Neocons welcome?

I think Lipo is high as a kite, and likes Dr. Paul because he would decriminalize drugs. Welcome to the Revolution! :)
 
Do you realize the country is 9 trillion dollars in depth? The economy is not doing well, it is about to tank.

It is hard to convince someone with views like you have. I know since I used to hold the views you did only 3 months ago. It took a semester of in depth research for me to realize just how disastrous this Iraq war (and war in general) and the policy of intervention is.

Btw, Alan Greenspan said himself that the Fed Reserve is not necessary anymore.

I suggest you seriously study these types of issues, cause if you do you know your views will rapidly change. Almost all foreign countries oppose our foreign policy and Iraq war.
 
Lipo said:
I think Dr. Paul could be rationally persuaded to change his mind. I sincerely hope he shows the humility and confidence to deduce when he is wrong, as I am convinced he would eventually conclude if he were elected.

A few things I really like about Ron Paul: A desire to enforce immigration law. Nothing fancy, just do it. A nice wall would be dandy, even if unsightly and unpopular.

I like Dr. Paul's veneration of the US Constitution as the supreme authority on the size and scope of the US government and that its meaning is quite clear.
Click to expand...

That is where you're wrong.

Ron Paul has stood by his positions for over 30 years and he won't ever back down to make the misinformed or the ignorant happy.

Ron Paul stands for freedom and the constitution. He believes the federal government has too much power and needs to be restricted and more power should be given to the states.

As I have said, look up Ron Paul. I don't believe you have researched his positions very much or at all.
 
guys dont be mean... he just hasnt opened his eyes all the way yet...

send him some videos in a PM to watch about the war or on the gold standard or the other things he disagrees with

we need to inform him, he is already receptive to freedom and the constitution...
he just needs that extra push. we were all right there along side him at one point til we saw the truth...
 
Lipo,

Welcome to the forum. This would be a good opportunity for everyone to read the forum guidelines, which include:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=22

+ Promoting agendas alternate to the platform of Dr. Paul will have allowances for established members. Controversial topics should focus on facts whenever possible.
Click to expand...


So what this means is that there is room for dialog so long as it doesn't become too much of a distraction for the purpose of the forum, getting Dr. Paul elected. A few pointers to help out, another guideline states:

+ Off-topic posts - Posts that do not relate to the threads intent are subject to being deleted.
Click to expand...

So this would mean to be careful to hijack a thread to promote an alternative agenda. This isn't to say that one shouldn't post up to counter bad information with good information that better centers a discussion on facts.

There is room for honest discussion on foreign policy and economic policies in the "Liberty Forest" area- each of these have it's own sub-forum to foster on-topic discussion. When posting here the threads should try to stay on-topic and be based on facts. It's possible to present and discuss facts without declaring something is superior out of the gate. We also have a "Hot Topics" sub-forum for issues that are controversial. If you want to start a thread proclaiming "The Fed is great" - that's one for Hot Topics.


Let's not try to cover all these issue here and now, OK?


:)
 
We have people from all political walks coming to join Ron Paul's freedom march, it's truly an American revolution transcending all sorts of boundaries. But 'neocons' are a radical fringe advocating over interventionism in foreign countries militarily and with world view not traditionally aligned with that of the mainstream conservatives. Bush administration allowed them to shape direction of foreign policy as an alliance of interests formed but most conservatives who supported Iraq war few years ago are not ideologically neocons and were truly misled. Bush/Cheney administration helped create an atmosphere of fear post 9/11 where neocons' agenda could be executed without much opposition. Many Americans who may have been on same side as neocons on war issue early on have realized the mistake of that policy and are joining Ron Paul. But I will be surprised if any of the ideological neocons have had a change of religion and are joining Ron Paul camp. They are still lobbying for more wars and often behind smear attacks on Ron Paul using their cohorts in media. They may have been a powerful fringe but luckily with shrinking influence as more and more Americans see through their agendas.


http://www.csmonitor.com/specials/neocon/neocon101.html
 
Lipo said:
As an avowed supporter of the War in Iraq and a friend of Israel, I seem to closely resemble the stereotype of "neocon" as I've seen it defined on these forums. I support George W. Bush, the Federal Reserve and its monetary policy, see no good reason to return to the gold standard, and regard Iran as an existential threat not simply to Israel but to the the United States and Europe.
Click to expand...

