Neocons former Democrats?

[LibertyEagle]

NEOCONS:

1. They agree with Trotsky on permanent revolution, violent as well as intellectual.
2. They are for redrawing the map of the Middle East and are willing to use force to do so.
3. They believe in preemptive war to achieve desired ends.
4. They accept the notion that the ends justify the means…that hard-ball politics is a moral necessity.
5. They express no opposition to the welfare state.
6. They are not bashful about an American empire; instead they strongly endorse it.
7. They believe lying is necessary for the state to survive.
8. They believe a powerful federal government is a benefit.
9. They believe pertinent facts about how a society should be run should be held by the elite and withheld from those who do not have the courage to deal with it.
10. They believe neutrality in foreign affairs is ill-advised.
11. They hold Leo Strauss in high esteem.
12. They believe imperialism, if progressive in nature, is appropriate.
13. Using American might to force American ideals on others is acceptable. Force should not be limited to the defense of our country.
14. 9-11 resulted from the lack of foreign entanglements, not from too many.
15. They dislike and despise libertarians (therefore, the same applies to all strict constitutionalists.)
16. They endorse attacks on civil liberties, such as those found in the Patriot Act, as being necessary.
17. They unconditionally support Israel and have a close alliance with the Likud Party.

-Ron Paul (R)

 

[nullvalu]

I wouldn't call Reagan a neocon. ie. I don't think he was one.

People tend to forget he granted amnesty to 3 million illegal aliens.

 

[chopdave]

Paul Wolfowitz and Richard Perle were democrats back in the 70's.

 

[they walked in line]

Justin Raimondo's book Reclaiming the American Right: The Lost Legacy of the Conservative Movement is essential reading for someone who wants to understand neo-conservatism.

Here is a very informative radio interview from a few years ago where Justin talks about the history of the neo-conservative movement.

 

[LibertyEagle]

http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/2001/08-13-2001/vo17no17_neoconservatism.htm
http://antiwar.com/raimondo/book1.html
http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/2001/08-13-2001/vo17no17_neoconservatism.htm
http://www.lewrockwell.com/rockwell/neo-con-explained.html
http://www.lewrockwell.com/dmccarthy/dmccarthy23.html
http://www.alternet.org/story/15935

This is interesting...
http://72.3.247.199/IUser/42/streams/829/Hultberg122006.mp3

 

[Delaware]

Over the past 50 years or so, the whole political spectrum has moved farther towards the left.

Todays conservatism is much different than the conservatism of, lets say, the 1950s.

Same goes with liberalism. Liberalism today, on a whole, is much closer than socialism than it used to be.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Over the past 50 years or so, the whole political spectrum has moved farther towards the left.

Todays conservatism is much different than the conservatism of, lets say, the 1950s.

Same goes with liberalism. Liberalism today, on a whole, is much closer than socialism than it used to be.

Well, the conservative movement was hijacked by the ex-trotskyite, statist, neocons. Now, that they have successfully taken it over, they are trying to do away with the name "neoconservative". Which by the way, they gave to themselves.

Traditional conservatism is still the same as it always was. A lot of the traditional conservatives left the Republican party in disgust and are all over the place. Independents, members of the Constitution Party and a few, members of the Liberarian party. Some stayed with the Republican party, hoping to bring it back. And some have been so propagandized by FOX news,etc., that they have forgotten their principles. Dr. Paul is trying to get them to remember.

 

[Delaware]

I wish traditional conservatism was more popular, if it was actually put to use in the Republican party, i dont think we'd have lost seats this past year.

I'm only 18 years old, but i think ive found my true political ideology, and that is traditional or paleoconservatism.

 

[klamath]

I wish traditional conservatism was more popular, if it was actually put to use in the Republican party, i dont think we'd have lost seats this past year.

I'm only 18 years old, but i think ive found my true political ideology, and that is traditional or paleoconservatism.

You are the future of the party! You will make it happen.

 

[Brandybuck]

I'm half way through reading "Radicals for Capitalism". Some of the history of the conservative movement is expanded in Rothbard's "Betrayal of the American Right". Basically, the Old Right was generally libertarian, capitalist and anti-interventionist. Many were also against government involvement in domestic social matters. The Great Depression and WWII had expanded the size of US government to leviathan levels, and the Right wanted to roll back FDR's socialism.

After WWII, the conservative movement started breaking up. The biggest factor was communism. The New Right wanted to stop communism around the world, by any means necessary. The Old Right wanted to go back to a pre-WWI policy of neutrality. The New Right gained ascendance. Neo-conservatism was one small branch of the New Right, but as a highly ideological faction, they increasingly came to write the conservative's playbook.

 

[nullvalu]

Now, that they have successfully taken it over, they are trying to do away with the name "neoconservative". Which by the way, they gave to themselves.

What do they want to be called? Or do they just want to blend in with true conservatives?

 

[purplechoe]

What do they want to be called? Or do they just want to blend in with true conservatives?

Just like Hillary wants to be called progressive because being a liberal has gotten a bad rap lately.

 

[LibertyEagle]

What do they want to be called? Or do they just want to blend in with true conservatives?

Yes.

 

[Thom1776]

Hmmm... Wasn't Rudy a Democrat in a previous life?

 

[purplechoe]

Hmmm... Wasn't Rudy a Democrat in a previous life?

He's still is. Just wants to bomb Iran, unlike the other democrats, the people not the candidates who are open to the idea.

 

[Delaware]

I can't believe how gullible the Republican masses are....

Mitt Romney, governor of Massachussetts, one of the most liberal states in the nation.

Rudy Guiliani, mayor of New York city, one of the most liberal cities in the nation.

John McCain, a moderate republican, so basically hes a progressive.

Fred Thompson, a member of the CFR, trying to make himself the true conservative, but i see through the BS.

or

Ron Paul, constitutionalist, small government, true conservatism.

 

[Geronimo]

Mitt, Rudy, McCain, Thompson, Obama, Clinton, Dodd, Edwards, and Richardson are all members of the CFR.

 

[nullvalu]

Justin Raimondo's book Reclaiming the American Right: The Lost Legacy of the Conservative Movement is essential reading for someone who wants to understand neo-conservatism.

Welcome to the forum.. "they walked in line" - very good song by Joy Division.

 

[Corydoras]

I might be walking into a buzzsaw here, but Strauss gets a bad reputation. His academic work is kind of like a loaded gun - it is a tool that is only as dangerous as the guy using it. Some of Strauss' followers have made important contributions against the ills of PC and groupthink in higher learning.

No, I agree that, for example, Alan Bloom's "Closing of the American Mind" was a valuable effort. I have read that Strauss taught different things to different graduate students...!

 

[Spike Kojima]

The Power of Nightmares shines a pretty good light on the history of the neocons.
This is one of those films that I feel every American must see.

The Power of Nightmares Part 1
The Power of Nightmares Part 2
The Power of Nightmares Part 3

Wow, very revealing, we all need to see this.