Never forget what Conservatism truly is!

[torchbearer]

You're right torch, I can no longer in good faith support Ron Paul.

Fortunately, this place has shifted over to liberty forest. Still, I try to harp on neither RP nor his "supporters," until they feel the need to harp on myself or others who hold similar views.

We could expand this discussion, though I fear, it will stray far from the OP (of whom I will let speak for himself ).

Might be thread worthy...

I'm cool with the difference in opinion.

 

[Chosen]

He was one of the first congressmen to support Ronald Reagan's 1976 presidential campaign and was himself the presidential nominee of the Libertarian Party in 1988.

Paul was the first Republican representative from the area; he also led the Texas Reagan delegation at the national Republican convention.

Paul criticized Ronald Reagan as a failure and cited high deficits as exhibit A. On the ballot in 46 states and the District of Columbia while running as a Libertarian nominee.

His criticism was correct, under Reagan taxes had risen. The high defecits were mainly the result of defense spending as Reagan took to the "technology" defense strategy. One I supported and one which was proven to work, it bankrupted the Soviet Union and freed most of the former Soviet Republics without firing a shot. Well worth our support.

 

[The_Orlonater]

Yeah, well, most traditional conservatives that I know anyway, think there is only one kind. Neocons are not conservatives at all and quite frankly, I don't think those who refer to themselves as "social conservatives" are either. I had been gone from politics for awhile and I remember being really confused when I came back and saw all the references to "fiscal conservatives" and "social conservatives". Then I ran into "neoconservative" and had no idea what that was. But, I knew that nothing I believed had anything to do with the last two (social conservative and neoconservative). As I was trying to figure out what had happened in my absence, I ran into an article by another person who believed as I did. That is when I first heard the term, "paleocon". I finally figured it all out and the rest is history. It really jelled when I read Ron's speech, "Neo-conned".

In a nutshell, this is what I was raised with as the crux of traditional conservatism:

- limited government (adherence to the Constitution)
- states' rights
- fiscal responsibility
- personal privacy
- individual liberty
- strong national defense (not offense)
- personal responsibility

All in all, the traditional conservatives that I know, believe in self-government. But, we do believe that a very limited government has a place, for such things as national defense and to protect the rights of the minority, or the one, against the force of the majority. That said, what we have now bears little to no resemblance to the government that we want.

None of this BS that it's ok to use big government force, as long as it's being used to further an agenda, however unconstitutional, that YOU want forwarded. Because in my book that makes them exactly like their leftist brethren on the other side of the aisle.

States can be tyrannical.

 

[torchbearer]

States can be tyrannical.

So can your parents.
So can your boss... or anyone who has authority over you.
Even in anarcho-capitalism you will have tyrants.

 

[Chosen]

So can your parents.
So can your boss... or anyone who has authority over you.
Even in anarcho-capitalism you will have tyrants.

Correct, there is a sort of unintelligent belief which comes from anarchy, that thinks if there is a limitation on anything it is bad.

 

[Truth Warrior]

Correct, there is a sort of unintelligent belief which comes from anarchy, that thinks if there is a limitation on anything it is bad.

Anarchy = An (without) + archy(ruler aka leader).


http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=anarchy&searchmode=none

 

[torchbearer]

Anarchy = An (without) + archy(ruler aka leader).

How are you going to keep people from forming their mafias?
What happens when that mafia controls all the means of production in your area?
How can you FORCE everyone just to leave each other alone?

 

[Chosen]

You're right torch, I can no longer in good faith support Ron Paul.

Fortunately, this place has shifted over to liberty forest. Still, I try to harp on neither RP nor his "supporters," until they feel the need to harp on myself or others who hold similar views.

We could expand this discussion, though I fear, it will stray far from the OP (of whom I will let speak for himself ).

Might be thread worthy...

Then why don't you leave. You really present nothing more than sociopathic drivel. If you don't like a topic you begin spamming and trolling leaving filth in your wake. Then, like a true textbook sociopath when criticism rises against you, you begin to recruit and play calm in an attempt to make it appear as if you are being victimized. You really care nothing about anything other than winning. Your pity play, in whatever form it emerges as, manipulation of Josh Lowry on the phone, recruitment of other forums members or multiple logins doesn't hold anything to presenting yourself as anyone with common sense.

My guess is that it is a constant struggle for you to maintain. You are as stable as instability can be, lol. No other person on this forum has generated so many complaints as the result of your histrionics and sociopathy. "Josh Lowry" keeps you on here because he intends to try and sway the forum and consequently the message of Ron Paul, to take possession of it. This is why he ordered the mods not to apply any rules to you.

I wanted to bring this forward while you were on a polar swing cycle which is tamed.

 

[Chosen]

Anarchy = An (without) + archy(ruler aka leader).


http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=anarchy&searchmode=none

Pay closer attention next time. I stated it comes FROM anarchy.