Ron Paul is actually very pro-Israel. See what Ron Paul and Glenn Beck had to say about Israel and Iran:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIy82pzijow


Lipo said:
I appear to stand in direct opposition to nearly every single foreign policy and economic policy proscription Dr. Ron Paul offers as part of his candidacy for President of the United States, save one.
Click to expand...

By saying that you stand in direct opposition to nearly every single economic policy of Dr. Paul would imply that you oppose free market economics. Dr. Paul's "extremism" comes from his wish to have our money backed by something concrete and his opposition to government meddling with the market, hence his dislike for the Federal Reserve. Other than that, Dr. Paul is a strong, strong advocate for open and free market economies. To say that you strongly disagree with Dr. Paul's economic policies would imply that you disagree with open and free market economics.


Lipo said:
I appreciate, support and admire Dr. Ron Paul's veneration of the US Constitution and of his desire that the US government closely and accurately abide by it.
Click to expand...

:cool:

Lipo said:
Question: Will Ron Paul accept me as a supporter? Would he mind if I openly advocate my point of view on this forum, even as diametrically opposed (with one exception) as it is to his own?
Click to expand...

Of course he would accept you...if you are indeed a supporter. Foreign policy is the big, big issue with which the neoconservatives disagree with Ron Paul....and many will not consider a "cut and run" strategy from the mid east.

However, there are some conservatives who disagree with Dr. Paul but have thrown their support behind him anyways:



"After thinking about it quite a bit I have decided to vote/support Ron Paul.

I have never really liked him all that much for many reasons but after giving it careful consideration I have come to the reluctant conclusion that he is the only one to vote for.

A couple of months ago I would have told you that he is very right on 75% of the issues and very wrong on 25% and the 25% was a deal breaker.

After mulling it over I have reversed my thinking and have concluded that that if we have to compromise it is better to compromise on the 25% of the kooky things Paul supports than the 100% of the things the other big government candidates supports.

These are my reasons:

1. If we don’t get control of this budget the cost of government is going to kill us all and we will get very few useful things for our trouble. We are going to the poor house folks because we don't really produce anything anymore and we owe our souls to the Chinese and the oil producing Arabs. We have spent a lot more money than we made and soon it will time to pay the piper. Paul is the only candidate that has any credibility on actually reducing the size of government.

2. We can’t continue to have the focal point of our foreign policy to insure that the Israelis live well. We need to stop it right now and extract ourselves from the biggest foreign policy blunder this country ever made.

3. We need to stop these wars of intervention. Our business needs to be business instead of bombing Christians, bombing Muslims and going after warlords in Somalia or whatever.

4. It is time that we start reading the Constitution and understanding what freedom is all about instead of catering to every goddamn special interest group in America.

I understand that supporting Paul will cause us to cut and run from Iraq and that is not good. However, that is not our biggest problem right now by far. The biggest problem is the mountain of debt and the erosion of Constitutional freedoms. We will be hurt in the long run a lot more by the road to Socialism than by terrorists.

The rest of the Republican pack is nothing more than big government neocons that will not serve us well. Of course the Democrats are even worse."
 
Mattsa said:
The constitution says America should not involve itself in foreign entanglements
Click to expand...

Strictly speaking, I do not recall the constitution saying anything about this directly. Washington and other founding fathers advocated non-interventionism. They were especially skeptical of getting involved with European powers.

Read Washington's farewell address. This comes right after he admonishes us to "cherish the public credit" -- ie. don't borrow too much:

Observe good faith and justice towards all nations; cultivate peace and harmony with all.
Click to expand...

And it continues to explain in detail precisely the problems interventionist policies create. In fact, he goes beyond non-interventionism and advocates a neutrality of heart by warning against maintaining "affections" for other nations. It's serious stuff, to be taken seriously.
 
I disagree with Ron Paul on some issues as well. However, if there's one amazing thing about Ron Paul, it's this.

