the CP and Chuck Baldwin; theres no one leaving over this.

But start saying Barr is a neo con and was an idiot for missing Ron Pauls press conference and gee the LP comes out of the woodwork up in arms.

Mods; since every post about Baldwin and the CP has been moved I ask that this one be taken off the Grassroots Central forum; or move a post regarding the CP to this board to provide equal and fair discussion.