Man tells cops they can't enter without a warrant, they kick in door, kill him.

[tod evans]

Dogs, perimeter defense and booby-traps will not be tolerated in a citizens quest for peaceful sleep.

Self defense or resistance will of course be met by deadly force.

The "right" of the people to be secure in their homes has been superseded.......

 

[fisharmor]

I could have said "The game is broken by design"......:o

I would still respectfully disagree with that statement.

Consider the debate about waterboarding in recent years. The people defending the practice repeatedly said that it is not torture. Those opposing the practice pointed out that it absolutely is torture. Some of them even dared to question why we are torturing people at all.

When you accept the fact that police exist and accept the fact that they are going to do the job that they are going to do, what is effectively stating " well we are only using thumb screws here! Other countries have breaking wheels. See how much better we are for only using thumb screws?"

Nothing is going to change about waterboarding because we lost that debate to people who are claiming that it's not actually torture. And nothing is going to happen about police because we are losing the debate - here on this very forum - about the nature of police.

It doesn't matter how many rules you put into place, and it doesn't matter how many cops you prosecute. The fundamental job of the police is to do exactly the thing in this article. If you take away the power to kick in somebody's door and murder him and not face repercussions, you are no longer talking about police.

In order to get anywhere with this, we're going to have to get rid of this attitude that there is somehow a way to fix this. The game isn't rigged, the game isn't broken, it's doing exactly what it is supposed to do. The only possible way to change this is to decide that we just don't want to play it anymore.

Eta Todd that wasn't really aimed at you, but at others in the thread.

 

[TheTexan]

Instead of getting upset on a forum I suggest doing something productive to change it, like voting, for example

 

[TheTexan]

Good citizens should welcome 3AM tasings with total compliance...

Compliance & appreciation

 

[RJB]

Good citizens should welcome 3AM tasings with total compliance...

Russian stim is really good for muscle tone. It's an unnatural reaction to try to remove metal prongs stuck inside you to stop volts of electricity pulsing through you.

 

[TheTexan]

The 4th amendment (I think its the 4th anyway) is mistakenly thought sometimes that it applies to police, however it only applies to unlawful searches. If a police officer conducted the search, it is by definition not unlawful

 

[Ronin Truth]

In interactions with police:

Rule # 1 - Survive.

 

[phill4paul]

In interactions with police:

Rule # 1 - Survive.

And how does one do that?

 

[Leaning Libertarian]

Is this really the mountain you want to die on? Livingston was an idiot, and Darwin caught up with him. Police would not have been there without a call to service. Courts have repeatedly upheld Assault reports validate warrantless entry for the imminent exigency potential. The police do not have a crystal ball to determine what is and is not going on related to the alleged assault, without investigating. Given the supposed suspect is reported to not have even been there, upon such investigation, Livingston would still be alive if he wasn't so damn stupid. If he was going to violently uphold his right to warrantless entry, at least he should have been right.

 

[Ronin Truth]

And how does one do that?

Don't give the cops any crap. Cooperate, do not challenge nor confront.

Be as intelligent as possible. At least that's how I would do it.

 

[Origanalist]

Don't give the cops any crap. Cooperate, do not challenge nor confront.

Be as intelligent as possible. At least that's how I would do it.

It would probably help if you piddled a little too.

 

[phill4paul]

Don't give the cops any crap. Cooperate, do not challenge nor confront.

Be as intelligent as possible. At least that's how I would do it.

Yes, following police commands will insure your safety.

 

[osan]

Find their names.

Hunt them.

Dispatch proper justice.

 

[osan]

Only cops can "fear for their lives" when it comes to being tased.

Funny, that.

 

[osan]

Lye enemas are too kind!

How about super-saturated alum?

Yes, I am Eeeville.

 

[osan]

Examples like this illustrate the need for armored doors and frames.

They way I make them, nothing short of explosives will take the door in. A few thousands of dollars may seem like a lot, but how much is your life worth? Bet this guy never say Mr. Death coming, eh?

 

[Origanalist]

Examples like this illustrate the need for armored doors and frames.

They way I make them, nothing short of explosives will take the door in. A few thousands of dollars may seem like a lot, but how much is your life worth? Bet this guy never say Mr. Death coming, eh?

Obviously not. 3:30 in the morning, asleep with your family and Mr. Death knocks. "Who ya gonna call, a crack dealer...?"

 

[SeanTX]

Examples like this illustrate the need for armored doors and frames.

They way I make them, nothing short of explosives will take the door in. A few thousands of dollars may seem like a lot, but how much is your life worth? Bet this guy never say Mr. Death coming, eh?

It's also an example of why you shouldn't open your door up to anyone you don't know, esp at 3am. Like that old saying about "nothing good ever happens after midnight" -- nothing good is going to come from opening up your door to somebody you don't know then either.

IIRC correctly he opened it up, then told them they had the wrong person and to come back with a warrant and then he shut the door in their faces.

When you're dealing with .gov Enforcer goons all that is going to do is send them into a contempt of cop rage.

He might have had a chance if he had just talked to them through the closed door, and explained that they were looking at the wrong place. Of course, there was still no guarantee that they wouldn't have kicked the door in anyway, but they might have had least thought about it first, using what little reasoning ability they tend to have.

 

[osan]

[N]othing is going to happen about police because we are losing the debate - here on this very forum - about the nature of police.

Nonsense. We can start sending police home, tits-up, any time we want.

It ain't over 'till it's over.

 

[TheTexan]

Don't give the cops any crap. Cooperate, do not challenge nor confront.

Be as intelligent as possible. At least that's how I would do it.

Indeed, always let them search your trunk. Its not like you have illegal weapons in your trunk, ... Right?