No matter what you disagree with him on, as a president who abides completely by the Constitution, he will follow it word for word. That means he will NEVER, ever, try to impose his views on you and try to take away your right to believe in what you wish!
 
We have people from all political walks coming to join Ron Paul's freedom march, it's truly an American revolution transcending all sorts of boundaries. But 'neocons' are a radical fringe advocating over interventionism in foreign countries militarily and with world view not traditionally aligned with that of the mainstream conservatives. Bush administration allowed them to shape direction of foreign policy as an alliance of interests formed but most conservatives who supported Iraq war few years ago are not ideologically neocons and were truly misled. Bush/Cheney administration helped create an atmosphere of fear post 9/11 where neocons' agenda could be executed without much opposition. Many Americans who may have been on same side as neocons on war issue early on have realized the mistake of that policy and are joining Ron Paul. But I will be surprised if any of the ideological neocons have had a change of religion and are joining Ron Paul camp. They are still lobbying for more wars and often behind smear attacks on Ron Paul using their cohorts in media. They may have been a powerful fringe but luckily with shrinking influence as more and more Americans see through their agendas.


http://www.csmonitor.com/specials/neocon/neocon101.html
Click to expand...


But if there is such change of heart in that original ideological constituency, anyone is welcome to Ron Paul's camp, it's got a big tent. Ron Paul is not a divider but his leadership brings people together.
 
Mole, Mole, Mole, Mole...

Ignore this guy, ignore his post. Obviously a baiting Troll and does not belong here nor does he deserve the rapid post count and replys he will get if you continue to sponsor his bullshit and attempt to counter his bullshit propaganda against Dr. Paul.

Kick his ass like a little green football.
 
Lipo said:
As an avowed supporter of the War in Iraq and a friend of Israel, I seem to closely resemble the stereotype of "neocon" as I've seen it defined on these forums. I support George W. Bush, the Federal Reserve and its monetary policy, see no good reason to return to the gold standard, and regard Iran as an existential threat not simply to Israel but to the the United States and Europe.

I think foreign interventionism as a means of maintaining regional and global stability is desireable. Invading Iraq and deposing Saddam Hussein was an entirely good thing. The US economy is not going to collapse and is in fact, wealthier and more productive than it has ever been before.

Dr. Paul's open association with anti-semitism and racism is particularly offensive.

I appear to stand in direct opposition to nearly every single foreign policy and economic policy proscription Dr. Ron Paul offers as part of his candidacy for President of the United States, save one.

I appreciate, support and admire Dr. Ron Paul's veneration of the US Constitution and of his desire that the US government closely and accurately abide by it.

Question: Will Ron Paul accept me as a supporter? Would he mind if I openly advocate my point of view on this forum, even as diametrically opposed (with one exception) as it is to his own?
Click to expand...

Anyone can be helped, but first you have to want help.
Admitting you are wrong and have been deceived is a start.
Educate yourself. http://www.ronpaullibrary.org/
Then we can discuss the state of our Country.
 
Lipo,

You also have to understand that if the American people and the Congress and the Senate WANTS to continue the interventionist strategy.....it WILL happen. Ron Paul's attractiveness do not come from so much as his personal beliefs...but his beliefs in the rule of the law.

He is a representative to the voice of the nation. If the Congress declares formal war on Iran, Ron Paul would show 100% support. Even if he personally disagrees with it.

His strength comes not from his own view points but from the Constitution.
 
Lipo said:
But I am open to persuasion as I hope you will be open to my own.
Click to expand...

Lipo, welcome to the board. It is the above comment that concerns me. It sounds as if you intend to use this forum to preach against practically every one of Dr. Paul's platforms. Quite frankly, it isn't the place to do that, and I urge everyone here not to waste precious time going back and forth with Lipo.

We are a much more open forum, and you've already been here eons longer than many of us were allowed on other forums such as Hannity's. That said, you're a hair's breath away from ending up on my "ignore" list.

If you truly support him, great, but keep in mind stirring the pot in this forum won't help him get elected.

I will also join in the call for moving this thread to the far reaches of the forum.
 
Lipo, hypothetically, if a war funded by US tax payers served interests of Isreal but damaged US interests, will you support it or oppose it?
 
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