To follow your idiotic lead:

from definition
http://www.yourdictionary.com/from
from (frum)

1.
1. beginning at (a point of departure as for motion, duration, or action) leaving from the station
2. at a certain distance away with respect to a mile from town
2. starting with (the first of two named limits) from noon to midnight
3. out of; derived or coming out of he took a comb from his pocket; lava spewed from the volcano
4. with (a person or thing) as the source, maker, sender, speaker, teacher, etc. a crate made from wood, a letter from Mary, facts learned from reading
5. at a place not near to; out of contact with: used to express absence, removal, separation, etc. away from danger, far from home
6. out of the whole of; out of unity or alliance with take two from four; he withdrew from the class
7. out of the possibility of; prevented or excluded with respect to kept from going on the hike
8. out of the possession or control of; free with respect to released from jail
9. as not being like: used to express difference, distinction, etc. to tell one sister from the other
10. because of; caused by; having the reason or motive of to tremble from fear

 

[Truth Warrior]

How are you going to keep people from forming their mafias?

Same way I do now.

What happens when that mafia controls all the means of production in your area?

Ask me again when it happens.

How can you FORCE everyone just to leave each other alone?

Same way I do now.

 

[torchbearer]

You aren't living in anarchy now, so you aren't doing anything to prevent the current mafia in dc.
And you won't do anything to prevent the mafias in anarchy.

Wait til the waste disposal guys come by for their protection money.
Let's see if TW has the balls to protect what is his against the tyranny of the majority that arises from his dream system.

 

[Truth Warrior]

Pay closer attention next time. I stated it comes FROM anarchy.

To follow your idiotic lead:

from definition
http://www.yourdictionary.com/from
from (frum)

1.
1. beginning at (a point of departure as for motion, duration, or action) leaving from the station
2. at a certain distance away with respect to a mile from town
2. starting with (the first of two named limits) from noon to midnight
3. out of; derived or coming out of he took a comb from his pocket; lava spewed from the volcano
4. with (a person or thing) as the source, maker, sender, speaker, teacher, etc. a crate made from wood, a letter from Mary, facts learned from reading
5. at a place not near to; out of contact with: used to express absence, removal, separation, etc. away from danger, far from home
6. out of the whole of; out of unity or alliance with take two from four; he withdrew from the class
7. out of the possibility of; prevented or excluded with respect to kept from going on the hike
8. out of the possession or control of; free with respect to released from jail
9. as not being like: used to express difference, distinction, etc. to tell one sister from the other
10. because of; caused by; having the reason or motive of to tremble from fear

The key word was FROM? < LMAO! > Well that's pretty conservative.

 

[The_Orlonater]

So can your parents.
So can your boss... or anyone who has authority over you.
Even in anarcho-capitalism you will have tyrants.

At least I can voluntarily leave from them. The State is always creeping and manifesting itself upon us. Take states like mine, New York, and Massachusetts for example.

 

[The_Orlonater]

How are you going to keep people from forming their mafias?
What happens when that mafia controls all the means of production in your area?
How can you FORCE everyone just to leave each other alone?

Mafias make money on illegal goods and services which forms an unstable and violent black market inadvertently(or maybe not) created by the government.
You should know, I shall guess that you are against the drug war.

 

[Chosen]

The key word was FROM? < LMAO! >

Actually you aren't laughing. I take it is desperate pain.

From anarchy we get many bizarre utopian ideas. But I think somewhere along the line you thought anarchy was tied to Libertarianism, it is a UTOPIAN idea. A pool of nonsense from which many potential DSM ranked political maladies emanate.

 

[torchbearer]

At least I can voluntarily leave from them. The State is always creeping and manifesting itself upon us. Take states like mine, New York, and Massachusetts for example.

In the intended setup, you would have 50 competing state governments to choose from...
The federal government was suppose to be limited in power, and the states were suppose to assure that.
This changed in 1865.
The republic of republics was conquered by Lincolns army of northern aggression.

 

[Truth Warrior]

Actually you aren't laughing. I take it is desperate pain.

From anarchy we get many bizarre utopian ideas. But I think somewhere along the line you thought anarchy was tied to Libertarianism, it is a UTOPIAN idea. A pool of nonsense from which many potential DSM ranked political maladies emanate.

"Spin it" however you wish. Whatever gets you through the night.

Well if you check the provided link more closely you MAY just be able to find it.

Here it is again. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/libertarian
Scroll down some.

 

[AuH20]

Actually you aren't laughing. I take it is desperate pain.

From anarchy we get many bizarre utopian ideas. But I think somewhere along the line you thought anarchy was tied to Libertarianism, it is a UTOPIAN idea. A pool of nonsense from which many potential DSM ranked political maladies emanate.

How do you preserve liberty without order? Thats the huge hole in their line of thinking. In theory, the promulgation of "liberty" at every turn, sounds all well and good until its actually applied to flesh and blood human beings.

 

[Truth Warrior]

Hint:

"Freedom, Peace and Prosperity" -- Ron Paul

 

[Chosen]

How do you preserve liberty without order? Thats the huge hole in their line of thinking. In theory, the promulgation of "liberty" at every turn, sounds all well and good until its actually applied to flesh and blood human beings.

I agree with you, but this is something the anarchists don't get. "Utopian" societies end up being the most authoritarian.